Does "rape culture" really exist?

[philmonroe]

Breh, you can't keep waving the banner of racism to solidify this argument. We can do this all day. Are there are lot of terrorists? Sure. Are they all muslim? Nah. Are there a lot of muslim
terrorists? Presumably, yes. But the culture of terrorism is the fringe, and a lot more layered than "We like to kill...so we do."

Are there rapists? YES. Just as your anecdote goes, lots more women than men realize have been raped, or at the very least put into a compromising situation. My mom was raped
when she was young, and one thing I think she understood, it wasn't a societal reason, it was that guy being a massive dikk who took advantage of a young'n.

Rape culture is not a thing. Rape also isn't exclusive to male activities, much less male on female. It's one of the societal ills that plague us, and unfortunately there is no real way to stop
it. We expect good and bad people to do bad things, even when we least expect it. The primary argument for a "rape culture" seems to want to direct itself toward misogyny, as that is
the root of what plagues the issues. A guy who thinks less of women (global issue, and you can argue its a culture in certain groups) is very likely to push the envelope at some point.
There is no "culture of rape", but there are sickos who find superiority in having a penis, and see women as a means to entertain himself. There is no culture surrounding rape, there are only
circumstances and cultures that MAY INCLUDE rape. Most men are not out here trying to take it by any means, much less conduct themselves in a way where women should feel
threatened at his very presence. This is nonsense, breh. Even if you stomped out the very systems that would foster an Elliot Rodgers-like cabal, that doesn't stop the seemingly normal
guy who one day decides to slip something in a woman's drink, or the pervert who grooms girls to lay with him, or the father who takes a disturbing interest in his own daughter.

People don't need a "culture" to do horrific things, but you can't tie the incidences of those horrific things together as if they are linked.

Yeah I fukk with the whole post but definitely bold. This stuff makes me question do cats actually live real lives that don't revolve around their job and online. Where is this rape culture in their circle if its sooooo prevalent? Hell even on here you see so many dudes not trying to "creep" or "weird" a chick out but now a lot of these same dudes are now part of rape culture too. FOH this is all junk people who like wasting time want to kick. Nobody condoning rape or anything that resembles rape period that I know from family on down and I'm pretty sure its the same for everybody on here. People out here with their disingenuous talking points need to stop it.

 

[VegasCAC]

@CinnaSlim in your opinion what constitutes rape? We all know the most basic, physical struggle definition, but where do you believe consent begins and ends? Does it have to be vocalized? Must it be when you're sober? Is "hard to get" not a real thing?

 

[At30wecashout]

Yeah I fukk with the whole post but definitely bold. This stuff makes me question do cats actually live real lives that don't revolve around their job and online. Where is this rape culture in their circle if its sooooo prevalent? Hell even on here you see so many dudes not trying to "creep" or "weird" a chick out but now a lot of these same dudes are now part of rape culture too. FOH this is all junk people who like wasting time want to kick. Nobody condoning rape or anything that resembles rape period that I know from family on down and I'm pretty sure its the same for everybody on here. People out here with their disingenuous talking points need to stop it.

Yea, man. I had an unfortunate experience myself as a shorty, so I definitely get the concerns people have. I just don't understand why people see smoke and assume
it is fire.

Sexual assaults are very real and very common, but not because there is this "tee-hee" behind closed doors in which people try to normalize rape. Misogyny is a different thing, and
usually thats the real target that folks want to combat, but a "culture of rape" is ridiculous. Now are there some groups that might partake in that bullshyt? I don't doubt it.
But a culture???? An ENTIRE culture? Nah, B.

 

[SunZoo]

This shyt y'all cats that spend too much time online be on. Ain't no fukking rape culture. Bet most of you cats don't even see this shyt in y'all real life offline but there is some culture please. nikka using some random ass Elliot Rodgers weirdo to make that out to be the majority of guys and you a guy? Man some of you cats be lost like shyt smfh

I touched on my personal experiences with this in this thread. And where did I make out the majority guys out to be Elliot Rodgers? If that's all you got from that post you missed the point.

 

[philmonroe]

Yea, man. I had an unfortunate experience myself as a shorty, so I definitely get the concerns people have. I just don't understand why people see smoke and assume
it is fire.

Sexual assaults are very real and very common, but not because there is this "tee-hee" behind closed doors in which people try to normalize rape. Misogyny is a different thing, and
usually thats the real target that folks want to combat, but a "culture of rape" is ridiculous. Now are there some groups that might partake in that bullshyt? I don't doubt it.
But a culture???? An ENTIRE culture? Nah, B.

The concern of rape yeah but rape culture give me a fukking break. That's my point nobody and I mean nobody is like fellas bout to rape a chick tonight. These dudes can't even find people in their own circles that are apart of this culture but they want me to believe it exist? Nah son if its soooo out there cats should be able to have close examples not shyt somebody wrote which for me is classic google debate tactics 101. Get these same cats that normally don't know what they talking about debate style IRL without assistance they done. Its no culture that's all and like these other flimsy robbery, killing, excuses these rape crimes unfortunately are going to happen. Its just a negative part of life that will never change just like people will always rob and kill. Trying to shame dudes on some Backdoor misogyny play isn't going to work because most dudes can see this as an okey doke. Nobody falls for the okey doke but suckers. Anybody saying its a rape culture out here is a sucker on this issue period.

 

[SunZoo]

Rape is a horrible thing that men, women, and children go through. The fact that they call it a culture and not an act of violence, is very telling.

Again.

We understand the word “culture,” from a sociological or anthropological viewpoint, to be things that people commonly engage in together as a society (ranging from the arts to education to table manners), and we find it difficult to link the word “rape” in with that concept.

"We know that at its core, our society is not something that outwardly promotes rape, as the phrase could imply. That is, we don’t, after all, “commonly engage” in sexual violence “together as a society.”

To understand rape culture better, first we need to understand that it’s not necessarily a society or group of people that outwardly promotes rape (although it could be).

When we talk about rape culture, we’re discussing something more implicit than that. We’re talking about cultural practices (that, yes, we commonly engage in together as a society) that excuse or otherwise tolerate sexual violence."

Agree or disagree with that perspective.

If you agree, then all you are arguing is semantics/branding.

 

[CinnaSlim]

@CinnaSlim in your opinion what constitutes rape? We all know the most basic, physical struggle definition, but where do you believe consent begins and ends? Does it have to be vocalized? Must it be when you're sober? Is "hard to get" not a real thing?

No means no.
Silence is not consent.
Science and the law say you're judgement is inhibited when you drink.
Playing hard to get is stupid.

Unless you get an affirmative objective reply, you proceed at your own risk. Because it's left up to interpretation. Just ask. Consent is sexy. Both parties are clear, and you can proceed.

 

[philmonroe]

I touched on my personal experiences with this in this thread. And where did I make out the majority guys out to be Elliot Rodgers? If that's all you got from that post you missed the point.

Missing your point I'm ok with since I don't agree with it anyway. If you don't know how you tried to make dude Elliot Rodgers maybe you should reread what you typed. You can't say its a culture of something then say the majority of cats ain't on it. fukk is the culture at then if you're not talking about a large number of people in this case men? That's what people would get from it if you use the world culture my dude not no small group number. Also all I got from your post is on this issue (let me stress on this issue not overall) you're lost and trying to be the down guy with "rape culture".

 

[philmonroe]

@CinnaSlim in your opinion what constitutes rape? We all know the most basic, physical struggle definition, but where do you believe consent begins and ends? Does it have to be vocalized? Must it be when you're sober? Is "hard to get" not a real thing?

Yeah that hard to get part was like what fam? I've never heard a dude use that out of context of a chick was actually playing hard to get not in a I'm going to rape her because she playing hard to get. That is the stuff that will slide unquestioned for the most part online esp with the male/female ratio on here but take this shyt offline with dudes who having discussion for real that type of stuff will get shredded. Tbh damn near all of them examples she had would cause they aren't good examples of some "rape culture" Most are what people say when bad things happen period and the others are said by so few people that trying to make that out to be the norm when its clearly not is bogus IMO.

 

[Claudex]

All this is fine, and true. The only thing I dispute is there being a culture of rape. A culture of bystanders who let bad situations take place...sureBut that goes for most crimes.
Even if people suspect, they don't act. Some of it reasonable, some of it pure negligence.

In my dictionary culture is defined as "the attitudes and behavior characteristic of a particular social group". And I'll talk about the attitude/behavior surrounding rape but first let me say that I do agree that bystanders letting bad situations take place happens all the time, after all no one wants to get caught in the crossfire of a violent crime (specifically robbery/murder/kidnapping where weapons may be involved) and up until now people had no way of doing anything about it. That is until iphones and galaxys came into play, so even now in the 21st century the circumstances surrounding violent crimes have drastically changed. We even got criminals snitching on they own damn selves for the whole world to see.
Well where rape is concerned the nature of the bystander's silence is slightly different as exposed on my prior example:

"...because she and you know that if she goes to the cops y'all gon' have several witnesses saying "Oh yeah, they left the club together all hugged up. Hope lil'homie got it in."

I finished of that example specifically that way because the nature of the bystander's silence to a possible rape isn't a natural fear of harm to the self, but of a misreading of the situation taking place due to established societal ideals surrounding "certain types" of women.

To say there is a culture is to say we are all complicit in this happening, when as a society(half being women) we don't condone rape. Individual instances of said act does not mean that nobody would have stepped into a situation, like one with a girl who has had to many and the vultures come in.

You're very right that as a society we do not condone outright rape. I dare say we actually demand castration and executions for all outright violent rapists (here I'm talking about the sex crazed, find a woman in the ally and fight her to the ground type of rapist), BUT we feel vastly different about quasi-rape. By quasi rape – which make no mistake is rape nonetheless – I'm talking about the type of rape in which the rapist doesn't actually outright attack victim but instead takes his/her time luring the victim to a situation she's not even expecting.

In fact, the quasi rapist can even go as far as rationalizing his actions by deciding that if the woman has been lured by his tactics, then she must be familiar with them (the slut) and thus not in a position to react negatively against them should she finally find herself alone with him.

Speaking of instances where you saw people take a drunk chick out, did you interject??? I have done so, twice on behalf of strangers (one happened to be with her boyfriend) and a few times
cause of ditsy female friends I kept. Mind you, everyone sees an event differently. The guy in front of the two saw a dude rushing a drunk chick out the bar...the guy to the side saw a chick
being helped by a guy who knew she had too many...a guy from behind can not see anything out of the norm, because he might very well be doing the same thing with his buddies when the
girls they are with drink too much. Clear-cut examples aren't the ones that happen most often, so predators win when there is doubt about intentions, especially if EVERYONE in the bar is drinking.
Who really is assuming anyone is there to harm anyone?

When I witnessed my first case of quasi-rape I inherently felt something slimy was happening (as I'm sure you've felt too before) but I did not interfere. I let it go because "it wasn't my business". I was young and in my mind that was just how the world worked. I wasn't afraid of the dude. I felt he was a bit too pushy, but the girl only just seemed embarrassed; she did not push him away or scream anything. At all. Now as an adult I suspect she felt that even if she said something I wouldn't have done shyt and she'd just be called a hoe. I can't quite tell it happened so long ago.
Upon becoming an adult and more knowledgeable of the world of men I did interject on behalf of the women I knew, and even one stranger myself.

You're of course very right that predators win when there is doubt about intentions. But I go further and say that predators win not only when the doubt is felt by their victims, but also when the doubt is felt by us the bystanders. Which is why interjecting should perhaps be more common, a simple: "Y'all are a cute couple!" can allow for a better reading of the situation even if the predator cuts the victim off before they can say something. Or even a "are you okay miss?" in case one isn't sure of just how drunk a chick is. Dudes may be a little too quick to simply decide "nah that ain't my issue" when something questionable happens right in front of them, and that's what needs to change.

Even an interjection of your best friend trying to hit on that chick at that house-party that is beyond drunk can stop a fukked up situation from happening.

Who really is assuming anyone is there to harm anyone? It's like saying "Teach men not to rape." Well, teach murderers not to murder...teach thieves not to steal...etc.

I would never say that teaching men not to rape is the same as teaching men not to steal/murder. Simply because there's levels to this rape shyt that society just wasn't addressing – such as the quasi-rape issue – until recently. Society barely has to teach men how to not force a woman to have sex at gun/knife point. But pills/alcohol/surprise-trains were not a part of the rape discourse until now. That you must admit.

See how asinine that sounds? Now you can say "Exercise judgment, before and after you drink, so you don't get yourself into a situation where you might cross the line with a lady."
And then they might call it victim blaming, but if you are out drinking and don't have a support system that will keep you straight if you do too much, you are open to the off chance that
either
A: some nut comes and takes what he wants
or
B: A drunk guy comes along, you both make a poor decision, and at the end, you both don't really know what went down.

Exercising judgement isn't the issue as much as society checking itself on the assumptions it makes towards women who get taken advantage of. You yourself are a staple of the coli's existence as a poster (due to just how much you've contributed since the beginning) so I know that you know how some brehs over here view certain women as sluts and deserving of being...what's that term? "turned out". A saying that has heavy rape connotations if you're paying attention.

Remember, rape is USUALLY committed by someone who is familiar with the victim, so it might not even be a chance for others to intervene, much like my mother.
It was a family member.

Because rape is usually committed by someone familiar is why the discourse on "just how expansive rape is" is finally happening. If things keep up the way they are, hopefully in the 2100 little girls as young as 12/14 won't have to listen to their mothers call them sluts and decide to not believe the "" when the child tells them how they were propositioned/touched by a step-father, uncle. 'Cause sometimes it really be like that right now.

 

[VegasCAC]

No means no.
Silence is not consent.
Science and the law say you're judgement is inhibited when you drink.
Playing hard to get is stupid.

Unless you get an affirmative objective reply, you proceed at your own risk. Because it's left up to interpretation. Just ask. Consent is sexy. Both parties are clear, and you can proceed.

So you've never hooked up with someone while drunk ? So we should never participate in sexual acts while under any influence?

I've had some very positive, consensual sexual experiences (confirmed after the fact) with both relative strangers and a significant other while we both were hammered out of our minds, so I'm not sure if I buy that.

Playing hard to get IS stupid, but girls do it all the time. There's a pretty easily seen difference from playing hard to get and an outright , serious "no" though, IMO. There's absolutely no reason why you shouldn't be able to tell the difference, so I agree with you there.


Do seperate sexual acts need seperate consents (for example from oral to intercourse), or is "sex" all one act? Is just one consent needed at the beginning or are several?


Is the onus always on the male to get consent when both parties are drunk or even when sober? Why is that?

 

[CinnaSlim]

So you've never hooked up with someone while drunk ? So we should never participate in sexual acts while under any influence?

I've had some very positive, consensual sexual experiences (confirmed after the fact) with both relative strangers and a significant other while we both were hammered out of our minds, so I'm not sure if I buy that.

Playing hard to get IS stupid, but girls do it all the time. There's a pretty easily seen difference from playing hard to get and an outright , serious "no" though, IMO. There's absolutely no reason why you shouldn't be able to tell the difference, so I agree with you there.


Do seperate sexual acts need seperate consents (for example from oral to intercourse), or is "sex" all one act? Is just one consent needed at the beginning or are several?


Is the onus always on the male to get consent when both parties are drunk or even when sober? Why is that?

I've (almost) had drunk sex, but I went over with the intent to have sex. You can partake in sexual activities with someone under the influence but you leave yourself open to accusations. So I'd advise with anyone you have sex with, be responsible and talk about consent and what you are comfortable with before hand.

It's all subjective, but the legal definition is not. Like I said, talk about it with your partner. I had someone do a specific sexual act that I did not consent to and I felt extremely violated. I wouldn't go as far as to say rape, but it affected me strongly in a negative way and broke my trust.

It's not always on the man. Men can be raped as well. However, seeing the culture and the bias presented in courts, you proceed at your own risk.

Again, sex is a serious thing, with serious consequences. Have fun but be responsible. Talk about what you feel comfortable with before proceeding. Talk sexy during. "Is this ok? Do you like this? Do you want to...?" Etc.

All part of being a responsible adult. Open communication is key.

 

[Mandarin Duck]

No means no.
Silence is not consent.
Science and the law say you're judgement is inhibited when you drink.
Playing hard to get is stupid.

Unless you get an affirmative objective reply, you proceed at your own risk. Because it's left up to interpretation. Just ask. Consent is sexy. Both parties are clear, and you can proceed.

I get silence is not consent, but what about not asking? Meaning can you flirt all night with a girl, take her home willingly and smash without you nesacarily asking Her "Would You Like To Have Sex Ma'am?"

In your opinion if that happened, should a women then be allowed to say "You know what? He didn't ask to have Sex last night. I got raped!"

 

[CinnaSlim]

I get silence is not consent, but what about not asking? Meaning can you flirt all night with a girl, take her home willingly and smash without you nesacarily asking Her "Would You Like To Have Sex Ma'am?"

In your opinion if that happened, should a women then be allowed to say "You know what? He didn't ask to have Sex last night. I got raped!"

In my opinion, if she did not consent and felt violated she could accuse him, but it is up to the jury. Since these events typically happen without third party witnesses, it is important to make yourself clear. Same reason, cops often get away with illegal searches because civilians do not clearly state, "I do not consent."

Simply, by not asking you leave it open to interpretation. Open and clear communication is key.

 

[SunZoo]

The concern of rape yeah but rape culture give me a fukking break. That's my point nobody and I mean nobody is like fellas bout to rape a chick tonight. These dudes can't even find people in their own circles that are apart of this culture but they want me to believe it exist? .

Nobody is saying there is a large group of people saying stupid shyt like "hey fellas lets go rape a chick tonight", that is not what is being discussed. If you think that's what people are talking about when referring to "rape culture" you're wrong.

You make it sound like some sort of club or some shyt. What people are getting at when they refer to "rape culture" are the customs and cultural practices that leads to complacency when it comes to sexualized violence of which most victims are women, now and throughout history. Not a traveling band of sex offenders...