Eric Bischoff calls Bret Hart a whiny bytch

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

They didn't do that to sabotage ecw lol. It's been confirmed vince Russo had a hard on for him it wasn't even done though traditional channels.

so they just-so-happened to scoop up tazz AND the dudleys right before their big national TV debut?

this is also far from the first or the last time that the WWE has pulled this on other promotions.

and as for the cross-promotional thing, the WWF been fell back on that by this point. once they caught back up with WCW in the ratings, they stopped putting ECW talent on their shows.

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

BUT, lets go by your logic of main event/champion = the reason why people bought into the product, Wrestlemania 10 sold 420,000 PPV's with Bret vs Yokozuna main eventing and Starrcade 94 sold 130,000 with Hogan vs Brutus Beefcake

wrestlemania sells itself......and it was built up by hulk hogan.

bret/yokozuna was not the scheduled main event for wrestlemania 10.
bret was never a draw in the U.S.

They gave him a sh*t debut dude, gave him a garbage theme, and debuted him as a referee of the fukking Bischoff/ Zybysico match.. Then afterwards just did some directionless feud with Flair Cmon dude

debuting a free agent as a special referee for a big match was COMMON in the '90s.
bischoff/zybysko was already one of the most hyped up matches for starcade before bret went to WCW. how is that a chit debut in REAL TIME?? im not talking in retrospect 20 years later after narratives were pushed. im talking real time in the 1990s.

how was the feud with flair direction-less?? because there was no gimmicky WWF-esque storyline behind it?? cmon now. yall keep applying WWF logic to other promotions. keep that stuff in the WWF bro. we good over here.

 

[supertrekker]

The concept of individuals drawing was on its way out of the door around 93-97 (and died completely after Austin retired and WCW folded), with the way things were around that time its impossible to say who drew what because people didn't buy wrestling shows out of who was on the marquee, WCW had Hogan, Flair, Macho, Luger, Sting, etc which is much much different than say the 80s where the main event was Hogan vs whoever and an undercard of nobodies compared to him(a lot of those nobodies grew to be stars but compared to Hogan at the time they were nothing, people bought into WWF in the 80s because Hogan).

93- 97 is when the brands really started to become the selling point rather than the top stars, you can say Hogan outdrew(btw without providing numbers which makes your claim very very dubious) but the fans HATED Hogan around that time, and not just the internet crowd, he was getting the shyt boo'd out of him during that time, its what prompted him to turn heel and Bret was at the height of his popularity, I think the crowd reaction is more telling to popularity around that time than buys

BUT, lets go by your logic of main event/champion = the reason why people bought into the product, Wrestlemania 10 sold 420,000 PPV's with Bret vs Yokozuna main eventing and Starrcade 94 sold 130,000 with Hogan vs Brutus Beefcake

I see your point but you can't compare Wrestlemania to Starcade. Wrestlemania will always draw bigger numbers compared to a PPV in December and the WWF was still doing a better marketing job than WCW. Now put Hogan vs Vader instead of Beefcake I'm sure the numbers would've been better. But it was mentioned in Kayfabe Commenteries Timeline series that Wrestlemania 10 was the first without Hogan and drew the lowest buys for Wrestlemania. That should tell you something too. If Bret was the draw he said he was then why did the WWF bring Warrior and Sid back.

 

[Peter Parker]

wrestlemania sells itself......and it was built up by hulk hogan.

bret/yokozuna was not the scheduled main event for wrestlemania 10.
bret was never a draw in the U.S.

I could throw numbers at you for days where Bret main evented and WWF outsold WCW with Hogan at the top but it seems like you’ve got a narrative in your head(also Hogan was long gone before Wrestlemania 10)

Like I said, 93-97 was the beginning of the end of the individual draw and there’s no way to correlate ppv buys to a single guys drawing power in that time period, no single person was a draw again until Austin. Hogan was historically unpopular and fans weren’t buying his shtick anymore after the aresenio hall fiasco.

 

[Peter Parker]

I see your point but you can't compare Wrestlemania to Starcade. Wrestlemania will always draw bigger numbers compared to a PPV in December and the WWF was still doing a better marketing job than WCW. Now put Hogan vs Vader instead of Beefcake I'm sure the numbers would've been better. But it was mentioned in Kayfabe Commenteries Timeline series that Wrestlemania 10 was the first without Hogan and drew the lowest buys for Wrestlemania. That should tell you something too. If Bret was the draw he said he was then why did the WWF bring Warrior and Sid back.

I never said Bret was the draw, he wasn’t, neither was Hogan in WCW, there were no more Individual draws until Austin.

Bret was definitely more popular with the fans at the time though and not just the internet fans, Hogan was getting boo’d out of buildings and not Cena style where the kids still loved him, Roman Reigns style

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

I never said Bret was the draw, he wasn’t, neither was Hogan in WCW, there were no more Individual draws until Austin.

Bret was definitely more popular with the fans at the time though and not just the internet fans, Hogan was getting boo’d out of buildings and not Cena style where the kids still loved him, Roman Reigns style

lol @ hogan not being a draw for WCW.
no way you typed that with a str8 face.

bret was never as popular as hogan at any point.
hogan was getting booed because he was in enemy territory, brought his act & his buddies over and flipped WCW upside down. and even with that, he was not getting booed like cena or reigns.

I could throw numbers at you for days where Bret main evented and WWF outsold WCW with Hogan at the top but it seems like you’ve got a narrative in your head(also Hogan was long gone before Wrestlemania 10)

Like I said, 93-97 was the beginning of the end of the individual draw and there’s no way to correlate ppv buys to a single guys drawing power in that time period, no single person was a draw again until Austin. Hogan was historically unpopular and fans weren’t buying his shtick anymore after the aresenio hall fiasco.

people werent buying those ppvs because of bret. they were buying the WWF brand - most people were still doing it out of habit from the rock-n-wrestling & federation eras when hogan was on top. then WWF fans and casuals slowly began to drift over to WCW.

im not even arguing the other stuff. i agree that wrestling shows are a cumulative effort. ive been saying that on here for years that TRUE draws on a big national stage are few & far between.
hulk hogan of course - is one of those draws. bret hart was never that.

 

[supertrekker]

lol @ hogan not being a draw for WCW.

no way you typed that with a str8 face.





people werent buying those ppvs because of bret. they were buying the WWF brand - most people were still doing it out of habit from the rock-n-wrestling & federation eras when hogan was on top. then WWF fans and casuals slowly began to drift over to WCW. .

Just like fans from the AE were still tuning during the RA era and the RA started soon after WCW and ECW went out of business so I'm sure PPVs with Bautista HHH Orton and Cena did better numbers than PPVs with Austin and Rock.

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

Just like fans from the AE were still tuning during the RA era and the RA started soon after WCW and ECW went out of business so I'm sure PPVs with Bautista HHH Orton and Cena did better numbers than PPVs with Austin and Rock.

THIS
and the WWE to this day, is still riding off of fumes from the attitude era. they dont even try to hide that fact.

we ordered all the WWF new generation era ppvs up until they started churning out those "in your house" shows.
and we only ordered those new generation ppvs because of the habit/tradition established via the federation years, even when we woulve rather watched the WCW ppvs around that time instead.
didnt even enjoy the majority of those new generation shows.

WWF brand loyalty is a muhf*kka. i escaped it by '95 but if i could go back, i'd escape it a couple years earlier.

 

[Peter Parker]

lol @ hogan not being a draw for WCW.
no way you typed that with a str8 face.

bret was never as popular as hogan at any point.
hogan was getting booed because he was in enemy territory, brought his act & his buddies over and flipped WCW upside down. and even with that, he was not getting booed like cena or reigns.





people werent buying those ppvs because of bret. they were buying the WWF brand - most people were still doing it out of habit from the rock-n-wrestling & federation eras when hogan was on top. then WWF fans and casuals slowly began to drift over to WCW.

im not even arguing the other stuff. i agree that wrestling shows are a cumulative effort. ive been saying that on here for years that TRUE draws on a big national stage are few & far between.
hulk hogan of course - is one of those draws. bret hart was never that.

Hogan was one of those draws in the 80s, WCW was loosing money and fans constantly with Hogan on top pre-nWo(which wasn’t Hogan’s fault entirely, WCW sucked at that time) because he brought his friends in and “turned WCW upside down” with that awful 80s shyt and that didn’t turn around until the cultural shift that was the nWo and WCWs focus on the undercard thus making a better show.

If Hogan was such a draw for WCW why didn’t people tune in to watch him? They were on TV, people knew where Hogan went, it was known he wasn’t with the WWF anymore

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

Hogan was one of those draws in the 80s, WCW was loosing money and fans constantly with Hogan on top pre-nWo(which wasn’t Hogan’s fault entirely, WCW sucked at that time) because he brought his friends in and “turned WCW upside down” with that awful 80s shyt and that didn’t turn around until the cultural shift that was the nWo and WCWs focus on the undercard thus making a better show.

If Hogan was such a draw for WCW why didn’t people tune in to watch him? They were on TV, people knew where Hogan went, it was known he wasn’t with the WWF anymore

revisionist history.

WCW was doing big business before the NWO. nitro was winning monday night ratings out the gate, dam near a whole year before anything NWO.

and whatever fans that may have hopped off the bandwagon, it didnt matter because they gained more fans than they lost, by incorporating more WWF fans and more wrestling fans in general that were still seeking those early '90s vibes. i was gonna do a thread about WCW around this time period, but i figured this aint the right message board for that. but yea, WCW brought those early '90s vibes back, mixed the old WWF with the WCW and was basically putting on super-cards every month. they had the winning formula long before the NWO. the NWO chit just put them way over the top.

sidenote: i was also gonna do a thread about the AWF, which tried to dial all the way back to the late '80s/early '90s around this time. but again, this aint the place for all that. thread would flop horrendously.

 

[NYChase718]

Bret Hart is my favorite wrestler of all time but he does come off as whiney at times but at least he doesn't sugarcoat anything. He calls it how he sees it.

He did that impact tribute for shamrock video
And starts talking about survivor series 97
Or a couple months ago hes having an interview and starts talking about rock and hhh and michaels backstage for the 10000th time
Meanwhile in 2020 rock and hhh tweet at eachother and get along fine

But i do enjoy every time he shyts on seth rollins for his botches and anytime he brings up goldberg both are funny af

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

Bret has a point about the stupidity of WCW how are you in charge and the guys making the big money you don't have anything for them to say so they go out there and say whatever. That's how Steiner got off on Flair

any other time, yall complain about WWE's scripted promos, but now we're gonna complain about WCW having un-scripted promos??

and bret hart is just mad that he got murdered on the mic by almost everybody he feuded with in WCW.

like i said, bret hart just wasnt a good fit for WCW. his flaws got exposed over there. people just dont want to admit it because hes a WWF guy.
if the table was turned and he was a star from another promotion going over to the WWF, yall wouldnt be making any of these threads about WWF dropping the ball on said free agent.

 

[R=G]

He did that impact tribute for shamrock video
And starts talking about survivor series 97
Or a couple months ago hes having an interview and starts talking about rock and hhh and michaels backstage for the 10000th time
Meanwhile in 2020 rock and hhh tweet at eachother and get along fine

But i do enjoy every time he shyts on seth rollins for his botches and anytime he brings up goldberg both are funny af

Rock and Cripple H because Levesque has to kiss his ass to save face from all those anti Rock interviews in the early 2000s..he used to not give Rock credit..like he does with Foley these days but he flipped that around by WM 28 when Rock basically has made Vince McMahon bow down after breaking records again.

 

[The Amerikkkan Idol]

any other time, yall complain about WWE's scripted promos, but now we're gonna complain about WCW having un-scripted promos??

and bret hart is just mad that he got murdered on the mic by almost everybody he feuded with in WCW.

like i said, bret hart just wasnt a good fit for WCW. his flaws got exposed over there. people just dont want to admit it because hes a WWF guy.
if the table was turned and he was a star from another promotion going over to the WWF, yall wouldnt be making any of these threads about how WCW supposedly "dropped the ball" on bret.

But Bret Hart doesn't have to be a great promo in order to do what he does, which is bring a level of seriousness and reality to any match.

A good promotion knows how to play up the strengths of it's talent and paper over their weaknesses, that's what Paul Heyman was great at with ECW.

Bret's one of the greatest in-ring workers of all-time, why not have him working with Benoit, Jericho, Mysterio, Regal, Sting, Eddie Guerrero, and putting on classic matches?

You have the biggest free agent in wrestling who's the most sympathetic man in wrestling and you bring him in as a special guest referee? Then you put him in the NWO? Bret Hart the "excellence of execution"?

Who the fukk wanted to see Bret Hart & Goldberg?

Late stage WCW was a clown show and I say that as a guy who will always say that as a WCW guy more than a WWF guy.

 

[Homeboy Runny-Ray]

But Bret Hart doesn't have to be a great promo in order to do what he does, which is bring a level of seriousness and reality to any match.

but thats already what WCW does.

he stood out in the WWF because he was their trophy workrate guy. a big fish in a small pond.

a bret hart or shawn michaels WWF classic that gets raved about is usually just another match on monday nitro.

so again, what did bret hart do to stand out in WCW?? i'll tell you. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. hence, the reason why he didnt make an impact, despite the constant push & world title run.

Bret's one of the greatest in-ring workers of all-time, why not have him working with Benoit, Jericho, Mysterio, Regal, Sting, Eddie Guerrero, and putting on classic matches?

You have the biggest free agent in wrestling who's the most sympathetic man in wrestling and you bring him in as a special guest referee? Then you put him in the NWO? Bret Hart the "excellence of execution"?

Who the fukk wanted to see Bret Hart & Goldberg?

Late stage WCW was a clown show and I say that as a guy who will always say that as a WCW guy more than a WWF guy.

he wrestled benoit, sting and prolly a couple others on your list.
lol. why dont you dudes just admit that you didnt watch WCW, and youre just regurgitating rhetoric??
also, bret is just another worker when placed on that WCW roster. and he didnt even bring his A-game. didnt give anybody their best match over there. if you ask me, someone who was actually a WCW viewer, i would say that bret was over-pushed. but let WWF fans tell it, he shouldve been running the place.

all this biggest free agent/most sympathetic man in wrestling stuff. yall need to realize that WCW fans didnt care about the montreal screwjob or any of that chit.
and biggest free agent at that time was really the ultimate warrior.

FOR THE LAST TIME, debuting a big free agent as a special guest referee was COMMON back in the day. the WWF used to do the same chit. i dont see yall complaining about that tho.