Feels like WWE crowds have turned smarky overnight

[Cattle Mutilation]

It's weird to say things like this... I can agree with the singing part and all that, but how do people want fresh, new content and claim they're tired of the same ol' same ol', Seth becoming "serious heel in a suit that hates the fans #469754" in a week is the answer? That would be every heel in the whole company if that was the only way to be a heel.

I think fans (and people in general) are just this way these days- they like the heels. It's in almost every facet of life right now- people celebrate and joke about (even on themselves) toxicity and narcissism, being kind barely gets rewarded, and look at who the gotdamn president is. We've circled back around to the Attitude Era in a way as it relates to wrestling.

Another thing, as noted earlier in the thread is that heels have become more nuanced writing-wise- they're not just out there saying the local sports team sucks- they're giving reasons that actually aren't wrong as to why they do what they do. Yeah, Drew McIntyre is a heel- but the people he hates all did him wrong at some point, why shouldn't he? Heyman turned on Roman, but Roman left this MF high and dry after ManiaXL and put him in a dangerous predicament- why shouldn't he? People like Jacob Fatu because he's the most vicious and unpredictable out of Solo's crew and he's not done a thing to be liked - 30 years ago, that's undoubtedly a heel. People are out here rootin' for the bad guys. The only heels they seem not to cheer are the stone-faced, completely antagonistic ones that almost border on boring, but again, everybody can't play that same character. I don't wanna see Seth Rollins turn into Gunther.

The thing about heels giving valid reasons why they are heels is logical writing but what’s logical isn’t always good. If you make it entirely logical people can be like “well that makes 100% sense then. I may not have made the same decision you made but I respect the thought process and the facts you presented to come to that decision.”

When they do that, what they really should be doing is finding a small detail that is indeed true, exaggerating it, then blowing it completely out of proportion. You want logic behind it, but you need to twist and distort it to get the reaction you want. We need it to make sense, but we also need a reason to say “you know what? fukk that guy.”

 

[Cattle Mutilation]

The thing about heels giving valid reasons why they are heels is logical writing but what’s logical isn’t always good. If you make it entirely logical people can be like “well that makes 100% sense then. I may not have made the same decision you made but I respect the thought process and the facts you presented to come to that decision.”

When they do that, what they really should be doing is finding a small detail that is indeed true, exaggerating it, then blowing it completely out of proportion. You want logic behind it, but you need to twist and distort it to get the reaction you want. We need it to make sense, but we also need a reason to say “you know what? fukk that guy.”

Like you want a good example of that? See FTR’s explanation for turning on Cope.

 

[MenacingMonk]

It's weird to say things like this... I can agree with the singing part and all that, but how do people want fresh, new content and claim they're tired of the same ol' same ol', Seth becoming "serious heel in a suit that hates the fans #469754" in a week is the answer? That would be every heel in the whole company if that was the only way to be a heel.

I think fans (and people in general) are just this way these days- they like the heels. It's in almost every facet of life right now- people celebrate and joke about (even on themselves) toxicity and narcissism, being kind barely gets rewarded, and look at who the gotdamn president is. We've circled back around to the Attitude Era in a way as it relates to wrestling.

Another thing, as noted earlier in the thread is that heels have become more nuanced writing-wise- they're not just out there saying the local sports team sucks- they're giving reasons that actually aren't wrong as to why they do what they do. Yeah, Drew McIntyre is a heel- but the people he hates all did him wrong at some point, why shouldn't he? Heyman turned on Roman, but Roman left this MF high and dry after ManiaXL and put him in a dangerous predicament- why shouldn't he? People like Jacob Fatu because he's the most vicious and unpredictable out of Solo's crew and he's not done a thing to be liked - 30 years ago, that's undoubtedly a heel. People are out here rootin' for the bad guys. The only heels they seem not to cheer are the stone-faced, completely antagonistic ones that almost border on boring, but again, everybody can't play that same character. I don't wanna see Seth Rollins turn into Gunther.

There’s other ways to make him a heel, but the example I listed is the easiest way to get heat. Look at Ricochet. Dude spent his entire career as a face and he’s been killing it since he became a heel.

Seth has done nothing for his character to make him come off like a heel. That’s why he shoulda had a character change. It’s Wrestling 101.

 

[DANJ!]

There’s other ways to make him a heel, but the example I listed is the easiest way to get heat. Look at Ricochet. Dude spent his entire career as a face and he’s been killing it since he became a heel.

Seth has done nothing for his character to make him come off like a heel. That’s why he shoulda had a character change. It’s Wrestling 101.

OK, but that's Ricochet... who outside of his in-ring abilities has never been an interesting character at all. Of course this is working for him, 'cause he finally has a personality.

Seth Rollins isn't at a point in his career where "you fans suck and so do the Chiefs" is the only thing he can do.

 

[MenacingMonk]

OK, but that's Ricochet... who outside of his in-ring abilities has never been an interesting character at all. Of course this is working for him, 'cause he finally has a personality.

Seth Rollins isn't at a point in his career where "you fans suck and so do the Chiefs" is the only thing he can do.

Like I said, I just gave an example. There’s other ways to make him a full on heel.

 

[The Intergalactic Koala]

Modern heels want to be season 1 Walter White instead of season 5 Walter White

Meanwhile the faces are season 1 through 5 of Jesse Pinkman

 

[Cattle Mutilation]

Meanwhile the faces are season 1 through 5 of Jesse Pinkman

Or Mrs. Walter White - a face that people actually root against

 

[TheAlbionist]

I haven't been watching, but the crowd always used to be a bit more smarky around Wrestlemania season.

Raw after Mania became a thing because of all the smarks that were usually still in attendance from Mania week.

 

[OneDeep]

I haven't been watching, but the crowd always used to be a bit more smarky around Wrestlemania season.

Raw after Mania became a thing because of all the smarks that were usually still in attendance from Mania week.

Only thing We’re far removed from WM & this was a more casual wrestling town this week for Raw

 

[thaKEAF]

When the show first started I was thinking they were smart to get Sami get involved because that will get heel heat on Rollins.

I was wrong

 

[Mike the Executioner]

OK, but that's Ricochet... who outside of his in-ring abilities has never been an interesting character at all. Of course this is working for him, 'cause he finally has a personality.

Seth Rollins isn't at a point in his career where "you fans suck and so do the Chiefs" is the only thing he can do.

The problem is that Seth has not only been a heel multiple times already, but his character before WrestleMania was a borderline heel to begin with. His biggest enemy is CM Punk, a person that the fans love. He hates Roman Reigns, a person that the fans love. He's directly going against baby face characters, constantly complaining about them, costing them opportunities. He put Roman out of action for weeks and yelled at Punk to die as Cena was choking the life out of him at the Elimination Chamber. He literally called himself a spiteful little b*stard last year and he's had issues with his own friends. He's done stuff to remind you he's technically a good guy (helping Cody at WrestleMania XL), but in storyline, he's not the most likable person. The last time he was a pure face was in 2019, and that was one of the lowest points of his career.

I was worried about Seth teaming up with Paul and forming a group because I didn't want him to be that kind of heel again. The one that Roman was, the one that Cena is. It completely goes against his character and what he values, and we saw that version of him ten years ago. I liked the way they portrayed him on Monday because it was nuanced. He didn't want Sami to become a target. He offered to spare him, give him a fresh start somewhere else if he didn't agree with what he was doing. Offered him a championship match if that's what it took. Sami told him to go to hell, and Seth did what he had to do. His hand was forced.

That's exactly the kind of character Seth should be as a heel. Someone who buys into his own bullshyt and genuinely believes he's doing the right thing. Someone like Drew, who technically is 100% right, but he's such an a$$hole about it, it makes you want to boo him. I was hoping they would go that route with Cena, but he's more of an old-school heel, which I understand because he's never played that character before. Seth has, and with all the development he's gone through in the last six years, this is exactly where he needs to be.

 

[DaHNIC82]

Heels don't really want to be heels anymore. They want to be liked and sell merchandise and then take the mask off on podcasts. Being all humble and shyt.


Take Rick Rude for example. You never seen Rude out of character.. Ever... Plus it's a real life reflection of who he really was. You would think he's a a$$hole 24/7 but he made it work and drew money with every Babyface he faced. Rude was a prick and it worked.

Same with 80s Piper.

Even Hoegan first heel run

It doesn't help they book babyfaces to look like goofs They made Cody look like a chump . Who gonna want to support that?

 

[Rell84shots]

Yes, I saw it coming and now it's finally taken over. The crowd turning on Bianca for no legit reason will be the example people use in the future. Smark crowds are awful and make booking decisions even harder, but banana nose caters to them so it's his fault.

 

[Rell84shots]

The honeymoon period is no where near being over. WWE will not go back to the way it was pre Vince scandal for a long time. The honeymoon period for The IWC is ending but that’s because they have to be first to not like something so when everyone gets tired of it they can see we tried to tell y’all.
The IWC wants to be the only voices in the room and they can’t wait to turn on the popular opinion.

I think a lot of people are just so used to WWE being bad that they don’t know how to enjoy it.

The WWE is worse now than it was 2 years ago. The reason why it's not enjoyable for a lot of people right now is because it feels IWC influenced.

 

[StatUS]

Time for Trips to cut a certain promo again