Finally, Conservatives Begin To Back Away From the Confederate Flag
- Thread starter 88m3
- Start date
88m3
Fast Money & Foreign Objects
Mixed reactions to South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley's Confederate flag announcement
http://mashable.com/2015/06/22/nikki-haley-reactions/?utm_cid=mash-com-fb-main-link
lots of tweets and whatnot idk how to embed.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/south-c...f-confederate-battle-flag-1434995910?mod=e2fb
they're fuming in the comments section
http://mashable.com/2015/06/22/nikki-haley-reactions/?utm_cid=mash-com-fb-main-link
lots of tweets and whatnot idk how to embed.
http://www.wsj.com/articles/south-c...f-confederate-battle-flag-1434995910?mod=e2fb
they're fuming in the comments section
saw it earlier
it's kind of surreal that this is dawning, as...let's say, disgusting, on anyone not black (except kanye) now
really?
this smiley
88m3
Fast Money & Foreign Objects
You can never control that
You can control the narrative and symbology of the state and that goes a long way in curbing the intent and feelings of citizens
The Caliphate will rise
U joke but this is the same group that is the NRA's base
They just mite... word to Cliven Bundy
Trajan
Veteran
The funny thing is "Nikki" Haley is an Indian Sikh (first generation)... Since when does she defend "our flag". Her family moved here way after Jim Crow.
It's hilarious that she talks all this southern shyt.
lmao
It's hilarious that she talks all this southern shyt.
lmao
88m3
Fast Money & Foreign Objects
Amazon, Walmart, and Sears Are Finally Going to Stop Selling Confederate Flag Stuff
http://www.vice.com/read/walmart-an...rate-flag-stuff-vgtrn-195?utm_source=vicefbus
http://www.vice.com/read/walmart-an...rate-flag-stuff-vgtrn-195?utm_source=vicefbus
mc_brew
#NotMyPresident
peep this narrative for a second... young dylann goes into a historic black church and murders nine black people with intentions of starting a race war... instead of a race war popping off, the confed flag gets pulled down from SC's statehouse, ebay & walmart stop selling the confederate flag, and blacks and whites joined together in pray for the families of the victims....
we're far from overcoming racism and we did lose 9 black people, but this stupid evil exercise in racism had a lot of backfires in it.. we just need to get young dylann convicted and sentenced to life (no death penalty, please) and get him put in a jail cell with bubba... it would be sweet justice for dylann to get that behind tapped every night for the rest of his life by some big fat greasy looking black motherfukker....
@ dylann
we're far from overcoming racism and we did lose 9 black people, but this stupid evil exercise in racism had a lot of backfires in it.. we just need to get young dylann convicted and sentenced to life (no death penalty, please) and get him put in a jail cell with bubba... it would be sweet justice for dylann to get that behind tapped every night for the rest of his life by some big fat greasy looking black motherfukker....
@ dylannthe confederate flag flying still is much worse but similar to if we still flew the british flag and put it on the white house
"its our heritage!"
"its our heritage!"
Looks like the GOP can't ride southern idiocy to the moon anymore.
88m3
Fast Money & Foreign Objects
You Won't Believe What the Government Spends on Confederate Graves
Taxpayers now pay more to maintain rebel graves and monuments than those honoring Union soldiers.
On June 19, an array of top government officials gathered for the unveiling of a statue of Frederick Douglass, the 19th-century African American man born a slave who rose to be a vice-presidential candidate. That politicians and the federal government continue to memorialize black leaders and abolitionists of that era surprises no one, but few are aware of the other side of that coin: how much Washington pays to memorialize the Confederate dead.
The most visible commemoration comes every Memorial Day when the president places a wreath at the Confederate Monument in Arlington National Cemetery, the vast memorial built on an estate confiscated from Robert E. Lee. Lower down in public awareness is the fact that 10 military bases—including prominent installations like Fort Lee and Fort Bragg—are named after Confederate leaders, a fact that Jamie Malanowski highlighted and criticized in a Memorial Day New York Times op-ed that stirred a heated debate.
But even most Civil War experts don't realize the federal government has spent more than $2 million in the past decade to produce and ship headstones honoring Confederate dead, often at the request of local Confederate heritage groups in the South, and overwhelmingly in Georgia. Going back to at least 2002, the government has provided more headstones for Confederate graves than for Union soldiers' graves. In that time, the Department of Veterans Affairs has provided approximately 33,000 headstones for veterans of the Civil War. Sixty percent of those have been for Confederate soldiers.
I found out about this program in 2002 while researching the resurgence of political activity by so-called "neo-Confederate" groups in the early part of the last decade. Since then I've spoken to at least a dozen Civil War experts who had no idea it existed and were surprised to hear about it.
United Daughters of the Confederacy. Looking through a list of them gives a sense of the various waves of Confederate nostalgia in America: Nine were built in the years 1910 to 1912, four were built in the 1920s and '30s, and the most recent wave saw four more built between 2003 and 2006, with other key periods of concentration in the century and a half since the Civil War.
It's no coincidence that many of these changes in attitude and law, and the erection of so many Confederate monuments and memorials, occurred around the turn of the 20th century. They followed the federal withdrawal from the South in 1877, a strategic retreat from the failed policies of reconstruction. "Power is recovered by the local governments, and all the gains that black people had pretty much are erased," Boston University Professor William Keylor explained in a recent interview.
"By the end of the century, particularly after the Spanish-American War, there's this new mode of American nationalism and patriotism and there's this emphasis on reunion and reconciliation, and that's good news for the whites in the South, but bad news for blacks in the South," Keylor noted. "The Ku Klux Klan reaches its height [around 1877] and then it [starts to] decline about that point, really because it's no longer needed, because the local governments have just effectively disenfranchised African Americans."
As blacks lost access to their rights, the federal government turned a blind eye and embraced the South in this period, "emphasizing unity, emphasizing reconciliation" among whites, while disregarding blacks, Keylor said. Southerners sought a return to full involvement in national life, and the North was prepared to forgive, forget, and ignore.
The desire for more Confederate memorialization at the turn of the century came not only from a sense of respect for history, heritage, or states' rights, but amid a torrent of racism and racial suppression. Celebrations of Jefferson Davis' 100th birthday in 1908 were held without restraint. The novel, The Clansman: An Historical Romance of the Ku Klux Klan, became a runaway hit when it was published in 1905; a theatrical adaptation successfully toured the South and was even staged in Washington, D.C. (Most of us have heard of the story of that novel and play because of the screen adaptation, D.W. Griffith's The Birth of a Nation). And Confederate heritage groups like the UDC began erecting monuments and memorials that recalled a righteous cause.
Today's federal memorials to the Confederate dead include holdovers from this era of nostalgia. In addition to a plain headstone, Confederate headstones areavailable with what the VA calls "a special style," which includes an engraving of the Southern Cross of Honor—a military decoration the Confederacy created as a sort of analogue to the U.S. Medal of Honor. The cross was revived by members of the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC) in 1898 to honor Confederate veterans who had displayed "loyal, honorable service to the South and given in recognition of this devotion." The medals bore the Latin motto, "Deo Vindice," which translates roughly as "God will be our vindicator." The motto is not included in the Southern Cross of Honor engraved on Confederate headstones, which simply bears the outline of the cross and a laurel contained within it.
Not far from many Confederate gravestones at Arlington, however, is an actual engraving of a motto with more bite to it. "Victrix causa diis placuit sed victa Catoni," reads an inscription on the Confederate memorial. It's a quote from the epic poem Pharsalia, written by Lucan about the Roman Civil War, and literally translated means, "the victorious cause pleased the gods, but the conquered cause pleased Cato." As Malanowski told me, "You have to know your Latin history to know they're talking about the Roman Civil War, that the dictator Julius Caesar won, and that Cato was pleased with the republicans' sacrifice." With that background in mind the inscription is "a 'fukk you' to the Union. It's that sneaky little Latin phrase essentially saying 'we were right and you were wrong, and we'll always be right and you'll always be wrong.'"
That monument, funded by the UDC, was dedicated in 1914 with a speech from President Woodrow Wilson—the first Southerner elected president since 1848, and whose election marked the peak of Northern conciliation with the South.Wilson's presidency was remarkable for his racism: He moved to resegregate the federal civil service and screened Birth of a Nation in the White House. And Wilson spoke at the dedication of the Confederate Monument, held on Jefferson Davis's birthday.
For Malanowski, there's a moral difference between that kind of memorial and the message inherent in providing Confederate headstones, "because you don't want to humiliate the poor soldier" by leaving him in an unmarked grave.
"On the one hand, you don't want to be small, you don't want to begrudge this poor soldier a headstone, but once it begins to add up to a lot of money, it feels like another government boondoggle, and you might be able to have fun with these people placing themselves on the government tit," Malanowski said. "When did the Southern states give up their support of these gravesites? That would seem to be the appropriate party that ought to be maintaining them."
But the sheer size of the headstones project and the fact that a great many of the headstones are ordered by members of Confederate "heritage" groups like the Sons of Confederate Veterans (SCV) and the UDC complicate things.
"Every time the federal government gives them a headstone, it's an opportunity to hold an event, and a gathering" for these groups to engage in Confederate nostalgia, Ed Sebesta, co-editor of Neo-Confederacy: A Critical Introduction. While not all, or even perhaps most, members of the SCV and UDC hold racist views, Sebesta says that at the leadership level, they've recently become much more open about their views of Confederate history and the values it represented. These include leaders—sometimes in official SCV and UDC publications—defending racist government policies of the past, or decrying the civil rights changes of the past 60 years.
For example, the December 2012 issue of UDC Magazine had an article defending the Black Codes. A 2003 article in the official publication of the SCV's Educational Political Action Committee, in Sebesta's words, "explains why segregation is justified." A 2006 article in Southern Mercury decried the judicial and legislative milestones of the Civil Rights Movement, asserting that in the 1960s, "The cultural Marxists relentlessly hammered away at Western cultural norms using the sledge of anti-racism as a battering ram to bring down the walls of traditional Western culture."
Just last March, Boyd Cathey, a former member of the SCV's executive council, wrote in Confederate Veteran, "Southerners have understood perforce that the races must live and work side by side, and hopefully harmoniously, but that did not imply legal and social equality for all, either black or white."
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ng-confederate-graves/277931/?utm_source=SFFB
continued in link
@tmonster @Mephistopheles @Melbournelad
Taxpayers now pay more to maintain rebel graves and monuments than those honoring Union soldiers.
On June 19, an array of top government officials gathered for the unveiling of a statue of Frederick Douglass, the 19th-century African American man born a slave who rose to be a vice-presidential candidate. That politicians and the federal government continue to memorialize black leaders and abolitionists of that era surprises no one, but few are aware of the other side of that coin: how much Washington pays to memorialize the Confederate dead.
The most visible commemoration comes every Memorial Day when the president places a wreath at the Confederate Monument in Arlington National Cemetery, the vast memorial built on an estate confiscated from Robert E. Lee. Lower down in public awareness is the fact that 10 military bases—including prominent installations like Fort Lee and Fort Bragg—are named after Confederate leaders, a fact that Jamie Malanowski highlighted and criticized in a Memorial Day New York Times op-ed that stirred a heated debate.
But even most Civil War experts don't realize the federal government has spent more than $2 million in the past decade to produce and ship headstones honoring Confederate dead, often at the request of local Confederate heritage groups in the South, and overwhelmingly in Georgia. Going back to at least 2002, the government has provided more headstones for Confederate graves than for Union soldiers' graves. In that time, the Department of Veterans Affairs has provided approximately 33,000 headstones for veterans of the Civil War. Sixty percent of those have been for Confederate soldiers.
I found out about this program in 2002 while researching the resurgence of political activity by so-called "neo-Confederate" groups in the early part of the last decade. Since then I've spoken to at least a dozen Civil War experts who had no idea it existed and were surprised to hear about it.
United Daughters of the Confederacy. Looking through a list of them gives a sense of the various waves of Confederate nostalgia in America: Nine were built in the years 1910 to 1912, four were built in the 1920s and '30s, and the most recent wave saw four more built between 2003 and 2006, with other key periods of concentration in the century and a half since the Civil War.
It's no coincidence that many of these changes in attitude and law, and the erection of so many Confederate monuments and memorials, occurred around the turn of the 20th century. They followed the federal withdrawal from the South in 1877, a strategic retreat from the failed policies of reconstruction. "Power is recovered by the local governments, and all the gains that black people had pretty much are erased," Boston University Professor William Keylor explained in a recent interview.
"By the end of the century, particularly after the Spanish-American War, there's this new mode of American nationalism and patriotism and there's this emphasis on reunion and reconciliation, and that's good news for the whites in the South, but bad news for blacks in the South," Keylor noted. "The Ku Klux Klan reaches its height [around 1877] and then it [starts to] decline about that point, really because it's no longer needed, because the local governments have just effectively disenfranchised African Americans."
As blacks lost access to their rights, the federal government turned a blind eye and embraced the South in this period, "emphasizing unity, emphasizing reconciliation" among whites, while disregarding blacks, Keylor said. Southerners sought a return to full involvement in national life, and the North was prepared to forgive, forget, and ignore.
The desire for more Confederate memorialization at the turn of the century came not only from a sense of respect for history, heritage, or states' rights, but amid a torrent of racism and racial suppression. Celebrations of Jefferson Davis' 100th birthday in 1908 were held without restraint. The novel, The Clansman: An Historical Romance of the Ku Klux Klan, became a runaway hit when it was published in 1905; a theatrical adaptation successfully toured the South and was even staged in Washington, D.C. (Most of us have heard of the story of that novel and play because of the screen adaptation, D.W. Griffith's The Birth of a Nation). And Confederate heritage groups like the UDC began erecting monuments and memorials that recalled a righteous cause.
Today's federal memorials to the Confederate dead include holdovers from this era of nostalgia. In addition to a plain headstone, Confederate headstones areavailable with what the VA calls "a special style," which includes an engraving of the Southern Cross of Honor—a military decoration the Confederacy created as a sort of analogue to the U.S. Medal of Honor. The cross was revived by members of the United Daughters of the Confederacy (UDC) in 1898 to honor Confederate veterans who had displayed "loyal, honorable service to the South and given in recognition of this devotion." The medals bore the Latin motto, "Deo Vindice," which translates roughly as "God will be our vindicator." The motto is not included in the Southern Cross of Honor engraved on Confederate headstones, which simply bears the outline of the cross and a laurel contained within it.
Not far from many Confederate gravestones at Arlington, however, is an actual engraving of a motto with more bite to it. "Victrix causa diis placuit sed victa Catoni," reads an inscription on the Confederate memorial. It's a quote from the epic poem Pharsalia, written by Lucan about the Roman Civil War, and literally translated means, "the victorious cause pleased the gods, but the conquered cause pleased Cato." As Malanowski told me, "You have to know your Latin history to know they're talking about the Roman Civil War, that the dictator Julius Caesar won, and that Cato was pleased with the republicans' sacrifice." With that background in mind the inscription is "a 'fukk you' to the Union. It's that sneaky little Latin phrase essentially saying 'we were right and you were wrong, and we'll always be right and you'll always be wrong.'"
That monument, funded by the UDC, was dedicated in 1914 with a speech from President Woodrow Wilson—the first Southerner elected president since 1848, and whose election marked the peak of Northern conciliation with the South.Wilson's presidency was remarkable for his racism: He moved to resegregate the federal civil service and screened Birth of a Nation in the White House. And Wilson spoke at the dedication of the Confederate Monument, held on Jefferson Davis's birthday.
For Malanowski, there's a moral difference between that kind of memorial and the message inherent in providing Confederate headstones, "because you don't want to humiliate the poor soldier" by leaving him in an unmarked grave.
"On the one hand, you don't want to be small, you don't want to begrudge this poor soldier a headstone, but once it begins to add up to a lot of money, it feels like another government boondoggle, and you might be able to have fun with these people placing themselves on the government tit," Malanowski said. "When did the Southern states give up their support of these gravesites? That would seem to be the appropriate party that ought to be maintaining them."
But the sheer size of the headstones project and the fact that a great many of the headstones are ordered by members of Confederate "heritage" groups like the Sons of Confederate Veterans (SCV) and the UDC complicate things.
"Every time the federal government gives them a headstone, it's an opportunity to hold an event, and a gathering" for these groups to engage in Confederate nostalgia, Ed Sebesta, co-editor of Neo-Confederacy: A Critical Introduction. While not all, or even perhaps most, members of the SCV and UDC hold racist views, Sebesta says that at the leadership level, they've recently become much more open about their views of Confederate history and the values it represented. These include leaders—sometimes in official SCV and UDC publications—defending racist government policies of the past, or decrying the civil rights changes of the past 60 years.
For example, the December 2012 issue of UDC Magazine had an article defending the Black Codes. A 2003 article in the official publication of the SCV's Educational Political Action Committee, in Sebesta's words, "explains why segregation is justified." A 2006 article in Southern Mercury decried the judicial and legislative milestones of the Civil Rights Movement, asserting that in the 1960s, "The cultural Marxists relentlessly hammered away at Western cultural norms using the sledge of anti-racism as a battering ram to bring down the walls of traditional Western culture."
Just last March, Boyd Cathey, a former member of the SCV's executive council, wrote in Confederate Veteran, "Southerners have understood perforce that the races must live and work side by side, and hopefully harmoniously, but that did not imply legal and social equality for all, either black or white."
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...ng-confederate-graves/277931/?utm_source=SFFB
continued in link
@tmonster @Mephistopheles @Melbournelad