Hillary on Bernie Sanders "Nobody likes him, he got nothing done"

[Professor Emeritus]

Unless Bernie drastically outperforms the polls, it doesn’t appear that the general public wants a leftist President.

Wrong.

Morning Consult: The 2020 U.S. Election

A few things from that poll:

Bernie has a 76% favorable rating, easily the highest of any candidate in the race. His unfavorable (17%) is the lowest out of any of the frontrunners

Bernie was polling 2nd. But he was the #2 choice of Biden supporters AND the #2 choice of Warren supporters. If you didn't have the Biden "electability" crowd then Bernie would likely be in 1st right now.

In a hypothetical matchup against Trump, Bernie leads by 4% right now. He ties Biden for the highest % support of anyone.


So if you claim the polls say the general public doesn't want Bernie, then you're saying the general public doesn't want anyone at all, cause no one is polling better than Bernie.

 

[Wild self]

The people that he is popular with young liberal upperclass whites and college kids are not reliable voters.

So why are they breaking records in donations? Why would anyone donate to a candidate they not gonna vote for!?

At least make sense on what you say. No one gonna donate hundreds of dollars to a person they not gonna vote for.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

He never had the power since he is an independent. He is usually fighting against the establishment you can't pass sweeping legislation alone.

This is Juelzian for not a damn thing

 

[Self_Born7]

The Dem party is falling before our eyes, the impeachment, infighting, the candidates they got stacked vs Trump
If the senate votes to bring witnesses to the trail its a wrap. we'll see how just wicked the dem party is, going back to all the scandals in Obama administration, and Killary's dirt she did at the state department and the Clinton Foundation.

I won't be surprised if they come out with another party, like the Tea Party

I dont fugg with any party, or even voted in a national election(including Barry Soetoro 2 terms) bc they dont have any of our interest. They all slaves to the international banks and Zionist. They're two feathers of the same bird. Once you open you eyes, you will see this shyt what it is, a farce.

 

[Booker T Garvey]

The Dem party is falling before our eyes, the impeachment, infighting, the candidates they got stacked vs Trump
If the senate votes to bring witnesses to the trail its a wrap. we'll see how just wicked the dem party is, going back to all the scandals in Obama administration, and Killary's dirt she did at the state department and the Clinton Foundation.

I won't be surprised if they come out with another party, like the Tea Party

I dont fugg with any party, or even voted in a national election(including Barry Soetoro 2 terms) bc they dont have any of our interest. They all slaves to the international banks and Zionist. They're two feathers of the same bird. Once you open you eyes, you will see this shyt what it is, a farce.

Democrats have another problem lurking that nobody's talking about - and that's the fact that they've pushed moderate democrats out

they've been calling people who've been democrats for 30 and 40 years nazi's and right wingers for 3 years now

there is no telling how they'll vote in November.

 

[Self_Born7]

Democrats have another problem lurking that nobody's talking about - and that's the fact that they've pushed moderate democrats out

they've been calling people who've been democrats for 30 and 40 years nazi's and right wingers for 3 years now

there is no telling how they'll vote in November.

also some of them are switching their party as well.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

Democrats have another problem lurking that nobody's talking about - and that's the fact that they've pushed moderate democrats out

they've been calling people who've been democrats for 30 and 40 years nazi's and right wingers for 3 years now

there is no telling how they'll vote in November.

Democrats increasingly have no idea how to win at politics. And the more they lose, the deeper they dig their heels into losing strategies

They need a lefty Lee Atwater to get them back on track

 

[storyteller]

Yes I know it would split the vote and give us more Trump

He wants to move the Democratic party to the left but the powerbrokers will only let him go so far. That's if he had complete control of the House and Senate...which he won't...definitely not the Senate.

His fans want him to be uncompromising. He can't get anything done without compromise because Republicans will stonewall everything he does. If he was a slick talker, it might work but he's not. He used the Dems to give himself a higher profile. The Dems can't control him so why would they let him run the party?

Not saying it's right but if I'm heading the DNC, I wouldn't want Bernie as the head of my party. He gets to use our brand without kissing the finger .

Fam I respect everything you said here, but as a Bernie supporter who kicks it with a ton of lefties and tries to be involved in events and discourse as much as possible, I do want to offer some responses.

So when you say he wants to move the party left, but the powerbrokers will only let him go so far, 100% true. They're going to do everything in their power to slow him down. But I think what we've seen from 2016 to now is a snowball effect. The momentum he started won't stop with him. Each member of the Squad is proof of that and the party as whole has already shifted left in terms of rhetoric and offerings. The 2016 platform for Bernie has played a big role in shaping two of the front runners' agendas (Warren and Bernie) while both Biden and Buttigeig (the moderate front runners) are to the left of Hillary with their platforms. So just the pressure that Bernie created has pulled the party further left than I think powerbrokers wanted.

On top of that, since the DNC blocked out any consultants from supporting progressives running against incumbent Dems, the lefties inspired by Bernie have had to develop their own infrastructure. So there's gonna be a parallel group of lefties who fundraise differently, strategize differently and approach power dynamics without having to bow to the typical party power structure...an example of this would be AOC refusing to contribute to the DCCC to support other campaigns, but instead she raised more money and created her own support system for the candidates she supports. The DCCC was stonewalling candidates that share her goals, so she supported those candidates with the money that the DCCC would have used to beat those people.

I don't agree that he used the Dems to give himself a higher profile, but it's open to debate. He's caucused with the Dems for a very long time and even heading into the 2016 elections he didn't actually intend to run. He was part of the draft Warren movement and only got in when Warren decided she wouldn't. His stated goal was to pull the party left and he succeeded there but he didn't take winning seriously until it was too late. Even he didn't expect this thing to blow like it did. And I attended a kickoff for him, it did not look like he'd blow like this. First event I attended had maybe 15 people present and then a few months ago the last event I attended was his return rally with AOC, 20,000 strong.

So I get that the idea is "he's using our brand but won't bend the knee" but because they've been trying to cut him out, new ways to organize and win elections have been building. Our Revolution, Justice Democrats, People's House Project and others are working to shift the Dems and bring in new blood. People 35 and under massively lean toward the progressive side of the Dems. The party is moving towards Bernie's side of things and I think that movement is going to continue. He might not win and they may get that block off, but the Boomer's will age out sooner than later and the progressives will have built their own structures to compete with the DNC's monopoly of party power.

Edit: Also while obstruction is likely for Bernie's whole agenda. I'd definitely say check out the American Prospect's Day One Agenda series where they spoke with campaigns and legal scholars about things the next president could pass without Congressional Approval. The biggest two imo were reducing drug prices and forgiving student debt. But there are strategies to get pieces of the platform passed even with Republicans and some Dems obstructing everything. Warren put out a strategy for student debt last week specifically and Bernie has alluded to the same concept as well.

 

[Professor Emeritus]

I equate them because they are both anti establishment populists.

Yes, Trump is "anti-establishment" when he's working hand-in-hand with the most cynical establishment politicians in the Republican party, keeps appointing the exact same lobbyists and dealmakers into power that have always been there, and often makes major decisions by just checking off names from lists that are handed to him.



Trump is fulfilling damn near EVERY one of the Republican establishment's biggest priorities. He cut taxes, increased military spending, went ultra pro-fossil fuels, refuses to touch gun control, dropped out of the agreements Obama signed, suddenly became full-on anti-abortion, is doing everything he can to kill Obamacare, filled the EPA with corporate lobbyists, appointed the exact Supreme Court Justices they wanted, and is constantly trying to eliminate all business regulation that he can. The ONLY shyt he does that's "anti-establishment" is take the erratic and offensive behavior too far, make idiotic decisions, and push the anti-immigration and racist shyt further than they were comfortable.

Outside of having the mentality and mannerisms of a teenager with a personality disorder Trump is a Republican establishment dream candidate.

 

[Elim Garak]

This is Juelzian for not a damn thing

I disagree but if that's what you wanna believe fair enough

 

[rapbeats]

Ok ill give you a few reasons.
1. He did a speech to a mostly black woman audience and didn't even give them or say what they wanted at all. They were not happy and walked away feeling he has no agenda for blacks
2. He is not for reparations
3. The brehs supporting him like Killer Mike are on payroll

lets address reparations. there was literally only 1 person that was truly talking about reparations and that was the lady peopled called crazy. M. Williamson. Remember her? I told yall then. If you're reparations or nothing. then yall better be supporting that lady like crazy. most of yall were not. so now here we are with the candidates we have left.
kamala is half black and she aint about that reparations life. another centrist corporatist dem. all of them are minus bernie and slightly Liz in some ways.
So as a black person, i could wake up on the day its time to vote and not go to the booth and would be welll within my rights due to the fact that non of them are supporting TRUE legit reparations. that is a fact. bernie included. Bernie is a Raise all tides type of thinker. he believes if we do things all the same for all people everything will be better for all.

here's the truth to that. he's right. it will be better for all of us. but where he's wrong is that the wealth gap between whites and blacks will get smaller. it wont. because if you raise us all up the same, the same gap will exist. thats just math. but you have to know who these people are based on their past. we know bernie. hes' been around for 100 years. old as dirt like you said. Because of that we know where he's coming from. personally, i dont think he's coming from a bad place to be honest. i think HE truly believes that if you do what i just stated everyone will be good or most will be good. Its almost as if he needs to see his experiment work and still see black people and brown folks with that same bad gap to go Ok, my thing only partially works, maybe we need to do something extra just for these people to cut down that gap.

But we all know, there isnt a politician alive that can say that to all these white people in america and actually win. there is no way in hell in 2020 white americans as a whole would vote for a white, black, latin, asian, etc candidate who told them "we will give reparations to black folks during my first term" he/she would not win. now is there some candidate who could get in there and be so well liked and we are doing so well economically as a country that they could Possibly convince white people to pay Reparations tax? Maybe.

So moving on.

Killer mike was supporting him in the beginning. killer mike aint just your average joe rapper. he was raised heavy in politics. its why he sounds like a natural when he's stomping for bernie or talking about politics. notice he doesnt sound like a random person just giving a random opinion. he has some family ties to being involved with politics as a kid( i didnt know this either at first). so saying he's on the payroll means nothing to me. what killer mike has said before bernie is the same stuff he's saying now. he also wishes bernie was down for reparations as well. but he gets it like i stated above. it is what it is. with that being said bernie is BY FAR the best candidate in regards to helping black people do a lot better in a lot of different areas. This narrative that he doesnt do things specifically for black people isnt true. he has a few policies that will directly effect black people. i dont care if it says "black policy" or Policy. as long as i know for a fact that it will be an extreme help in those areas. you can call it a green policy. again, america is still mostly white and we know its not mostly black. therefore, do not expect anyone to ever win the presidency talking about this and that for black people. aint going to happen. you know it, i know it. so lets stop asking for things we know wont happen. find another path to get what you want. let them sell it as an for everyone policy when we know good and well it will help mostly black folks because that problem they are discussing is mostly a problem that harms black people on a per capita basis (criminal justice reform).

and to your #1 speech he did to black women. those women were not listening to him at all and if its the same thing i think it is. its when they tried to boo him when he told them he was out there getting arrested during the civil rights era for the cause. how silly do you have to be to boo someone who was actually out there on the front lines with your mothers/fathers? it would be one thing if he did it as a political stunt. but he was too young to be in politics back then anyway. it would be one thing if you saw him change his tune over the past 30 or so years. but you havent. its the same dude preaching the same sermon about equality for all. something that guy actually believes in it seems. and remember his first run vs hil. he didnt bring up the fact he was out there during the civil rights movement. someone from his campaign found the photos of him getting arrested. and they were pushing him to tell people. they posted it online and people started realizing it was true it wasnt fake. and he wasnt pandering like all other candidates do especially when it comes to black folks. so the one time he mentions this truth. he gets booed as if he's pandering. right there you realize, Ohhhhh these black women are hilary voters('she's got next) voters. they may have wanted kamala at that point as well. but they were already set on not liking bernie when he walked in the room. he has policies speaking directly to their needs in certain areas(healthcare is one of them.) But to know this you have to pay attention to those policies and not the mainstream media narrative of bernie. those are two different things.

 

[rapbeats]

yall defended Cosby

Cosby has done more for the black community than the clintons have ever done. FACTS
Cosby also wasnt messing with kids. shoot we dont know if any of it was even true. as far as those women not knowing they were doing drugs and what not with cos.but lets say it was true. back to the first point. he wasnt messing with kids.

 

[Wildhundreds]

Yes, Trump is "anti-establishment" when he's working hand-in-hand with the most cynical establishment politicians in the Republican party, keeps appointing the exact same lobbyists and dealmakers into power that have always been there, and often makes major decisions by just checking off names from lists that are handed to him.



Trump is fulfilling damn near EVERY one of the Republican establishment's biggest priorities. He cut taxes, increased military spending, went ultra pro-fossil fuels, refuses to touch gun control, dropped out of the agreements Obama signed, suddenly became full-on anti-abortion, is doing everything he can to kill Obamacare, filled the EPA with corporate lobbyists, appointed the exact Supreme Court Justices they wanted, and is constantly trying to eliminate all business regulation that he can. The ONLY shyt he does that's "anti-establishment" is take the erratic and offensive behavior too far, make idiotic decisions, and push the anti-immigration and racist shyt further than they were comfortable.

Outside of having the mentality and mannerisms of a teenager with a personality disorder Trump is a Republican establishment dream candidate.

All fact, then big facts at the end..

 

[Professor Emeritus]

3. The brehs supporting him like Killer Mike are on payroll

That's pure slander. We did a thread back in 2016 listing endorsements, it came up with:

Cornell West
Ta-Nehisi Coates
Michelle Alexander
Keith Ellison
Benjamin Jealous
Erica Garner (Eric Garner's daughter)
Shawn King
Saul Williams
Killer Mike
Big Boi
Tyler the Creator
Bun B
Scarface
Styles P
Fat Tony
David Banner
Charlamagne Tha God
Meshell Ndegeocello
Reggie Watts
Danny Glover
Zoe Kravitz
Malcolm D. Lee
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
Michael Bennett
Wade Davis
Chad Johnson
Justin T. Bamberg (South Carolina State Rep. and lawyer for Walter Scott family)
Cezar McKnight (South Carolina State Rep.)
Joseph Neal (South Carolina State Rep.)
Wendell Gillard (South Carolina State Rep.)
Terry Alexander (South Carolina State Rep.)
Robert Williams (South Carolina State Rep.)
Gloria Tinubu (South Carolina State Rep.)
Bill Perkins (New York State Rep.)
James Sanders (New York State Rep.)
Vincent Ford (Georgia State Rep.)
LaDawn Jones (Georgia State Rep.)
Nina Turner (Ohio State Rep.)
Keelan Sanders (director of Mississippi Democratic Party)
Spike Lee
Lil' B


That was way back in Feb 2016 when he was just a relatively powerless US Senator and Clinton had spent years trying to secure every possible endorsement she could. I'm sure we could list ten times that many now that it's been four years. Bernie must be rolling with a massive payroll by your count.

 

[Wildhundreds]

lets address reparations. there was literally only 1 person that was truly talking about reparations and that was the lady peopled called crazy. M. Williamson. Remember her? I told yall then. If you're reparations or nothing. then yall better be supporting that lady like crazy. .

I wondered why black people didn't rally behind this woman..
Not that she would've won, but to show everyone unity behind what we really feel we should be getting..

Them basement dwellers that supposedly behind the ADOS movement is fcking things up..