I had no idea that Max Martin was fukking with the Weeknd. I should've known

[SirBiatch]

@SirBiatch

When he's talking about parallels between the repetitive content in both genres.

Is that what he meant by "musical content?" I thought he was talking about - in his words - "chord progressions, melodic development, compositional skill. We've been over this."

Can you two consult, figure out specifically what you wanna argue, and get back to me? I'm not into scattered convos.

 

[Quinton Barnes]

You're a cac. Like I said, you're applying your Rolling Stone musical-theory bullshyt to a genre you don't know shyt about.

Joke is, we Black people invent all the musical theory you end up dikkriding. When James Brown came out with the "on the one", that shyt flew in the face of musical theory. Cacs were like: 'this is discordant! There is no sense of melody'

Then James Brown goes on to influence everyone in the fukking world, and inspire hip hop from the same rebellious nutsack

Nice talking homie. I'll leave on the note that certain genres are superior at certain things over others. The only thing pop is superior at is being "come on, come all." Sometimes you'll get blinding genius like Michael Jackson. Most times, you'll get blinding basura like Miley. or Katy Perry. Who have both worked with your boy/dikkridee-du-jour: Max Martin.

But make sure to keep belittling hip hop on a hip hop forum. That'll work wonders.

Peace.

^^^And still no evidence at all. A nice anecdotal reference to James Brown, and claims that I am a 'cac' (the classic Coli argument - 'you don't agree with me? you must be white!!!1!). Hell no, not even close. Keep grasping at straws though.

Sheer stupidity at its finest.

 

[Quinton Barnes]

Is that what he meant by "musical content?" I thought he was talking about - in his words - "chord progressions, melodic development, compositional skill. We've been over this."

Can you two consult, figure out specifically what you wanna argue, and get back to me? I'm not into scattered convos.

You just linked two completely unrelated arguments and created a correlation where there was none.

 

[Mac Casper]

Is that what he meant by "musical content?" I thought he was talking about - in his words - "chord progressions, melodic development, compositional skill. We've been over this."

Can you two consult, figure out specifically what you wanna argue, and get back to me? I'm not into scattered convos.

There's nothing to argue SirBiatch . . there's just something to understand

 

[scuba]

wow... ok lets step back to the undeniable basics.

Hip Hop and Pop are musically extremely distinct and distant from each other.

Hip Hop is number one non melodic, Pop is melody driven
Hip Hop is generally non harmonic, Pop is heavily uses harmoney
Hip Hop is structurally based on 2 to 4 bar grooves, Pop is not groove based, and typically has a 8 bar cycle
Hip hop has no harmonic movement, Pop music is heavily based on harmonic movement via a few extremely common progressions
Hip Hop is alternating verse and chorus structure, Pop music structure is intro -> part A -> pre hook, -> chorus, -> part B -> chorus/bridge -> part A -> chorus/closing
Hip Hop is generally composed of non interacting layers, Pop music is composed of integrated instrumentation
Hip Hop hooks are call and response and/or chant driven, Pop music hooks almost always melody driven
Mixing wise Hip Hop is percussion and bass prioritized, Pop music is lead and rhythm prioritezed

Hip Hop is from a musical standpoint extremely different from pop...

now we get into intent and content... ahhh forget it yall aint even trying to talk facts

 

[SirBiatch]

There's nothing to argue SirBiatch . . there's just something to understand

The only thing I understand is that you and Quinton like pop music. Which is fine.

But I don't fukk with pop. I find it edgeless, grooveless and mind-numbing. That's why pop has to absorb ideas from everyone else who are actually pushing the boundaries. Pop is always desperate for cred and validation but is rarely prepared to do the hard work to get there. Hence this thread.

You're here trying to tell me that I should give a fukk about Max Martin when you should know the quintessential quote: "Rap is not pop. If you call it that, then stop."

Later.

ahhh forget it yall aint even trying to talk facts

That's the thing. They don't even know the facts. They're just making this shyt up as they go along.

 

[Mac Casper]

The only thing I understand is that you and Quinton like pop music. Which is fine.

But I don't fukk with pop. I find it edgeless, grooveless and mind-numbing. That's why pop has to absorb ideas from everyone else who are actually pushing the boundaries. Pop is always desperate for cred and validation but is rarely prepared to do the hard work to get there. Hence this thread.

You're here trying to tell me that I should give a fukk about Max Martin when you should know the quintessential quote: "Rap is not pop. If you call it that, then stop."

Later.



That's the thing. They don't even know the facts. They're just making this shyt up as they go along.

Wow . . I don't like pop music



I respect it

 

[ChezBippy]

fukk off

 

[Screwface Exchange]

Nice try with your attempt to uphold lowest common denominator music.

LOL at equating pop to "having a diverse taste in music." People who listen to pop heavy have the least diverse music tastes period.

All pop means is popular, if your listening to the top hip hop artists and songs, thats pop too. Drake he's pop, 50 cent he was pop. So dont be trying to go against pop like ur an underground head or a rebel, relax yourself brehs.

 

[Screwface Exchange]

dbl post

 

[Mac Casper]

All pop means is popular, if your listening to the top hip hop artists and songs, thats pop too. Drake he's pop, 50 cent he was pop. So dont be trying to go against pop like ur an underground head or a rebel, relax yourself brehs.

This

 

[scuba]

All pop means is popular, if your listening to the top hip hop artists and songs, thats pop too. Drake he's pop, 50 cent he was pop. So dont be trying to go against pop like ur an underground head or a rebel, relax yourself brehs.

This is not factually true. Pop music is not just popular music. Pop has a specific meaning as far as a musically genre goes. This is basic, basic stuff. You can search google, even Wikipedia will tell you that...

 

[DanielAlfredsson]

Let's be honest, most of the shyt he's done is shyt music, hit or not. Totally disposable. I do like the stuff with The Weeknd though.

 

[Quinton Barnes]

wow... ok lets step back to the undeniable basics.

Hip Hop and Pop are musically extremely distinct and distant from each other.

Hip Hop is number one non melodic, Pop is melody driven
Hip Hop is generally non harmonic, Pop is heavily uses harmoney
Hip Hop is structurally based on 2 to 4 bar grooves, Pop is not groove based, and typically has a 8 bar cycle
Hip hop has no harmonic movement, Pop music is heavily based on harmonic movement via a few extremely common progressions
Hip Hop is alternating verse and chorus structure, Pop music structure is intro -> part A -> pre hook, -> chorus, -> part B -> chorus/bridge -> part A -> chorus/closing
Hip Hop is generally composed of non interacting layers, Pop music is composed of integrated instrumentation
Hip Hop hooks are call and response and/or chant driven, Pop music hooks almost always melody driven
Mixing wise Hip Hop is percussion and bass prioritized, Pop music is lead and rhythm prioritezed

Hip Hop is from a musical standpoint extremely different from pop...

now we get into intent and content... ahhh forget it yall aint even trying to talk facts

A lot of valid points, but I disagree in some areas.

Hip-hop is not 'non-harmonic'. Hip-hop utilizes harmony, but tends to utilize static harmony or basic harmony, which is not different from a lot of popular music.
Popular music has been groove based for a long time. You can thank black artists like James Brown and jazz for that. Pop been about groove for a while.
Pop utilizes verse-chorus as well in a manner not dissimilar to hip-hop. The difference between the two genres in terms of 'structure' is actually not that significant.
'Integrated instrumentation' vs 'non-interacting layers'...can you elaborate on that?

Musically the biggest difference occurs in terms of rhythm, which is due to the heavy usage of syncopation and triplets. But that is nothing unique to hip hop. That comes from jazz (which is heavy on syncopation) which extends down to funk and has been incorporated in popular music. The rhythmic devices used in funk are more prevalent in hip-hop, and have also been used in popular music. Rhythm has now become just as important in popular music since it is a primary element in black music, and we all know the history of how much popular music "borrows" from black music.

Because these two genres have "borrowed" from the same sources, the musical elements themselves are not really dissimilar. I think the primary differences between the genres lie mostly in timbre and instrumentation. Two of the greatest things that hip hop culture introduced to the world are sampling and rapping. As well as eschewing melody (at least for vocalists, although a lot of hip-hop still incorporates melody in some shape or form).

Interesting. It's hard to deduce both genres down to these generic explanations.

 

[SirBiatch]

This is not factually true. Pop music is not just popular music. Pop has a specific meaning as far as a musically genre goes. This is basic, basic stuff. You can search google, even Wikipedia will tell you that...

assume nothing's too basic on The Coli.