If Africa must truly break from the shackles of the West (add china and russia) what must it do and is it too late

[Seoul Gleou]

They are working on that, Rwanda and Kenya dropped visa restrictions for all african nations.

i know. i'm just listing things the whole continent can do to catch up.

free flow of migrants in the continent would do wonders for the regional economy

 

[MikelArteta]

i know. i'm just listing things the whole continent can do to catch up.

free flow of migrants in the continent would do wonders for the regional economy

I agree. East africa is a start (east africa passport), can travel freely even with a national id from uganda,rwanda and kenya

I agree that one currency would help greatly as well. I'd also work on increasing tourism . I love visiting african countries. I'll be going to east africa for the third time since june in a few weeks. But when I'm there most tourists I come across are just cacs from germany and uk etc.

Also electricity, if nigeria had constant electricity they could easily be a much bigger tech hub.

 

[Jalether]

From Mao to Deng: China’s Changing Relations with the United States

What is the meaning of China’s rise? What are its consequences? Are China, the rising power and the world’s second largest economy, and the United States, the dominant power in the world, likely to chart a perilous course toward the “Thucydides’s Trap”? History alone does not provide direct...

www.wilsoncenter.org

The core truth about the rise of Asian/Arab countries is that Cold War politics played a determining role. After WW2, the US had the Marshall Plan for Western Europe. Kissinger and his ilk wanted to prevent the "Domino effect" with the spread of communism and encouraged the US/West to assist in prosperity for Asian nations as a counterweight.
Hence we got South Korea, Japan, the Philippines (to a certain extent), and then China--the factory of the world. The US literally forced the EU to help assist in China's prosperity. But like with capitalism, cheap labor and an insane level of profit threw a wrench.

Can Africa do it without such massive support and investment? Remains to be seen. The truth is, no nation has accessed world wealth and prosperity without the express & intentional backing of the US or EU. And when it comes to Africa, for those guys, we are just "permitted" to live there to safeguard cheap raw material access. ie African prosperity must never occur.

It's saddening, but a verifiable fact. That's why this new multipolar world might offer an opportunity to change that paradigm. But will African leaders seize this opportunity? Some are: Mali, Niger, and Burkina faso have formed a Union at their impulse (the first time in African History that countries came together to back each other up without an External power chaperoning)

Burkina Faso just signed a MOU with Russia for the construction of nuclear plants.

https://www.reuters.com/world/africa/burkina-faso-russias-rosatom-sign-agreement-nuclear-power-plant-2023-10-13/

If these leaders pull it off, it will be a game-changer for Africa and its future.

So you are essentially saying it's impossible for Africa to reach its full potential without the backing and approval of the West. That's depressing AF

 

[Jalether]

You might be right about religion, I won't take that away from you. But the tribalism part is a myth. It is very possible to be unified, as long as tribes are brought to an understanding that it can be competition but they are all a part of a whole, thus, whichever tribe loses sight of that goal they will be the bottom of the barrel so to speak.

In fact, I'd say that not giving the proper protagonism to different tribes is part of what hurts us in the long run. Prop up the positives of every tribe and shun the negatives of every tribe by forcing them to present what it is that they bring to the "national" table so to speak. You'll be amazed how far pride goes when the goal is only one.

As for going nuclear. If that should be done then it needs to be done in extreme secrecy. There are other ways of amassing power, the way of the nuclear power invites warfare with pretty obvious results.

Any war with the West, or China will weight far heavier on the continent with the most resources. So extreme finesse is the only way to go.

As for corruption...several African figures of Mao Zedong's caliber need to do what needs to be done. Leaders that believe in clean government, and strive to achieve it by any means necessary. Africa will need a lot of bloodshed to make that a reality since old habits die hard.

Action 4 will come about naturally as long as African governments stop intervening and actually fulfill their tasks. It's downright frightening how fast entrepreneurs can make miracles as long as government plays its role well.

I don't think you know how destructive tribalism is in Africa. they are extremely territorial and distrusting of outsiders. How will you even go about bringing proposals to the table with people who view those who live only a few hundred kilometers away as the enemy. You can't get them to trust and work with their fellow countrymen, goodluck getting them to open up to other Africans

 

[High Art]

So you are essentially saying it's impossible for Africa to reach its full potential without the backing and approval of the West. That's depressing AF

Personally, I'd say they would need the west if they want to do it in an equally fast or timely manner. It would take longer without the west.

 

[Steelo14]

So you are essentially saying it's impossible for Africa to reach its full potential without the backing and approval of the West. That's depressing AF

Not impossible, but will require a lot of creativity to overcome the hostility to African prosperity> Remember if African countries became wealthy, that would mean control and trading their raw materials which will have a devastating impact on world economies---hyperinflation as the price of everything rises to match the increased living standard.

Just look at how prosperity in China meant deindustrialization and lower quality of life for US/EU--add to that India, Latin America, Africa. You can see how they'd want to at least slow it down.

 

[MikelArteta]

Not impossible, but will require a lot of creativity to overcome the hostility to African prosperity> Remember if African countries became wealthy, that would mean control and trading their raw materials which will have a devastating impact on world economies---hyperinflation as the price of everything rises to match the increased living standard.

Just look at how prosperity in China meant deindustrialization and lower quality of life for US/EU--add to that India, Latin America, Africa. You can see how they'd want to at least slow it down.

 

[Steelo14]

One world power has to get out of the paint. Historically it's always been after some major conflict--from the Dutch Empire to the US empire taking over for the 99/2000--after the British empire collapsed following both world wars.

As it stands America is mirroring the path of the British Empire to the T. So we shall see.

 

[Jalether]

Not impossible, but will require a lot of creativity to overcome the hostility to African prosperity> Remember if African countries became wealthy, that would mean control and trading their raw materials which will have a devastating impact on world economies---hyperinflation as the price of everything rises to match the increased living standard.

Just look at how prosperity in China meant deindustrialization and lower quality of life for US/EU--add to that India, Latin America, Africa. You can see how they'd want to at least slow it down.

I agree

Unfortunately, instant gratification and not seeing the bigger picture is what Africa does best.

 

[Apollo Creed]

I can tell a lot of y'all aint been to African countries.

There is a ton of fundamental stuff that many refuse to get in line with, tossing nukes in the mix is just asking to destroy the continent.

 

[GrindtooFilthy]

It's an extremely complex issue ofcourse which requires a fully committed multipoint plan. Here's what I came up with

First it needs a major deprogramming from the traditional way of thinking and become more unified. Tribalism and religion is holding it back tremendiously, you can't be unified as a continent or country even when ethinicities within each country don't even get along. This is perhaps the biggest obstacle to overcome

Action 2 violently resist the West if need be and to do that, it must develop its own nuclear arsenal- This is the only way to resist the west and external influences, Yes the west will threaten sanctions and perhaps go through with it but Africa is resource rich enough to withstand sanctions

Nuclear disarmament: how Africa can play a role in securing a nuclear weapons free world

African states have an important role to play in promoting a total ban on nuclear weapons.

theconversation.com

"there are no nuclear weapons on the continent. South Africa, the only African nation to have had nuclear weapons, gave them up in 1989, and Libya stopped its nuclear weapons programme in 2003. Today, all African states bar South Sudan are members of the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons" You can see why no one is scared to come in and dominate any country in Africa

Action 3 get rid of the corrupt leaders and become a nation of laws, theres zero accountability in that continent and corruption has been deeply embedded into its culture

Action 4 Develop its infrastructure (electricity,roads,hospitals,schools,bridges,transport,banking,ecommerce etc) which are essential for a thriving economy and a developed society.

What Africa will look like in 100 years

As Africa's population looks set to quadruple over the twenty-first century, The Telegraph digs into the data to reveal the opportunities - and challenges - facing a fast-changing continent

s.telegraph.co.uk

some crazy stats
"Some 589 million people live without electricity in sub-Saharan Africa - meaning the majority of people rely on biomass to cook"
"Less than one in five African women has access to education - increasing their chances of contracting AIDS and not immunising their children"
"More than one million people die from malaria each year - mostly children under the age of five"


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Trash plan what must be done is a confederation you don’t see Japanese and Chinese throwing away their ethic heritage for some solipsistic unification that don’t exist.

I can actually go into detail about this

 

[Steelo14]

Trash plan what must be done is a confederation you don’t see Japanese and Chinese throwing away their ethic heritage for some solipsistic unification that don’t exist.

I can actually go into detail about this

Another major obstacle to overcome, besides Tribalism too, is going to be--and people won't like this--getting rid of Abrahamic religions. Besides Latin America no other continent on earth had to almost entirely discard their traditional beliefs like African nations did post-scramble.

Every country that's emerging has 1) High population growth 2) Successive visionary leadership; 3) 3)A true sense of self.

Complete nation-building with a clear definition of who they are, what values they represent and are willing to die for, etc-Religion is useful in bringing that along. Some of these principles intersect with ours, but they're limited to esoteric cultural practices as opposed to being fleshed out and distilled for the masses.

When you look at Africa and Africans, almost everything we defend has been imported. We don't have a clear consensus on who we are, what our philosophy is—everything we do is through someone else's prism. And it has made us weak, easy to divide and conquer.

 

[Amestafuu (Emeritus)]

Africans need nukes

this been my conclusion

but i don't dare speak in depth about it ...but i think anyone who thinking long and hard about the global pecking order understands that holding an arsenal is a valuable hand in the game of global affairs it's the pass to get left the fukk alone or at least given your space without intrusion. it's a stalemate and an assurance. i don't advocate ever using them but for so long as we are bringing bullets to a nuke fight we will be at the mercy of diplomacy... until it fails

can't get a seat at the big boy table without the big guns that's the reality of humanity.

 

[WIA20XX]

I got people in my own family that have ripped me off.
Blood.
There's nothing like getting stabbed in the back by family.

For the entire continent, all of the diaspora to coordinate, to not be parasitic?

That's a monumental undertaking....

But I think it can be done.

I don't think it will be top down though. Not some central planning committee at the OAU or anything like that. If there's any central planning done about the future of Africa, it's probably back room deals done between the Americans and the Europeans, and The Arabs and Chinese are in their own backrooms as well. The turkey never decides how to carve itself up.

Speaking of foreigners meddling in African Affairs, a lot of the richest people in Africa, are not African.
They are Syrians, Middle Easterners, Indians, families of the former colonziers. (Which is the same in Latin America with indigenous Latinos and Asia with indigenous Asians and the Chinese standing in for the white man, but I digress)

Now I'm not saying the continent needs to pull an Idi Amin



There are plenty of cases where instead of privatizing industry, nationalization was the better option.

What needs to happen is that the billionaires have to see greater benefit in industialization as opposed to just staying rich.

Something I read on that other site regarding a Black American Woman marrying into a rich Nigerian Family

The man in question is the one of the most corrupted public office holders in the history of my country.

I heard he owns Mikano generators. That’s why they don’t want to bring 24 hours electricity.

So we have a man/family making billions that's holding back a country from making tens of trillions.

I'm sure other cases can be found all over the continent.

The parasites at the top have to be seduced into giving up control of billions now, to make more billions later.

Armed Revolution is not enough.
Assassination is not enough.

It's getting them to think about the long game.

There's no reason that Coltan from the Congo, shipped through Rwanda, processed in China into cobalt, and then manufactured into cell phones which then get shipped right back to the Congo, at at least 7000X the price of the original ore.

If that work was done in the Congo, by Congolese miners, refiners, chip manufacturers, phone designers and manufacturers, phone retailers, and local telcom - all that money would circulate in that economy, and everyone that worked on it - would benefit.

But Tshisekedi and Kagame and their military and business elite of both countries would have to see the long term benefit.

Not for the country, but for themselves.

For Africa to thrive, the corrupt politicians/business people have to see what's in it for them.

Cause so-called Foreign Direct Investment - China n'nem setting up sewing factories - that's the Chinese moving low skill labor to new hands - not the transferring of the knowledge of the entire chain of value. If stuff stops getting made in Bangladesh and they move it to Kenya - those Kenyan seamstresses (or the local factory owner) aren't in a position to negotiate contracts with H&M and The Gap.

And you can repeat moving up the value chain with pretty much every country.

• Mali could be making warheads. (and fuel for nuclear reactors)
• Liberia could be making F1 tires (and every other type of tire)
• Botswana could be at the forefront of nanotubes and other things involving carbon
• Madagascar could have a vanilla cartel.
• You could even do this in the US with Black folks
  • Chicago and NYC have large financial centers, and presumably there are some black traders - a specialized middle and high school - any black kid that's good with fractions should be tracked into it from the 3rd grade.
  • DC should be sending all the knuckleheads into some type of defense contracting, on top of being in every position in the Federal Government
  • Houston South Park and 5th Ward and Southwest/Mo City should be creating oil field technicians and petroleum engineers (and aerospace)
  • etc

Africa is full of raw materials, but that's not wealth.

The real wealth is in the knowledge of making raw materials into finished goods (and distribution and sales and customer service and the financing and the accounting and the administration...etc)

Again, this is not gonna be some kum-buy-yah move where the people rise up, or something top down out of ECOWAS. That's fantasy.

It's gotta be in the interest of the political leaders, military leaders, and important business families.
And it's gotta be in the short term interest of the average person in those countries.

If I learn this, I get paid.
If I do this, I get paid.

Otherwise, they're gonna keep on blood sucking like the parasites that they are.

 

[Steelo14]

this been my conclusion

but i don't dare speak in depth about it ...but i think anyone who thinking long and hard about the global pecking order understands that holding an arsenal is a valuable hand in the game of global affairs it's the pass to get left the fukk alone or at least given your space without intrusion. it's a stalemate and an assurance. i don't advocate ever using them but for so long as we are bringing bullets to a nuke fight we will be at the mercy of diplomacy... until it fails

can't get a seat at the big boy table without the big guns that's the reality of humanity.

Before tht conflict in Gaza we watched Saudi Arabia basically throw Palestinians under the bus in an attempt to normalize relations with Israel in exchange for nuclear power stations for "civil" purposes amongst other things.

Anyone who doesn't see its importance is blind.