Is Quantum Physics bullshat?

[badhat]

So let's say we're headed out for lunch and we hit the same sandwich place. I get a meatball sub, you get an Italian with extra hots.

The bags come up with our orders, we give each other a nod, and we head back to our places of employment.

You get to your desk, open up the bag, and there's a meatball sub and a bag of chips in there.

So now, what happens is you have instant knowledge of what's in my bag. You have information about my sandwich state at superluminal speed, cause it doesn't matter if I caught the bus back, or a spaceship, you know by virtue of what you have in front of you.

Now, entangled particles don't work like sandwiches, but in terms of communication, it's comparable. You use the SG machine, see a spin up state, and you instantly know that my particle will be a spin down. We can't communicate with them, though.

 

[OsO]

Now, entangled particles don't work like sandwiches, but in terms of communication, it's comparable. You use the SG machine, see a spin up state, and you instantly know that my particle will be a spin down. We can't communicate with them, though.

Tell me more about the spin up and spin down states of particles. Is the name in reference to the actual lines of force/movement of energy of the particle?

 

[OsO]

the works of Copernicus, Kepler, Galileo, Newton etc all lead to a very clean intelligible mechanistic world
meaning given all the results of their experiments and observations one can expect almost anyone to come to their conclusions.
one can sort of see the empirical sprockets working their invisible magic in a fashion that remains consistent with the physical world we experience everyday; moreover, they set hard and fast rules for HOW THINGS WORK. But in the new quantum mechanics not only can't we see the sprockets, we don't even have rules on how to see them, we are still in the stage of collecting empirical data and hoping it can all be synthesized into a theoretical framework that still respects Newtonian physics or at least explain where they separate and still manage to work in the same world.

Sounds like a pseudoscience

 

[badhat]

Tell me more about the spin up and spin down states of particles. Is the name in reference to the actual lines of force/movement of energy of the particle?

No, it's a bit of a misnomer, but back in the early 20th Century, the measurements that they did seemed like elementary particles were spinning like in classical physics.

If everyone were to get together and decide to rename things from scratch, it probably wouldn't be called spin, but , that's the terminology we're stuck with.

 

[tmonster]

Sounds like a pseudoscience

Minus the process scientific...sure.

 

[ADevilYouKhow]

Is this a cac science?

 

[tmonster]

Now, entangled particles don't work like sandwiches, but in terms of communication, it's comparable. You use the SG machine, see a spin up state, and you instantly know that my particle will be a spin down. We can't communicate with them, though.

You are literally contradicting yourself in a single sentence
by definition the entangled experiment is one of communication, it can't be said any plainer
was Morse code communication?

 

[tmonster]

Whenever I can't give a direct answer I say I don't know or it's being looked into, pointing to benefits we already enjoy comes of like a sales pitch.

If you think I have tried to sell you on this stuff you are mistaken
this shyt is crack, it sells itself

To be honest with you the best part of QM for me is that we don't understand it within the context of having possessed a paradigm that seems to explain all.

What I tried to do is show you the attraction. You seem to think that this is where the conversation ends, I think it's where it begins.

 

[20Inch]

http://m.livescience.com/28550-how-quantum-entanglement-works-infographic.html

 

[badhat]

You are literally contradicting yourself in a single sentence
by definition the entangled experiment is one of communication, it can't be said any plainer
was Morse code communication?

No, not really.

1. There are obvious differences with a sandwich and an entangled particle, but in terms of communication, the analogy holds.

2. And that analogy is one where information cannot travel faster than the speed of light in either case. No contradiction.

Morse code is communication because you can choose to send a dot or a dash. You're going to get a state up or down that will statistically correlate to the basis vectors we agree to measure it by. But you can't make yours a spin up state and force mine to be a spin down instantly. That would be faster than light communication. You're going to observe it and get a random state. Furthermore, when you see it's a spin down, you don't know that it's because you just observed it and caused quantum decoherence, or if I had already observed mine and made yours a spin down by virtue of mine being spin up.

 

[20Inch]

"When observed, Photon A takes on an up-spin state. Entangled Photon B, though now far away, takes up a state relative to that of Photon A (in this case, a down-spin state). The transfer of state between Photon A and Photon B takes place at a speed of at least 10,000 times the speed of light, possibly even instantaneously, regardless of distance"

From the link I posted before. If you observe proton A, proton B changes giving you a basic form of binary, 1s and 0s, therefore comunication.

 

[badhat]

Okay, I explained how this is wrong in my previous post, but let's go ahead.

We're on two spaceships, lightyears apart. Let's pretend that there's a yes/no question that I had asked before we started heading in opposite directions, "Does planet X have suitable conditions for life?" You get there and see that the answer is yes.

We also have two entangled particles and the requisite Stern-Gerlach machines needed to choose a z-basis and get a spin from those particles, so they'll print out "up/down", "yes/no", "1/-1", whatever.

How are you getting that message to me? You don't get to choose which spin you observe, you can't pick "no" and have "yes" appear in mine.

 

[tmonster]

Morse code is communication because you can choose to send a dot or a da

in the entangled experiment does the experimenter choose when to change the state of, say, "photon a", in order to demonstrate the entangled effect on photon b?

 

[tmonster]

Okay, I explained how this is wrong in my previous post, but let's go ahead.

We're on two spaceships, lightyears apart. Let's pretend that there's a yes/no question that I had asked before we started heading in opposite directions, "Does planet X have suitable conditions for life?" You get there and see that the answer is yes.

We also have two entangled particles and the requisite Stern-Gerlach machines needed to choose a z-basis and get a spin from those particles, so they'll print out "up/down", "yes/no", "1/-1", whatever.

How are you getting that message to me? You don't get to choose which spin you observe, you can't pick "no" and have "yes" appear in mine.

This is pretty easy and relies on exactly the current accepted notion that these entangled states are shared immediately
ready...(I'm a legit genius for this one by the way)

you ready

Spoiler

TIME
Use a series of photons and the timing of state changes observed on the other side can be used to code for specific information

Spoiler

 

[tmonster]

and FYI
I assumed this was such a simple idea that one need not even patent it