NBA Midseason Media Survey

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

If a guy has done at a comparable level as the other guy but for twice as long. Then why in the world would the guy who's been doing it for half the amount of time have such a big edge? He's not considerably enough better to have that kind of edge.

Eight years worth of passing is enough to compare Jokic to anyone. He doesn't need to play x-amount more years to be compared or considered better than Bron.

Magic only played 12* seasons and folks call him the greatest passer to ever play, and yet Bron is going to play for nearly twice as long, and that won't change some of those folks' opinions on Magic still being the best passer.

You don't get longevity points when scaling passing.

And how you gonna flip flop like that? A couple of years ago you were saying Jokic wasn't on Bron's level as a passer. Now it's Jokic makes passes that you haven't seen from Bron

This is what I said a couple years ago (Sep. 2020) -

I'm going with Jokic, simply because he's able to make passes from greater angles due to his height, and relies less on physical aid (running and jumping). I still don't think he's shown enough where he can run an offense better than Bron though.

I specifically said Jokic was the better passer back then.

You're getting confused with me talking about running the offense (which is more than just passing), which at the time Jokic didn't have a large enough sample size to be considered better than Bron.

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

I took a snapshot of the odds 2 weeks ago and to be honest, nothing has really changed (at least on FanDuel). +200 going one way at most, but most guys were already pretty close in top 3 for everything outside of ROY.

Still, as of this morning…if you picked everyone the media just did, $10 parlay wins you $3,000…

Not much has changed over the last couple of weeks (except JJJ in the DPOY race), but Poole for most of the season was favorite for 6th man and now he's out to +350 - +500 in most places, which if Steph and Klay end up staying healthy, his odds should only come in from this point forward. For whatever reason, the media aren't really fukking with Westbrook and have pretty much made Poole their default pick despite how inconsistent he's been.

That's what makes Poole's odds great because the media deems him the favorite despite the books believing he's not.

For what it's worth, I posted this before the season started -

If you're able to contact your book/agency, put in a request to see what price they're willing to give you for Westbrook 6th Man of the Year. You'll be able to get out in front of them setting the odds around the preseason games, should the Lakers experiment with him coming off the bench.

You would've got at least +5000
Now he's as low as -110.

You would've made a healthy profit if you ended up cashing out now on that.

 

[steph_harden]

Eight years worth of passing is enough to compare Jokic to anyone. He doesn't need to play x-amount more years to be compared or considered better than Bron.

Magic only played 12* seasons and folks call him the greatest passer to ever play, and yet Bron is going to play for nearly twice as long, and that won't change some of those folks' opinions on Magic still being the best passer
You don't get longevity points when scaling passing.

This is what I said a couple years ago (Sep. 2020) -

I specifically said Jokic was the better passer back then.

You're getting confused with me talking about running the offense (which is more than just passing), which at the time Jokic didn't have a large enough sample size to be considered better than Bron.

Bron
Magic
Jokic

All comparable passers. I’m comfortable calling them 3 of the 5 best passers of all time. The only difference is Bron has twice the volume as the other guys. So why am defaulting to Jokic?

Why wouldn’t longevity points matter if you did it on a similar level but way longer? Jokic would have to be a vastly superior passer to overcome that. And I don’t see any evidence of that. Yea Jokic has the edge on some of his passes due to his size but who do you know that can thread the needle like Bron? Who manipulates the ball like Bron? Pocket passes?

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

Bron
Magic
Jokic

All comparable passers. I’m comfortable calling them 3 of the 5 best passers of all time. The only difference is Bron has twice the volume as the other guys. So why am defaulting to Jokic?

Volume only matters up to a certain point.

Accomplishment/accolade narratives has fukked up your head, thinking that someone can only be a better passer by doing it for a longer period of time.

Why wouldn’t longevity points matter if you did it on a similar level but way longer?

Because Bron's longevity hasn't resulted in him making passes that he hasn't largely always done. Running an offense is something where longevity matters, which is what you're getting confused with here.

Jokic would have to be a vastly superior passer to overcome that. And I don’t see any evidence of that.

Then you need to watch more games or remove whatever bias you have here.

As I've stated:

He's 7ft (he can see over defenses and pass over players to a greater degree)
He has bigger hands and a longer wingspan (he can manipulate the ball and get it to spaces and players than Bron can't)
And most importantly, he has greater touch, which allows him to do things with the ball that Bron can't.

Now, all those things are important here because they wouldn't be on their own if he didn't have the imagination/creativity to go along with them.

 

[steph_harden]

Volume only matters up to a certain point.

Accomplishment/accolade narratives has fukked up your head, thinking that someone can only be a better passer by doing it for a longer period of time.

Because Bron's longevity hasn't resulted in him making passes that he hasn't largely always done. Running an offense is something where longevity matters, which is what you're getting confused with here.

Then you need to watch more games or remove whatever bias you have here.

As I've stated:

He's 7ft (he can see over defenses and pass over players to a greater degree)
He has bigger hands and a longer wingspan (he can manipulate the ball and get it to spaces and players than Bron can't)
And most importantly, he has greater touch, which allows him to do things with the ball that Bron can't.

Now, all those things are important here because they wouldn't be on their own if he didn't have the imagination/creativity to go along with them.

“better touch” that’s debatable and subjective

And lol at “watch more games”… Ive got twice as much evidence as you. I can show you more vids of Bron making passes that you’ve never seen Joker do than what you‘ve got for me.


And I didn’t even say Bron was a better passer…I said they were comparable. I said they were on the same tier. Do you think it’s logical to place a dude with comparable skills but with half the output over the dude who has twice the output? That’s all im asking

Or are you saying that Jokic is actually on another tier altogether