"Old" Nas vs "New" Nas?

[DANJ!]

I feel like even though Nas is largely praised by newer artists, he's kinda going thru the same thing Rakim went through during the 90s. Lemme explain...

In the mid/late '90s, nikkas like Nas, Jay, Wu-Tang, Buckshot, Canibus, etc. gave props to Rakim all day. BUT, Ra's peak years had already happened. The most he could do is just put out good records (once he resurfaced), but it was never gonna be like those "Eric B Is President"/"Follow The Leader"/"Paid In Full" type joints. That urgency and importance those songs had weren't being matched by his newer stuff. He hadn't really lost a step, but he hadn't gained any either. On top of that, there was a new era in rap going on and he didn't really fit in there... it was like he made joints good enough to pop up on the radar, but even a nikka like Noreaga was more in-demand at the time cause there was a new wave going on. Even as the older heads and journalists weren't ready to stop holding him (and others from his era) in regard as the greatest of all-time, rap was moving on and new greats were entering that GOAT contention.

Now when you look at a Nas, it's hard to put him in with the Kendricks and J.Coles and Drakes, even though they themselves draw inspiration from stuff Nas did in his prime. The mid-90s/early-2000s is to him what the late-80s/early-90s was to Rakim. It's that time during which he earned his spot in the GOAT conversations... but the new songs are just new songs.

 

[I.AM.PIFF]

@Ziggiy the goat

 

[up in here]

New nas is the old nas. Peep it, there has been 3 Nas albums where he has really given you insight to his life and his mentality. Illmatic, Gods Son and Life Is Good. Those three albums are Nas' most personal and introspective. Those three albums are the same Nas, you can play them back to back and really hear his journey from his life in the PJs, into the industry to where he is now. I know Stillmatic shares the namesake as illmatic but conceptually Gods Son and Life Is Good are much more aligned with the overriding theme of illmatic, which is the story of a young man from the projects trying to find his way through life.

Then you have concept album Nas with IWW, HHID, Untitled and Distant Relatives. This is Nas focused on particular concepts through an entire project. Although the subjects vary, the focus is the same on all four albums. This is where Nas digs deep to present a complete project with its own individual style and mood. This is concept nas. And while every single Nas album has a concept, these four stand out as his most complete stand alone concept albums.

Then you have the rapper nas. The albums that fit this version are I am..., Nastradamus, Stillmatic, SD. Its not always introspective or focused but this is where nas has his most creative freedom from song to song.

 

[criminology]

It's cuz the psychic vampire Kelis was sapping his vital essence. Once she left he got his enthusiasm back. LIG is the first time he has sounded inspired (except a few tracks here and there) since Gods son.

 

[10:31]

Rick Ross featuring your favorite rappers favorite rapper aka 90s Nas

TRIPLE BEAM DREAM









that is all

 

[The Dust King]

if you really think about it, when it looks like Jay is going to have a wack album, there's about 3-4 classic songs on it that save it from being wack, even Kingdome come (Lost Ones, Oh My God, kingdome come, Minority Report) So really in a way Charlamagne is right on that...

nah. ill give you lost ones and oh my god but kingdom come is weak. dope beat and hook but them rhymes is azz.

album is still weak as fuk which = wack to me. apply your logic to best of both worlds one and two, or blueprint 2.

and charlamagne is wrong but thas nuthin new.

 

[The Dust King]

SD went platinum without a large single. No, it did not get counted twice, the album is under 100 mins total.

Need proof? Here's some directly from billboard:

Billboard - Google Books

brother you are wrong. first SD had many singles and two large ones.

just a moment was big. thiefs theme was out there and he had tri-state area spins for "suicide bounce" and "you know my style"

second I said nas sales slump started beforehand and I was correct.

godson went platinum in less than a month. it came out mid-december and was plat in mid january.

SD came out in november and took a year to get plat and it was a double album.

hiphop is dead was on defjam had more promotion than I could remember, he had controversy but two years later he wasn't plat yet.

hence the next album after HHID he said "fuk y'all h0e nggaz, ill go gold wit it"

 

[Budda]

Nas lost his breath control and project inflections. He also made the mistake of starting to pick his own beats. And finally he lost the sphere of influence and content like he had in the 90s with Big, Jay, and Raekwon to draw from (which he admitted to).

Not to mention, you have your whole life to make your first album. And you don't have any expectations placed on you, which gives you complete creative license. IWW was good but nikkas wasnt ready to see Nas in tight pink suits. So then from that I feel like he felt a little trapped creatively. Couple that with the game weakening and killing his creative spirit, and the simple fact that dude has been in the game for over 20 years, it seems pretty obvious what the deal is. Everybody falls off. The key is to do your thing when it's your time, which I think Nas did. I haven't checked for a new Nas disc since... Stillmatic? Streets Disciple was the beginning of the falloff.

You know when your a GOAT when you can 'fall off' and still be better than every other rapper living

 

[Budda]

It's cuz the psychic vampire Kelis was sapping his vital essence. Once she left he got his enthusiasm back. LIG is the first time he has sounded inspired (except a few tracks here and there) since Gods son.

He sounded pretty inspired on Untitled tbh. You can't tell me you listen to a track like 'America' of Untitled and say he was uninspired.

 

[TheJet]

I hear you.

But why do you think he's lost so much of the support he had durin' that crazy run from '94-'99? A lot of cats may not remember, but he was the standard for what you were "supposed" to be as an MC. Other cats came in later during that period and started to kinda take on that role too. But Nas was the one that everyone was try'na be like. There's no denying that. I remember Royal Flush sayin' one time that NY was "Nas and a bunch of little Nas's" back in '95.

A lot of artists grow, but what do you think happened to Nas' following? Tonight, I saw eras of his career playin' out in front of veteran Hip Hop lovers, and you could see the divide between his more recent work in how they reacted compared to his older more classic shyt. Did all of his original fans abandon him, leaving him with newer cats in lower numbers that missed the era when he basically ruled shyt?

I think to answer your question simply, first he doesn't fit into what the powers that be (via com, clear channel) ) are forcing down everyone's throats. Mindless 808,catchy hook driven anthems for middle schoolers to do hoodrat stuff to with their friends. Trinidad James, Migos, French Montana, and whatever flavor or the weak rapper is all over your airwaves and it's being consumed like it's on the dollar menu. The number of people who want to sit down and have a real meal (or who can appreciate that meal)has fallen off drastically. Nas doesn't follow trends and his popularity is suffering for it.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Not trying to hate but new Nas is boring to me. I can definitely see why crowds dont fukk with his newer albums. From the flow to the content to the beats to the overall engery, I just don't get the same old feeling as I did with him in the mid 90s. I'll admit he does show glimpses of his former self but not enough to hold my interest. I bought illmatic and it was written the day they were released but when he drops new albums I barely care anymore. I still listen but it mostly all sounds the same to me, boring. I know the same can be said for most MC's from his era but he was pretty much the gold standard of MC at the time so I'm more critical. I respect that he wanted to grow and mature in his style but I say why mess with perfection. I think he would have a lot more fans, mainly his old fan base, if he just stayed spitting the same braggadocious and raw shyt. I remember buying albums strictly off the strength of a Nas verse.

This.

I think that’s pretty much the consensus with his OG fans. I was one of those kids that went out and copped Illmatic and It Was Written the first day they dropped too, so I remember how it was back then with Nas and how the city felt when he dropped new music. Most people didn’t even know his new album was out last year, when it dropped. I’m talkin’ DJ’s and other Hip Hop heads I know. I think it seems like his older fans are expecting the same level of quality from someone they held up so high. I think a newer fan who’d say that he’s still bringing the same quality of music, and they’re someone who might not be able to speak on impact, because they weren’t around 14-17 years ago, when this guy ruled and couldn’t miss!

Nas being “boring” now is something that I hear a few times a week from people who I know used to worship this dude. I can agree that the energy that used to carry his music, is all but gone. Questlove said that if you became a Nas fan after “Ether”, then you’re not “a true Nas fan”, but more of “an anti-Jay-Z” person. I remember how people used to speak about him right before that. Everyone said he was done, this is including the same people that call him the GOAT now. Overnight fans. “Ether” had a lot of us thinkin’ that the energy would return, but his albums haven’t really lived up to what people thought would happen after that.

We always cite “growth”, but I never understood what that had to do with content. PE didn’t lose their energy or fanbase due to being political or speakin’ on current events or inequalities in America. They were potent! To say that Nas is just as good as he’s always been seems kinda delusional. When I have this conversation with his OG fans, I get old tracks thrown at me that make me think that Nas definitely made some kinda turn somewhere, and maybe that’s whats lost him so many fans.

 

[Awesome Wells]

I think to answer your question simply, first he doesn't fit into what the powers that be (via com, clear channel) ) are forcing down everyone's throats. Mindless 808,catchy hook driven anthems for middle schoolers to do hoodrat stuff to with their friends. Trinidad James, Migos, French Montana, and whatever flavor or the weak rapper is all over your airwaves and it's being consumed like it's on the dollar menu. The number of people who want to sit down and have a real meal (or who can appreciate that meal)has fallen off drastically. Nas doesn't follow trends and his popularity is suffering for it.

Cole doesn't do any of those things. Yet, we've seen him go Gold and get love from tons of legends recently. He's about as Hip Hop as it gets.

Kendrick doesn't do any of that either. Dude is platinum. There's always been wack shyt being pushed by "the powers that be". Nas thrived during a time when Hip Hop was at its worst with pushin' ghetto materialistic and catchy themes. So I don't know if we can use that as the reason why he's not doing what he used, to by way of being dominant today.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Nas lost his breath control and project inflections. He also made the mistake of starting to pick his own beats. And finally he lost the sphere of influence and content like he had in the 90s with Big, Jay, and Raekwon to draw from (which he admitted to).

Not to mention, you have your whole life to make your first album. And you don't have any expectations placed on you, which gives you complete creative license. IWW was good but nikkas wasnt ready to see Nas in tight pink suits. So then from that I feel like he felt a little trapped creatively. Couple that with the game weakening and killing his creative spirit, and the simple fact that dude has been in the game for over 20 years, it seems pretty obvious what the deal is. Everybody falls off. The key is to do your thing when it's your time, which I think Nas did. I haven't checked for a new Nas disc since... Stillmatic? Streets Disciple was the beginning of the falloff.

Good post.

Faith Newman, who I've known for years, and who signed Nas initially, said a couple years back, that "Nas has lost his ears in not allowing the right people in the studio with him". She spoke about his beat selection, and how he sounds like he's lost inspiration, and almost seems like a shadow of his former self. Premier said that he was try'na get Nas to do the whole album thing with him, but Nas never got around to committing to it. He does appear to be in some sort of funk. And I think it may be harder for a newer fan to see that, if they only know him this way and weren't around to see the impact that he had back in the day.

If you weren't there for those years, like literally growing up on his music, then your standard for him is naturally gonna be lower than an OG fan's. You can go back and listen to the records, but it's never gonna be like actually be there for when they dropped. It's no one's fault, but if you don't know what you're missin', then you might not be able to see why people are sayin' he fell off or whatever. I just don't get what happened or when it did.

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

Good post.

Faith Newman, who I've known for years, and who signed Nas initially, said a couple years back, that "Nas has lost his ears in not allowing the right people in the studio with him". She spoke about his beat selection, and how he sounds like he's lost inspiration, and almost seems like a shadow of his former self. Premier said that he was try'na get Nas to do the whole album thing with him, but Nas never got around to committing to it. He does appear to be in some sort of funk. And I think it may be harder for a newer fan to see that, if they only know him this way and weren't around to see the impact that he had back in the day.

If you weren't there for those years, like literally growing up on his music, then your standard for him is naturally gonna be lower than an OG fan's. You can go back and listen to the records, but it's never gonna be like actually be there for when they dropped. It's no one's fault, but if you don't know what you're missin', then you might not be able to see why people are sayin' he fell off or whatever. I just don't get what happened or when it did.

The last point is something I always struggle with. Mite make a thread about it.

 

[Awesome Wells]

The last point is something I always struggle with. Mite make a thread about it.

Word.

I've met people that say they can't get into Resurrection, and that they startin' messin' with Common on Be. A lot of cats I know who are younger than me, say they dig Hell on Earth a lot more than they do The Infamous. And when you really look at it, it's mostly due to when they got into the music.

It's the same with Nas. You see his newer fans sayin' things like, "but he doesn't have to speak about money, chicks and cars and all that". They're not in the know. This is what made up 85% of his lyrics when he was on fire. They know a different Nas, so they can't gauge any difference between what he does now and what happened before. They kinda can't see why people are sayin' he's lost somethin'.