Penn State Study From 2021: How West Indians Practiced Housing Discrimination Against Black Americans To Rise In New York City

[Barlow]

fukk these nikkas

she wrote another study that details how they primarily helped other west indians

https://www.nyulawreview.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/NYULawReview-89-1-Brown.pdf

Yet, in all of this analysis, Haynes and others overlook a crucial advantage that West Indians had, and which made these stories of dominance possible: access to capital. Supporting the viewpoint that West Indians’ access to capital was central in completing the story of their business dominance, subsequent commentators have been crit-ical of Haynes’s contention that West Indians did not have an advan-tage in relation to African Americans in accessing capital. For example, sociologist Roger Waldinger argues that West Indians financed their early foray into the housing markets “through rotating credit associations” or “susus.”98

These susus were “imported with them from the islands.”99 Susus were essentially informal banking mechanisms, undergirded entirely by West Indian networks that were only able to function because the tight-knit community ensured that participants did not default.100 Similar mechanisms have been dis-cussed by Cao and Posner in the context of Korean, Cantonese, and Japanese communities.101 Susus appear to have been ubiquitous in West Indian migrant society from the early 1900s, “[f]rom the daily domestic worker [to] the sleep-in maids, the elevator operator, to the factory worker, from the porter to the government servant, the migrants got together to form their ‘susus’ . . . .”102 Thus, a narrative that seeks to explain West Indian success in the United States, but which ignores the very mechanisms through which this success was funded, fails to provide a complete narrative.

Amy Jacques Garvey, the second wife of Marcus Garvey, confirmed the signficant role that rotating credit associations played in financing early West Indian businesses.107 There is also evidence that community-based informal credit associations later evolved into formal financial institutions, facilitating even higher levels of home and business ownership. This, for example, was the genesis of the Paragon Credit Union in Brooklyn, which pro-vided loans for its West Indian members to purchase homes.108 Larger
and more ambitious financial entities are also believed to have their genesis in informal savings arrangements. For example, the United Mutual Life Insurance Company—at one point one of the largest Black-owned enterprises in New York—developed from a burial society, namely, an informal credit association formed to subsidize funeral costs, consisting of mostly West Indian members.109 Similarly, West Indians were instrumental in the formation of Carver Federal Savings Bank—later the largest Black-owned financial institution in the United States—which was founded in part to provide capital for customers of West Indian realtors.110

 

[Barlow]

@Barlow nikkas is out here unhinged man. i shouldn’t have even make the thread

 

[Kiyoshi-Dono]

Hairlines using chatgp as a basis for an argument against actual literature
So many undercovers on this platform
Truly not like us

 

[Blessings]

A.I. is not an effective means of arguing against points. You want to be effective, use the actual source or use experts talking about the source. A.I. is not an expert, and is incapable of understanding the nuiances of any argument, nor the cultural implications of any argument. It can't even determine if what it is relaying is correct.

"As of 2023, a typical AI model isn't assessing whether the information it provides is correct. Its goal when it receives a prompt is to generate what it thinks is the most likely string of words to answer that prompt. Sometimes this results in a correct answer, but sometimes it doesn’t – and the AI cannot interpret or distinguish between the two. It’s up to you to make the distinction.

AI can be wrong in multiple ways:

• It can give the wrong answer
• It can omit information by mistake
• It can make up completely fake people, events, and articles
• It can mix truth and fiction"

So no, using A.I. to prove a point is not being intelligent, it is being wholy ignorant of the limits of A.I.

2023… It's 2025

Failed to dispute anything posted

Copied and pasted some BS that's not applicable.

OP was literally just using AI the other week.

https://www.thecoli.com/threads/i-am-a-foundational-black-american-ryan-coogler.1080726/post-55556310

Slimy ass nikkas in here tryna gaslight you in defense of a well-known c00n, nasty work.

Saw the same post with the markdown formatting from AI.

They would rather conform to anti-black rhetoric and make up some BS about AI...than address the BS OP posted

 

[im_sleep]

using ai to get a quick list of pan africanist contributions from black americans is not the same as using ai to attempt to accurately internalize and digest a highly detailed study that covers multiple decades and events of a situation.

you can’t be that dumb like this fr

You used an AI-generated list to back an argument you couldn’t fully articulate on your own and which was easily debunked.


Not even going to get into you purposely skewing information and flat out lying to push an agenda in this thread and others.

 

[HimmyHendrix]

Hairlines using chatgp as a basis for an argument against actual literature
So many undercovers on this platform
Truly not like us

i’ve accepted it already they rather fabricate than just admit there’s a problem

 

[Conan]

I read the essay.

It's a very good essay. It's not at the level of something you would publish in a journal, because it does make a bunch of assertions without enough underlying stats or references. Too many anecdotal stories. The author does state that this is still a work in progress. I would say this is a great idea for a dissertation or a journal paper if more work is put into it. I did enjoy reading it.

Takeaways?

@HimmyHendrix is full of shyt.

I'll explain

Here is @HimmyHendrix's statement from the first post of this thread:

Cliffs: Cash-Rich West Indians use sponsors from home, migrant loans, and “covering” (white passing in ethnic form) to overpay white property owners for real estate in NYC then denied housing opportunities to people who weren’t from their ethnic groups for most of the 20th century.

This is already known to most real New Yorkers. How areas that were once occupied by Black Americans became West Indian over time. A form of ethnic cleansing.

@HimmyHendrix was betting that very few people would actually take the time to read the essay in full. He was right. Because there should have been much more pushback against the bolded.

Now I'm only going off of what was published in the essay.

First of all, the essay makes it very clear that up until the 1920s, the resident black population in New York was very small, around 3%. This was surprising to me, and I'm actually going to dig more into this on my own time. The explosion in the black population came simultaneously from the great migration from the South, and from Black Caribbean immigrants.

So off the rip, what areas were "ethnically cleansed" by Black Caribbeans over time, if both African Americans from the south, and Black Caribbeans, arrived en masse into NYC at the same time?

Second, I do not see anywhere in the essay where it states or implies that Black Caribbean realtors and home owners denied housing opportunities to African Americans. That is a strong accusation. According to the essay, the massive discrimination was white realtors and homeowners against black people, no matter the origin.

Because of the unique advantages possessed by Black Caribbean immigrants (cash heavy, prior experience breaking into racial monopolies in their home countries) they had a better chance at breaking into white neighborhoods than African Americans.

This is NOT an indictment on African Americans, a generation removed from chattel slavery, with little experience in ownership due to the failure of Reconstruction and the following terrorism unleashed by Jim Crow, failed by a country who owed and still owes them an uncountable debt. Even with the odds against them they were able to establish themselves in New York and rise up the ladder. I have nothing but the utmost respect and honor for their history. In this topic, they were just disadvantaged compared to Black Caribbeans, who used "first mover advantage" to entrench themselves faster. But nowhere do I read that Black Caribbeans then turned around and shut African Americans out. Also, that would be economically retarded.

Reading the essay, my anger isn't at Black Caribbeans... It's at white people who had neighborhood property covenants preventing African Americans across the country from buying property. It's at white people who didn't ensure that Black Americans were put on a solid footing after the end of slavery with full recompense and damages in terms of land and capital. It's at white people who made the South a living hell, forcing an internal migration of people who arrived at the footsteps of New York and Detroit and Chicago with nothing but the clothes on their back.

Trust someone like @HimmyHendrix, a professed hater of blacks who are not African American, a PAWG lover, AND a self proclaimed Piru , to skip all of this and point the finger at Black Caribbeans and accuse them of Ethnic Cleansing, an allegation the paper didn't even make? I'm not sure what beef he has against Africans and Caribbeans in America but I promise you whatever grievances you have with them PALE compared to the beef you should have with the white man (who you adore for some reason).

 

[HimmyHendrix]

I read the essay.

It's a very good essay. It's not at the level of something you would publish in a journal, because it does make a bunch of assertions without enough underlying stats or references. Too many anecdotal stories. The author does state that this is still a work in progress. I would say this is a great idea for a dissertation or a journal paper if more work is put into it. I did enjoy reading it.

Takeaways?

@HimmyHendrix is full of shyt.

I'll explain

Here is @HimmyHendrix's statement from the first post of this thread:



@HimmyHendrix was betting that very few people would actually take the time to read the essay in full. He was right. Because there should have been much more pushback against the bolded.

Now I'm only going off of what was published in the essay.

First of all, the essay makes it very clear that up until the 1920s, the resident black population in New York was very small, around 3%. This was surprising to me, and I'm actually going to dig more into this on my own time. The explosion in the black population came simultaneously from the great migration from the South, and from Black Caribbean immigrants.

So off the rip, what areas were "ethnically cleansed" by Black Caribbeans over time, if both African Americans from the south, and Black Caribbeans, arrived en masse into NYC at the same time?

Second, I do not see anywhere in the essay where it states or implies that Black Caribbean realtors and home owners denied housing opportunities to African Americans. That is a strong accusation. According to the essay, the massive discrimination was white realtors and homeowners against black people, no matter the origin.

Because of the unique advantages possessed by Black Caribbean immigrants (cash heavy, prior experience breaking into racial monopolies in their home countries) they had a better chance at breaking into white neighborhoods than African Americans.

This is NOT an indictment on African Americans, a generation removed from chattel slavery, with little experience in ownership due to the failure of Reconstruction and the following terrorism unleashed by Jim Crow, failed by a country who owed and still owes them an uncountable debt. Even with the odds against them they were able to establish themselves in New York and rise up the ladder. I have nothing but the utmost respect and honor for their history. In this topic, they were just disadvantaged compared to Black Caribbeans, who used "first mover advantage" to entrench themselves faster. But nowhere do I read that Black Caribbeans then turned around and shut African Americans out. Also, that would be economically retarded.

Reading the essay, my anger isn't at Black Caribbeans... It's at white people who had neighborhood property covenants preventing African Americans across the country from buying property. It's at white people who didn't ensure that Black Americans were put on a solid footing after the end of slavery with full recompense and damages in terms of land and capital. It's at white people who made the South a living hell, forcing an internal migration of people who arrived at the footsteps of New York and Detroit and Chicago with nothing but the clothes on their back.

Trust someone like @HimmyHendrix, a professed hater of blacks who are not African American, a PAWG lover, AND a self proclaimed Piru , to skip all of this and point the finger at Black Caribbeans and accuse them of Ethnic Cleansing, an allegation the paper didn't even make? I'm not sure what beef he has against Africans and Caribbeans in America but I promise you whatever grievances you have with them PALE compared to the beef you should have with the white man (who you adore for some reason).

you didn’t read. and you are trying to throw off the thread topic. you’re also creating things that are not there but i know west indians and africans hate us for no reason and will lie cheat and steal to undermine us. so don’t worry about it

so many damn lies in this post idk where to start

 

[Uachet]

2023… It's 2025

Failed to dispute anything posted

Copied and pasted some BS that's not applicable.

I know now not to take you seriously at all.

I just told you to use the actual source or experts talking about the source to dispute his claims. ChatGPT is not a source, and it is not an expert on the issue. You want to dispute what he put up, use something just as valid as what he put up. Your response demonstrates that not only are you unwilling to seriously dispute his efforts with actual sources that are equal or better than his, you are also disingenous about your attempt to ignore my information that is also from an expert source on the issue about the problems with using ChatGPT.

edit:

Be Careful... ChatGPT Appears to be Making up Academic References

ChatGPT caught referencing non-existing academic papers. It was able to explain the paper but on investigation...

oxford-review.com

ChatGPT and Fake Citations - Duke University Libraries Blogs

Post by Hannah Rozear, Librarian for Biological Sciences and Global Health, and Sarah Park, Librarian for Engineering and Computer Science Unless you’ve been living under a rock, you’ve heard the buzz about ChatGPT. It can write papers! Debug code! Do your laundry! Create websites from thin air...

blogs.library.duke.edu

Catastrophic Failures of ChatGpt that's creating major problems for users

Hey Open AI, when do plan on addressing and fixing this? Because you’ve ruined everything I spent months and months working on. All promises of tagging, indexing and filing away were lies. The only thing you did was break everything and tell the Chat bots to lie to us, your paid subscribers...

community.openai.com

 

[Kasgoinjail]

TLR plumbing new depths



while the real issues out there continue unabated

This is not by accident

Dudes like OP have been paid off just so u know

 

[Kasgoinjail]

This is not by accident

Dudes like OP have been paid off just so u know

Ironic it's was a black american not a Shower posse member or a Zoe that assassinated Malcolm a leader with West Indian Heritage

 

[Conan]

you didn’t read. and you are trying to throw off the thread topic. you’re also creating things that are not there but i know west indians and africans hate us for no reason and will lie cheat and steal to undermine us. so don’t worry about it

so many damn lies in this post idk where to start

bytch nikka START I GOT ALL DAY

I read a 38 page paper. That's light work here, I read dissertations!

No one is trying to undermine African Americans in this thread. Did you read my post where I stated I have nothing but love and respect for African Americans, and that this country owes them so so much?

Refute anything I said and I'll pull it up from the fukking paper. Let's go!

On God we gonna have this conversation today

 

[Kasgoinjail]

I looked for OP everywhere in the thread about South Afrikaaners being invited to USA but mi never see him in there

 

[Conan]

I'll neg anyone talking shyt about foundational African Americans on sight, fukk anyone who speaks ill on foundational African Americans. That includes white people, that includes Hispanics, Asians, even black people of Caribbean/African descent. fukk them and their entire lineage.

This conversation, this thread isn't about that though so let's get into it @HimmyHendrix if you ain't p*ssy

 

[HimmyHendrix]

I looked for OP everywhere in the thread about South Afrikaaners being invited to USA but mi never see him in there

another lying tether i was in the thread