Shaq: I Agree With What T-Mac Said. Probably Get A Lot Of Flak, But I Always Said Myself, I , I Think I Could've Got 3 In A Row With T-Mac.

[Mister Terrific]

I showed you that


Kobe: 27.6 ppg 5.7 rebs 5.3 asts
Shaq: 26.4 ppg 13.8 rebs 3. asts

And I showed you during the championship years what their averages were.


Kobe’s play off stats during the Lakers 3 championships were

25.7 ppg
44.6% FG


Shaq’s playoff stats were
29.8
55% FG


Why are you bringing up irrelevant shyt? In fact it makes Kobe look bad because as his usage usurper Shaq the Lakers got worse.


Hell let’s look at his stats in the series the Lakers lost

Kobe




Shaq
25 PPG
56% FG
14 Rebounds
3.7 APG
29% usage
Offensive rating: 117
Defensive rating: 113



Shaq was going against a prime Tim Duncan. Kobe was going against Stephen Jackson



Let’s look at the Pistons series


Kobe

22.6 PPG
38% FG
2 rebounds
4 apg
30 % usage
Offensive rating: 90
Defensive rating: 108


Shaq
27 PPG
63% FG
11 Rebounds
1 APG
28% usage
Offensive rating: 111
Defensive rating: 106


The Lakers were worse with Kobe taking a leading roll and he nearly destroyed the franchise.

Shaq playoff record before 2000:
28-33

Shaq's playoff record 2000-2004
64-26

Kobe never made it out the 1st round without Shaq or Gasol.

I wonder what changed?


Tmac was 25 in Houston, got Yao Ming, and failed to get out the first round. Ron Artest comes to Houston and then leads them further than Tmac did

Debilitating back injury.

Tracy McGrady experienced multiple back injuries during his NBA career, including a notable back strain that sidelined him for a period in 2005. He also suffered from back spasms that led to him being taken to the hospital in 2006. These injuries, along with other knee issues, impacted his playing time and effectiveness.


Also had knee and shoulder surgery in 2009

McGrady says he needs surgery, is out for year

Rockets All-Star Tracy McGrady told ESPN.com that he will need knee surgery and is done for the season.

www.espn.com

You know you don’t HAVE to be retarded?

You don't even understand the stats you're bringing to the table. Remember the defensive rating stat?

Ok address this

Kobe’s is notable defensive liability over the course in his career in long term RAPM. Kobe never had a positive D-DPM (which mixes box score and on/off) data. AND YET, Kobe was wildly considered a great defender during his career. He won 10 All-Defensive team nods. So what are the advanced stats missing about Kobe?

Whatever numbers you look at he wasn’t that guy MAGA mamba

 

[Consigliere]

T-Mac did not have that dog in him.

This is disrespectful to the spirit of competition.

 

[Da King]

Now we can officially kill the debate about Kobe being in the same stratosphere as Tim Duncan

 

[Everythingg]

And I showed you during the championship years what their averages were.


Kobe’s play off stats during the Lakers 3 championships were

25.7 ppg
44.6% FG


Shaq’s playoff stats were
29.8
55% FG

Kareem's last two rings he only averaged 19 and 7 (87) and 14 and 6 (88). I only hear Kareem referenced as a 6 time champion. I don't remember going back questioning 2 of his rings because he won them as the 3rd option. Then there's Dr. J who won his only championship averaging 18 and 7, alongside another player averaging 18 (Andrew Toney) and all behind Moses Malone who averaged 26 and 16. I only hear that Kareem is a 6 time champion and Erving a 1 time champion but maybe you have articles that questioned how much they deserved their rings since there was someone scoring more points than them. Maybe you have someone questioning Dr. J's greatness because he didn't win till Moses came around?

Or maybe questioning championships won by star players only happens with Kobe?

Kobe never made it out the 1st round without Shaq or Gasol.

The Shaq that said this right?

I never worked out in the summer…they beat me up so much [during the season], I was taking the summer off…I admit I used to take my summer off and work my way into shape,

Just checking. Here was that Shaq's playoff record

Shaq playoff record before 2000:
28-33

Shaq's playoff record 2000-2004
64-26

Now I wonder what player Shaq played with that took him from sub .500 to having a .711 winning percentage? Fun fact is that Magic never won without Kareem. Do we question his championships or we leave that to Kobe's championships?

Debilitating back injury.

Tracy McGrady experienced multiple back injuries during his NBA career, including a notable back strain that sidelined him for a period in 2005. He also suffered from back spasms that led to him being taken to the hospital in 2006. These injuries, along with other knee issues, impacted his playing time and effectiveness.


Also had knee and shoulder surgery in 2009

Maybe should have prepared/practiced more instead of allowing his "God given talent" to carry him his whole career:

That could be it,’’ McGrady said. “I just think I could cruise through practice and still be effective. Some guys have to really go (all) out to really have an impact on practice. My ability was just I had God-given talent to where I could just cruise through practice and still be an effective practice player… I was inconsistent.

So adding a "I cruse through practice" player that was lazy on defense to a "I don't work out in the summer" player who is also lazy on defence is somehow a recipe for a 3peat of championships.

Whatever numbers you look at

You mean the defensive rating numbers you brought up already? I challenged the numbers right when you brought them and you've been deflecting ever since.

Marcus Smart- 107.9
Gary Payton- 105.6
Jrue Holiday- 109
Andre Iguoudala- 105
Manu Ginobili- 100

Are you going to explain Manu Ginobili having a 100 defensive rating and Jrue Holiday having 109 or just deflect to some new numbers you don't understand either?

 

[Jplaya2023]

The question is would Shaq 3 peat with McGrady in his prime. Yes, he would. Is Kobe better.
Yes, he was. With or without Shaq.

^^^^^
Perfect example of 2 things can be true

 

[Mister Terrific]

Kareem's last two rings he only averaged 19 and 7 (87) and 14 and 6 (88). I only hear Kareem referenced as a 6 time champion.

Kobe was ass against the Spurs and Pistons as the supposed Laker #1 and your only retort is to slander Kareem? Facts came at you quick eh?

Or maybe questioning championships won by star players only happens with Kobe?

MAGA Mamba delusion. If Kareem won 6 chips as the best player on the Lakers he’d be the goat to this day. Kobe has two chips as the best player on his franchise as yo why he is a top 10-15 player, top 10 if you squint hard enough.

Just checking. Here was that Shaq's playoff record

Shaq playoff record before 2000:
28-33

Shaq's playoff record 2000-2004
64-26

Shaq’s playoff record post Kobe


33-25


Were you trying to make a point here?

So adding a "I cruse through practice" player that was lazy on defense to a "I don't work out in the summer" player who is also lazy on defence is somehow a recipe for a 3peat of championships.

You think TMac lazily shoots his team out of a championship?

You mean the defensive rating numbers you brought up already?

No this is RAPM.




Kobe’s is notable defensive liability over the course in his career in long term RAPM. Kobe never had a positive D-DPM (which mixes box score and on/off) data. AND YET, Kobe was wildly considered a great defender during his career. He won 10 All-Defensive team nods. So what are the advanced stats missing about Kobe?

 

[NYC Rebel]

@10bandz : “i can pull random quotes of folks saying this about Kobe. Thats YOUR responsibility Reb!

Also @10bandz : “ I WONT pull randon quotes of folks calling Sccit a racist. That NOT my responsibility because hes my guy!”

Man….fukk you. You are clown

 

[Dr. Narcisse]

Post Shaq, Kobe never won a playoff series, and also missed the playoffs 1 year. Wasn't until Pau Gasol came on the team, did he have playoff success again

Just saying

I will say the problem with what If's tho...

Celtics likely threepeat if KG never gets hurt. 2010 he wasnt the same player and in 09 they were best team before he got hurt. And that wouldnt have made Kobe less for going against a stacked squad

It can be spun anyway. So best to let it go even though its hard not too.

 

[Everythingg]

If Kareem won 6 chips as the best player on the Lakers

I know you and Mac like to live in "if" and "woulda coulda shoulda" land but we're talking about what happened. Kareem was the 3rd option in his last 2 rings and Julius Erving was 2A/2B. Oh and there's Jerry West and Wilt Chamberlain's ring for the Lakers in 1972 where the leading scorer was Gail Goodrich and Wilt was the 4th option.


Add Clyde Drexler too. He averaged 20 7 and 5 when Hakeem was averaging 33 and 10 so his ring doesn't count either. Definitely can't forget to discount Shaq's Miami ring either since Wade led them with 28 points to Shaq's 18. So so far, we have to subtract accomplishments from Kareem, Julius Erving, Jerry West, Wilt, Drexler, and Shaq.

Shaq’s playoff record post Kobe


33-25


Were you trying to make a point here?

Shaq playoff record before 2000:
28-33 .455%

Shaq's playoff record 2000-2004
64-26 .711%

Shaq’s playoff record post Kobe
33-25 .568%

The winning percentages makes the point all on its own. I wonder who Shaq was playing with during that 4 year stretch?


Unrelatedly (I think), here's Kobe's record without Shaq:
54-35 60%

You think TMac lazily shoots his team out of a championship?

"Bad back" Mac and "I don't work out in the summer" Shaq don't even make it to the finals. Since Mac got to see Artest and the team go further without him than they ever did with him, maybe we should debate Kobe and Artest?

No

Kobe has a career defensive rating of 105. Tmac had a career defensive rating of 103.8.

So is it no, you didn't know what you were talking about when you used this stat? Or is it"no" you can't explain Manu Ginobili having a 100 def rating while Jrue Holiday has a 109?

 

[NYC Rebel]

@10bandz ol “you guys got him all wrong” ass niqqa.

Disgusting c00n

 

[Mister Terrific]

I know you and Mac like to live in "if" and "woulda coulda shoulda" land but we're talking about what happened. Kareem was the 3rd option in his last 2 rings and Julius Erving was 2A/2B. Oh and there's Jerry West and Wilt Chamberlain's ring for the Lakers in 1972 where the leading scorer was Gail Goodrich and Wilt was the 4th option.

Why are you talking about other players when the conversation is about Kobe.

What does Kareem have to do with this?

Kobe wasn’t as good as Shaq and cost the Lakers at least one ring with his arrogance and lack of maturity

Shaq playoff record before 2000:
28-33 .455%

Shaq's playoff record 2000-2004
64-26 .711%

Shaq’s playoff record post Kobe
33-25 .568%

Could you imagine TMac with Phil Jackson’s coaching

Unrelatedly (I think), here's Kobe's record without Shaq:
54-35 60%

What’s Kobe’s record without Phil Jackson, Shaq and Pau Gasol?

"Bad back" Mac and "I don't work out in the summer" Shaq don't even make it to the finals. Since Mac got to see Artest and the team go further without him than they ever did with him, maybe we should debate Kobe and Artest?

Tmac had a debilitating back injury, shoulder surgery and knee surgery all before 27.

We aren’t talking about this years, we are talking about peak TMac putting up the same numbers as Kobe

Are you claiming TMac couldn’t put up 15 points?

So is it no, you didn't know what you were talking about when you used this stat? Or is it"no" you can't explain Manu Ginobili having a 100 def rating while Jrue Holiday has a 109?

No this is RAPM.




Kobe’s is notable defensive liability over the course in his career in long term RAPM. Kobe never had a positive D-DPM (which mixes box score and on/off) data. AND YET, Kobe was wildly considered a great defender during his career. He won 10 All-Defensive team nods. So what are the advanced stats missing about Kobe?

Can you explain why we should regard Kobe’s all defensive selections as meaningful where no advanced stats corroborate it?

 

[Deafheaven]

@10bandz ol “you guys got him all wrong” ass niqqa.

Disgusting c00n

kobe cultists (I'm calling them that now because I low key stanned kobe, but they on a diff planet) are embarrassing.

Siccit is a known propaganda pushing clown who says little slick shyt like the KKK was a primarily anti Jewish group to diminish black voices/history.


the fact you willing to back him because of your undying love of a basketball player is unhinged.

these nikkas need serious help.

 

[10bandz]

@10bandz ol “you guys got him all wrong” ass niqqa.

Disgusting c00n

kobe cultists (I'm calling them that now because I low key stanned kobe, but they on a diff planet) are embarrassing.

Siccit is a known propaganda pushing clown who says little slick shyt like the KKK was a primarily anti Jewish group to diminish black voices/history.


the fact you willing to back him because of your undying love of a basketball player is unhinged.

these nikkas need serious help.

You nikkas are p*ssy. Y'all dap up racist Kobe hating posters EVERY DAY. Yall dap up ADOS hating posters who hate Kobe EVERY DAY. Guys who have been bushed and banned repeatedly for that shyt. Y'all dikkride Bron who's Republican PR man got exposed for being a racist hating on BLM and is still employed till this day.


EVERYONE HERE KNOWS WHICH MOD HAS BAN POWERS. That mod has been approached a million times about banning Sccit and has never done it. If yall real about that and want him banned, holla at that mod and ask him what the deal is. But y'all not gonna do that, yall just vgonna blame me for Sccit posting here, I've never cosigned or dapped up any post he has made in any Israel/Jew thread or anything else.

bytch ass nikkas get called for being fukking frauds, dapping up bullshyt posts and disrespecting the legacies of players from a franchise and you claim to be a fan of and you wanna pivot to TLR Sccit shyt. All while you got nikkas who refer to themselves as "mixed breeds" dapping y'all.


Y'all used to be on Rhakim's dikk and when he got exposed for saying children from two black parents looked weird, y'all didn't say shyt,

fukking frauds, all over this forum.

 

[Deafheaven]

You nikkas are p*ssy. Y'all dap up racist Kobe hating posters EVERY DAY. Yall dap up ADOS hating posters who hate Kobe EVERY DAY. Guys who have been bushed and banned repeatedly for that shyt. Y'all dikkride Bron who's Republican PR man got exposed for being a racist hating on BLM and is still employed till this day.


EVERYONE HERE KNOWS WHICH MOD HAS BAN POWERS. That mod has been approached a million times about banning Sccit and has never done it. If yall real about that and want him banned, holla at that mod and ask him what the deal is. But y'all not gonna do that, yall just vgonna blame me for Sccit posting here, I've never cosigned or dapped up any post he has made in any Israel/Jew thread or anything else.

bytch ass nikkas get called for being fukking frauds, dapping up bullshyt posts and disrespecting the legacies of players from a franchise and you claim to be a fan of and you wanna pivot to TLR Sccit shyt. All while you got nikkas who refer to themselves as "mixed breeds" dapping y'all.


Y'all used to be on Rhakim's dikk and when he got exposed for saying children from two black parents looked weird, y'all didn't say shyt,

fukking frauds, all over this forum.

I'm a bron stan now? I like basketball, not players. Gun to my head Kobe>>>>>>>>>>>Lebron as far as who I like more as a player. I'm not just a blind dikkrider

All that Kobe adulation done made you retarded my guy. all that shyt you saying I think you must have some type of schizophrenia because none of it I recall nor applies to me.


All this emotion when you get called out for defending that nasty zionist seek help

 

[10bandz]

I'm a bron stan now? I like basketball, not players. Gun to my head Kobe>>>>>>>>>>>Lebron as far as who I like more as a player. I'm not just a blind dikkrider

All that Kobe adulation done made you retarded my guy. all that shyt you saying I think you must have some type of schizophrenia because none of it I recall nor applies to me.


All this emotion when you get called out for defending that nasty zionist seek help

I never defended no zionist, I never defended Israel, I never defended any of that.

You got @Mister Terrific a black man in Japan who DOES dikkride israel, does defend zionism and daps up Sccit in those Israel threads posting a bunch of misleading bullshyt to denigrate a dead mans legacy, but yall not gonna address none of that.

If you're concerned about Sccit posting here you know exactly who to talk to about that, you fukking p*ssy.