“The Art of production has been lost”-Diddy

[Awesome Wells]

I think people are misreading this statement. It's not about beat making or samples. It's about creating a track. The writing process, the vocal performance/take, adding or removing things to improve a beat, etc. So much stuff today boils down to someone making a beat in 30 minutes and a rapper doing a one-take verse that he writes in the booth as he punches each line. It's wack.

This right here.

Threads like this kinda expose who understands what actual producers do. Today, all they see is some dude making a beat on his laptop in 15 minutes and then sending it to someone and saying he "produced" it. The term itself has lost a lot of its meaning.

 

[Mike Wins]

This right here.

Threads like this kinda expose who understands what actual producers do. Today, all they see is some dude making a beat on his laptop in 15 minutes and then sending it to someone and saying he "produced" it. The term itself has lost a lot of its meaning.

Most modern hip hop fans don't know music. Not even hip hop music

By the criteria they hold against Puff, Berry Gordy was a hack because he wasn't playing the drums or bass or guitar on a track where he credited as the producer

 

[Awesome Wells]

Most modern hip hop fans don't know music. Not even hip hop music

By the criteria they hold against Puff, Berry Gordy was a hack because he wasn't playing the drums or bass or guitar on a track where he credited as the producer

Exactly.

They would definitely say Berry Gordy was "trash" today, lol.

Like you said, they say they love music, but they don’t even have any knowledge on what it really is.

 

[Ol’Otis]

Berry Gordy

Songwriter

 

[IIVI]

Additionally, a lot of these cats sad to say aren't in-tune with the modern, younger crowd.

The younger, modern crowd is kind of exhausted/annoyed with all the over-processed celebrity-ism, which is what many older producers will bring with them.

A lot of cats would think this lacks musicianship and originality, but the younger crowd eats it up:


When I was making beats a modern industry producer I spoke with once put it real straightforward:

A lot of these rappers when they get in the studio sometimes are lit like a mf - if they hear a beat that sounds halfway decent that's all she wrote, they ain't going to be all that selective and wait for symphonies to strike them. They going to catch the vibe and go. That's the way it is.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Additionally, a lot of these cats sad to say aren't in-tune with the modern, younger crowd.

The younger, modern crowd is kind of exhausted/annoyed with all the over-processed celebrity-ism, which is what many older producers will bring with them.

A lot of cats would think this lacks musicianship and originality, but the younger crowd eats it up.

Thing is, the older producers know more about music.

They have countless and cemented classics that have lasted over 20-30 years. So they can see what the younger crowd is doing, but they just think it's trash. The younger artists need to learn from the ones that have been in the game longer and know more about the craft. Old artists should not be trying to switch their standard to follow what the clueless artists are doing now just because they're younger.

What's missing now, is that younger crop of new artists who won't reject wanting to learn from those that came before. We can see what happens when they go out there and just make whatever they want. We get the music we have today from them. Which is garbage. The OG's should've been on the job.

 

[IIVI]

Thing is, the older producers know more about music.

They have countless and cemented classics that have lasted over 20-30 years. So they can see what the younger crowd is doing, but they just think it's trash. The younger artists need to learn from the ones that have been in the game longer and know more about the craft. Old artists should not be trying to switch their standard to follow what the clueless artists are doing now just because they're younger.

What's missing now, is that younger crop of new artists who won't reject wanting to learn from those that came before. We can see what happens when they go out there and just make whatever they want. We get the music we have today from them. Which is garbage. The OG's should've been on the job.

I edited my last post to include some facts, but at the end of the day it ain't really about the producers. It's more about the artist.

Producers will tell you straight up, it ain't the beats they spend a ton of time creating that gets the placements. These aren't bad producers saying that either. A lot of cats spend a lot of time on a beat or two for a rapper to hear it and pass on it after 5-10 seconds and say "next". Many people are starting to realize rappers today want it simple. If you don't make it simple, you're working against your chances to get a placement with these artists.

If producers want things to change, they need the artist who wants to change things. Like my last post stated: you got some big name rapper coming in off the club lit life a mf, dude ain't going to have time and patience for you to make the best beat you can. Dude wants something simple so they can catch a vibe and hit the booth. That's honestly how so much works today.

 

[The Intergalactic Koala]

Too many triplet hi hat "producers" out there.

There really aren't any real producers in hip hop. Just beat makers

As a beat maker in a pool of bedroom producers, the truth really hurts

Give a dude 1tbs of vsts and cheat code melodies with a laptop, and they are Metro Boomin over night.

Cold world indeed.

 

[Awesome Wells]

I edited my last post to include some facts, but at the end of the day it ain't really about the producers. It's more about the artist.

Producers will tell you straight up, it ain't the beats they spend a ton of time creating that gets the placements. These aren't bad producers saying that either. A lot of cats spend a lot of time on a beat or two for a rapper to hear it and pass on it after 5-10 seconds and say "next". Many people are starting to realize rappers today want it simple. If you don't make it simple, you're not getting a placement with these artists.

If producers want things to change, they need the artist who wants to change things. Like my last post stated: you got some big name rapper coming in off the club lit life a mf, dude ain't going to have time and patience for you to make the best beat you can. Dude wants something simple so they can catch a vibe and hit the booth. That's honestly how so much works today.

That's an interesting take.

I don’t know though. I think production really does set the tone for MC's. So if you have a subpar producer handing out bullsh*t beats, you're only going to get back the same quality that you're giving a rapper. But if a legit producer is really producing a record and spends time not just on the beat, but really working with the artist throughout the process, then you usually have something much better.

But with how it is now, we're hearing the exact same beat structure and same rap cadences from mad different artists. No one is challenging themselves to step away from the cookie-cutter formula to make better sh*t. Music is supposed to take time. It's art. You can't rush good sh*t out. And that's the problem today, the approach is on some microwave sh*t. Which is why the music is so wack.

 

[The Intergalactic Koala]

Most modern hip hop fans don't know music. Not even hip hop music

By the criteria they hold against Puff, Berry Gordy was a hack because he wasn't playing the drums or bass or guitar on a track where he credited as the producer

TBF Pharrell got shytted on for not knowing music theory

It's all in the passion, which sadly is hard to come by, as you can hear on Spotify's top playlist

 

[IIVI]

That's an interesting take.

I don’t know though. I think production really does set the tone for MC's. So if you have a subpar producer handing out bullsh*t beats, you're only going to get back the same quality that you're giving a rapper. But if a legit producer is really producing a record and spends time not just on the beat, but really working with the artist throughout the process, then you usually have something much better.

But with how it is now, we're hearing the exact same beat structure and same rap cadences from mad different artists. No one is challenging themselves to step away from the cookie-cutter formula to make better sh*t. Music is supposed to take time. It's art. You can't rush good sh*t out. And that's the problem today, the approach is on some microwave sh*t. Which is why the music is so wack.

I agree. At the end of the day though, it's hard to argue with the amount of success these songs have though.

I will say the lack of deep deep musicality is a common thing though many producers have talked about. There are a lot of crazy instrumentals out there producers have made and a lot of artists pass on them every time.




Those are some of the two biggest/iconic songs of the last 10 years and as you can see not many elements to them.

The crazy thing about March Madness is the amount of "break downs" it had on youtube where people were explaining how to do it. Then when the official beat breakdown (video above) came out people were basically dead wrong about how simple it was to create.

Zaytoven is another one dude said none of his beats take him over 15 minutes. If they take him that long he makes another one.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Zaytoven is another one dude said none of his beats take him over 15 minutes. If they take him that long he makes another one.

Zay was like a child prodigy though, lol. He's one of the rare cases.

Dude plays like 4-5 instruments, and he also can knock out something on piano by ear, if you just hum something to him. He's next level. If he worked with a better crop of artists and got away from catering to the local region so heavily, I think we'd hear his name way more than we do, as one of the best. He can basically do everything in the studio and make any kind of track. Mad underrated.

 

[Playaz Eyez]

I think people are misreading this statement. It's not about beat making or samples. It's about creating a track. The writing process, the vocal performance/take, adding or removing things to improve a beat, etc. So much stuff today boils down to someone making a beat in 30 minutes and a rapper doing a one-take verse that he writes in the booth as he punches each line. It's wack.

You’re giving these artists too much credit thinking they’re actually writing something down lol. A lot of modern era rappers grew up on the Jay/Wayne “I don’t write, I just go in the booth” style, and it shows. They SHOULD actually be writing and going over their stuff before getting in the booth.

Also, it would help some artists if the producer was actually in the studio with them instead of just getting airdropped beats or whatever.

 

[Razzay]