Essential The Official Boxing Random Thoughts Thread...All boxing heads ENTER.

[surv2syn]

That shyt was after the manny ass whipping he took in 09, what does his 2012 earnings have to do with anything







And if you try to troll and say he had no reason to fight Berto in 09 Berto was the fukking undefeated champ, a win over him and he was in the Mayweather, Manny, Margarito, Mosley fold, all huge big money fights, to win a paper strap off of Yuri Foreman.







Cotto never gets criticism though for sore losing, ducking fights, unnecessary catchweights and all, he's one slippery fukk I must admit.....................

not true, just ask me. Cotto just as bad as Floyd in my book, maybe worse. you hate Cotto and Broner for following the same blueprint as FM. the problem is, you will never denounce Floyd. he gets a pass somehow above anyone else.

 

[Skip b]

not true, just ask me. Cotto just as bad as Floyd in my book, maybe worse. you hate Cotto and Broner for following the same blueprint as FM. the problem is, you will never denounce Floyd. he gets a pass somehow above anyone else.

 

[yoyoyo1]

Remember when Arum offered Floyd $8 mil to fight Margarito and Floyd said he would get more for fighting Baldomir? Arum laughed it off. Mayweather signed to face Baldomir and was paid $8,000,001? So May got the last laugh. He managed to avoid the dangerous Margarito, make the same amount for fighting Baldomir (who wasnt better than Margarito) and gain the linear welterweight title! It was ingenious! IF Floyd and his team find ANY reason to justify not fighting someone, they will.

Good points but gaining the lineal welterweight title trumps all else.

 

[HARLEM AL]

Berto and Shane were in talks to fight way back around July of 09 (ended up getting cancelled due to the Haiti earthquake jan 2010) .... Cotto's WW run was on point judging by the comp he faced..

But @Skip b you confused me just now.. One instance you talk about when Manny fought Cotto, Manny only won by a couple rounds and got a gift stoppage from the ref... next you talkin bout The Great Manny asswhoopin of 09... You aint consistent b

Shots fired........

 

[surv2syn]

Good points but gaining the lineal welterweight title trumps all else.

I wouldnt say it trumps everything because to FM it comes down to money, if the money aint right, he could care less. It was a bonus incentive though. what that fight did do though was kill 2 birds. he got the $8 mil, and the lineal title for those saying "well, he didnt fight the best" and "he fought Zab for a paper title"

got paid and shut em up at once, brilliant! for anyone saying he HAD to fight Margarito, he shut they asses up too. fought the lineal champ for $1 more. no need to fight Marg whatsoever.

 

[LauderdaleBoss]

you are right about Dawson suggesting it but why would Ward reject it? now you are sounding like Skip. Ward said himself, when Chad suggested it, he felt it was a dumb move but he wasnt gonna turn that down. Anyway...you may see Ward go up to 175. I am a big Dawson fan, but at 175 the fight plays out the same way. Dawson is an elite athlete with a jab, Ward is a technical fighter with deadly accuracy who can adapt to any style. At any weight Ward is better than Dawson.

Ward would reject it because he knows he would eventually move up to 175 since business at 168 had concluded. Furthermore you would have nikkas like me and Skip saying the victory was tainted since Dawson obviously wasn't at his best. It's just overall a better legacy fight having the 168 champ moving up to face the 175 champ.

This ain't Pac/Cotto where Cotto was just 1 pound lighter than he was against Clottey. We talking about a guy fighting at 175 for 6 years dropping down to 168 against a guy who is going to move up to 175 eventually.

I feel Ward jumped at the chance cuz it was a gimmie fight for him and it paid off. I don't blame or fault him for that, but that doesn't mean I gotta give him a bunch of props for it. That's only point I'm trying to make.

nikkas is becoming too much of a fan of the business side of boxing and not the actual sport of boxing. Sometimes nikkas just wanna see good well matched fights and not worrying about dudes leap frogging divisions, weight draining nikkas, high risk low reward debates, and etc..

 

[surv2syn]

Ward would reject it because he knows he would eventually move up to 175 since business at 168 had concluded. Furthermore you would have nikkas like me and Skip saying the victory was tainted since Dawson obviously wasn't at his best. It's just overall a better legacy fight having the 168 champ moving up to face the 175 champ.

This ain't Pac/Cotto where Cotto was just 1 pound lighter than he was against Clottey. We talking about a guy fighting at 175 for 6 years dropping down to 168 against a guy who is going to move up to 175 eventually.

I feel Ward jumped at the chance cuz it was a gimmie fight for him and it paid off. I don't blame or fault him for that, but that doesn't mean I gotta give him a bunch of props for it. That's only point I'm trying to make.

nikkas is becoming too much of a fan of the business side of boxing and not the actual sport of boxing. Sometimes nikkas just wanna see good well matched fights and not worrying about dudes leap frogging divisions, weight draining nikkas, high risk low reward debates, and etc..

I want the best fights just like you and Harlem Al say. You just cant ignore the business of it. I wish it werent like it is but it is. I am NOT a fan of the business side...at the same time, I felt Ward vs Dawson was the best fight to be made at the time for both. I believe Ward was actually waiting on Bute at the time before he lost to Froch. Fighters dont move up weight classes just because. It wasnt really any big fights at LHW, hence the reason why Dawson went down. They both want to make money. I am happy the fight happened. If we were to wait on Ward to go up to LHW, then we wouldve missed out on a good fight between two of the TRUE p4p fighters out there.

 

[surv2syn]

I feel Ward jumped at the chance cuz it was a gimmie fight for him and it paid off. I don't blame or fault him for that, but that doesn't mean I gotta give him a bunch of props for it. That's only point I'm trying to make.

thats the problem. why not give him props for it? its not as much of a handicap as you make it seem. Dawson would probably beat anyone else at 168, but then you guys would be claiming he is too strong and a LHW picking on Super Middles, lol. you cant have the shyt both ways.

 

[Skip b]

at Black Jesus and his alts

 

[LauderdaleBoss]

thats the problem. why not give him props for it? its not as much of a handicap as you make it seem. Dawson would probably beat anyone else at 168, but then you guys would be claiming he is too strong and a LHW picking on Super Middles, lol. you cant have the shyt both ways.

I just explained why I didn't give him much props for it. Him taking that fight at 168 turned a legacy fight into a fukking showcase fight. Yeah he beat dude impressively, but it would have really been a big deal to me if he would have had that same type of performance against Dawson at 175. I don't see how anyone can deny what I'm saying. I'm not trying to have nothing both ways breh. I just wanted a good fight with no bullshyt involved.

Any top 10 guy at 168 would have beaten Dawson that night, maybe not as bad as Ward did, but beaten nonetheless. Miranda was already kicking Dawson's ass all throughout training camp so I doubt guys like Froch, Kessler, Bika and etc would have done any worse.

 

[patscorpio]

What about Kostya Tszyu and Joel Casamayor?

tszyu would have faced floyd if he had beaten hatton..of course we all know what happened with that..i don't think pac was ever in line to face tszyu at any time

i never knew why casa never faced floyd at lightweight

 

[surv2syn]

I just explained why I didn't give him much props for it. Him taking that fight at 168 turned a legacy fight into a fukking showcase fight. Yeah he beat dude impressively, but it would have really been a big deal to me if he would have had that same type of performance against Dawson at 175. I don't see how anyone can deny what I'm saying. I'm not trying to have nothing both ways breh. I just wanted a good fight with no bullshyt involved.

Any top 10 guy at 168 would have beaten Dawson that night, maybe not as bad as Ward did, but beaten nonetheless. Miranda was already kicking Dawson's ass all throughout training camp so I doubt guys like Froch, Kessler, Bika and etc would have done any worse.

so you would suggest Ward move up to fight Dawson when he is perfectly comfortable at 168? If he would lose you would say it was fukkery involved in that because you would say Dawson shouldnt have allowed Ward to come to 175 and face him straight away. YOU ARE DEFINITELY TRYING TO HAVE IT BOTH WAYS. The only way there is no bullshyt involved is if they meet at a catchweight of 171.5 but guess what, there would be no title on the line so the fight wouldnt be worth as much. I am all for evenly matched fights but yall just be discrediting guys for the wrong reasons.

 

[Black_Jesus]

at Black Jesus and his alts

 

[patscorpio]

I dont subscribe to the theory of "ducking" because it implies one man is afraid of another. That is not the case. However, management and tv networks will avoid fights that are high risk/low reward. Its not the fighters....because Cotto, Berto, Khan, etc...most young hyped fighters go through the same process of being carefully matched and built up.

I remember when Vernon Forrest (RIP) beat Mosley twice. Mosley at the time was considered P4P best. HBO gave Forrest a contract. Forrest said he wouldnt babysit his contract. He immediately took on Margarito and lost twice. HBO yanked his contract. Forrest had no regrets, but the point is...this is what consequences are waiting for you if you decide to take risks. Some fighters dont have enough marketability, so in order to make a lot of money they have to take hard fights. Others have the luxury of picking and choosing.

With Floyd's new deal on Showtime, do you really think he will fight 6 times in 30 months? If so, that would force him to fight someone decent in at least 2 or 3 of those fights. I'll bet you he only fights 3 times max under that deal.

you mean mayorga not margarito breh..typo right?

 

[surv2syn]

tszyu would have faced floyd if he had beaten hatton..of course we all know what happened with that..i don't think pac was ever in line to face tszyu at any time

i never knew why casa never faced floyd at lightweight

Floyd was never interested in facing Tszyu. the fight was never going to happen. Floyd fought Bruseles, Gatti, then called up Sharmba fresh off his demolition from Tszyu at 140 to come to 147 for a final payday. Something Sharmba couldnt refuse because he got like 8 kids and a host of baby mommas.