Essential The Official Boxing Random Thoughts Thread...All boxing heads ENTER.

[patscorpio]

Amateur boxing is a whole different sport, I never understand when folks try to lump it together with the pro game like we should look at these accomplishments together. It’s mostly Loma stans nowadays who do this for known reasons.

Usyk was both a great amareur and pro, that should be enough.

i look amateur as it can be an added bonus on top of a pro career...its crazy to me when mfrs use amateur careers as a talking point when comparing fighters in a hypothetical fight..if its a fight that happened then its cool

 

[patscorpio]

 

[desjardins]

You had people completely discounting Joe Louis or Joe Frazier simply because they weighed in at 210-215. You had some even discounting a younger Foreman because he weighed in around 220 in the 1970s

I actually watched the "down goes Frazier" fight last night before going to bed. One thing I kept thinking about was how much faster their hand speed was compared to heavyweights today . Obviously a lot is different since then, like the fight would have been stopped in the 1st round and Foreman wouldn't be allowed to push off like that now but it would be interesting to see how heavyweights with that kind of offensive fluidity with that handspeed and putting together combinations would fare now

 

[patscorpio]

I actually watched the "down goes Frazier" fight last night before going to bed. One thing I kept thinking about was how much faster their hand speed was compared to heavyweights today . Obviously a lot is different since then, like the fight would have been stopped in the 1st round and Foreman wouldn't be allowed to push off like that now but it would be interesting to see how heavyweights with that kind of offensive fluidity with that handspeed and putting together combinations would fare now

combination punching among heavies today is a lost art (among other things)...the only top heavy who does it today is kabayel

 

[reservoirdogs]

Sure, that's a valid point, I dont really give a fukk either way tbh, but for the sake of the conversation regarding Usyk and all time status etc, on paper he has the best resume in a long career of pro and amateur and accomplishments.

I don't really know what else to say, im not trying to embellish it, nor am I trying to diminish it? But it's hard to argue against it?

I grew somewhat disillusioned by all time rankings over the years. Just so many different eras with different environments. Like how can I compare the resume of a guy who fought like every months in the 50s to someone who's fighting 2 times (if he's "active") in this era?

Comparing the two with ignoring how due to better fight purses plus higher consideration of heath risks fighters at higher levels fight fewer times than guys in the 50s feels like would be unjust to today's fighters because it would set them unrealistic standards. At the same time ignoring how some of their resumes was absolutely stacked would be unjust to the old timers. So better to not even compare the two.

It's similar with P4P ranks, easier to make than all time lists but still... not objective enough. It seems like every other person has a different understanding of it. Some count in "eye test" so how the wins looked, some only go by resume, most use a mixture of it, some ppl even count potential in without proof so basically a "who's the best".

I still think a P4P list could be argued but the more and more I find myself focusing rather on divisional rankings.

 

[Apprentice]

Happy 2 year anniversary of a certain fight

 

[UpAndComing]

I actually watched the "down goes Frazier" fight last night before going to bed. One thing I kept thinking about was how much faster their hand speed was compared to heavyweights today . Obviously a lot is different since then, like the fight would have been stopped in the 1st round and Foreman wouldn't be allowed to push off like that now but it would be interesting to see how heavyweights with that kind of offensive fluidity with that handspeed and putting together combinations would fare now

100% facts. Another example is Foreman vs Lyle. Just throwing absolute bombs and combinations, you'll never see that today

And I always say for this current "bigger and stronger" era... These dudes are just fat lol. Pre 2000, Heavyweights took their fitness seriously. Look at all the weigh ins at that time, they always tried to be lean and under 230. They actually committed to "make weight" even as a heavyweight. Nowadays, you got Heavyweights with muffin tops, bloated faces, and chicken wing arms smh lol

 

[Tommy Gibbs]

I actually watched the "down goes Frazier" fight last night before going to bed. One thing I kept thinking about was how much faster their hand speed was compared to heavyweights today . Obviously a lot is different since then, like the fight would have been stopped in the 1st round and Foreman wouldn't be allowed to push off like that now but it would be interesting to see how heavyweights with that kind of offensive fluidity with that handspeed and putting together combinations would fare now

men trained differently back then. They did back breaking work just growing up. I explain to these youtubers and 20 year olds all the time that you can't do the work your grandparents did. You can't live like your grandparents did. The average 150 lb man from the 50s-70s is stronger than the average 240 lb man walking around today due to their daily living and work they had to do.

 

[Tommy Gibbs]

100% facts. Another example is Foreman vs Lyle. Just throwing absolute bombs and combinations, you'll never see that today

And I always say for this current "bigger and stronger" era... These dudes are just fat lol. Pre 2000, Heavyweights took their fitness seriously. Look at all the weigh ins at that time, they always tried to be lean and under 230. They actually committed to "make weight" even as a heavyweight. Nowadays, you got Heavyweights with muffin tops, bloated faces, and chicken wing arms smh lol

Mfers were actually saying that Tyson fury would have beat Ali, Foreman, Tyson, and other hw greats in their prime. He wouldn't have beat Chris Byrd. Usyk is the perfect example of why Byrd would dominate in today's hw era. He wouldn't have the Klitchskos or Ibeabuchi to worry about.

 

[Tommy Gibbs]

Happy 2 year anniversary of a certain fight

one guy got retired and the other will be retired in September

 

[Tommy Gibbs]

On paper Usyk has the most accomplishments of any boxer. That's just what it is. I'm not saying he's the best boxer, but his amateur career and pro career is the most accomplished as far as medals, trophies and belts in amateur and pro.

you're smoking crack. Please stop posting.

 

[Apprentice]

one guy got retired and the other will be retired in September

If u follow Errol on IG dude is super retired

That nikka look like he love life rn he be posting like a single mom finding herself

 

[Scottie Drippin]

I actually watched the "down goes Frazier" fight last night before going to bed. One thing I kept thinking about was how much faster their hand speed was compared to heavyweights today . Obviously a lot is different since then, like the fight would have been stopped in the 1st round and Foreman wouldn't be allowed to push off like that now but it would be interesting to see how heavyweights with that kind of offensive fluidity with that handspeed and putting together combinations would fare now

Steward coached volume punching out of Wlad and Lennox. While his approach can't be argued - we as viewers lost.



This guy probably loses to the Wlad that didn't lose a fight for almost a decade but, its this guys ability to throw combinations that made everyone think he was the special one and not his brother. Early in the 1st I think you can see Ray realize he ain't never dealt with no shyt like this before.

He gets rocked by a combination and just goes back to the ropes like standing in front of this dude ain't gonna work

 

[UpAndComing]

Steward coached volume punching out of Wlad and Lennox. While his approach can't be argued - we as viewers lost.



This guy probably loses to the Wlad that didn't lose a fight for almost a decade but, its this guys ability to throw combinations that made everyone think he was the special one and not his brother. Early in the 1st I think you can see Ray realize he ain't never dealt with no shyt like this before.

He gets rocked by a combination and just goes back to the ropes like standing in front of this dude ain't gonna work

Glad you brought up Wlad. People talk about Usyk 24/7 now, but both Klitchkos give Usyk a lot of problems.

The Klitschko's combination punching, stamina, power, and elite ability to use their size correctly would be tough

IMO Usyk loses to both

 

[patscorpio]