Timbaland x Timberlake - 9.1.23

[Awesome Wells]

Breh, "My Love" is literally the only song where Danja actually did the beat. Tim programmed some sounds into the keyboard and Danja put the beat together. Tim beat boxed on it, but it was Danja who put that together.

And again, you're wrong. J-Roc did not start working with Tim right after Danja. J-Roc was working with Tim as far back as Shock Value 1, which also had Danja productions.

You're doing a disservice to the whole integrity of production. It makes no sense for Danja to make up entire stories to accommodate Tim especially years when they weren't even working together any more.

Wizz Dumb got his credits as did Danja. You have no clue as to what you're talking about. And to prove it most of what Wizz Dumb is credited with are solo productions. The credits say this. "Tomorrow In A Bottle" is credited to Wizz and that track is on a Timbaland album (Shock Value 2). Wizz is also credited onthe bonus track from Lil' Wayne's C4. There's Jozzy's "Tryna Wife" featuring Mase.

Timbaland didn't take credit from Storch. There's like two songs where Storch wasn't credited. He co-wrote "Cry Me A River" and co-produced "Hola Hovito". These weren't cases of Tim taking credit, these were on the respective labels.

This isn't a debate, bro.

The work that JRoc did with Tim a year after Danja left, and everything for the following almost 10 years, is why he sued Tim. You're talking about credit. These people made tracks that Tim said he worked on and didn't. And then they had to sue to get paid. These are facts, not some bullsh*t to post back and forth over.

So I understand that's how dudes like to do sh*t on here, but there's a difference from doing our usual thing where we post our opinions on music, and actually speaking about events we were actually there for and know to be fact.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Wrong.

Tim still had placements on Drake, Jay Z, and PCD 2008-2009. Then Timbaland had a huge resurgence in 2013 with 20/20 Experience, Magna Carta Holy Grail, and Beyonce's self titled album.

Again, I can tell you're just posting to post. LOL!!!

I didn't say Tim never worked again. I said he fell off and vanished. I literally just spoke about JRoc in the last post. JRoc was the one that worked on the Jay album with Tim in '08-'09 and sued Tim because he didn't get paid for that work. So this isn't about Tim never working again. It's about the process of claiming you've done work that you didn't do, and not paying the people who actually did the work.

So like I said, there are times when we can get into our opinions over music and go back and forth over what we think is wack or not. That's perfectly cool. But what we won't do, is sit and debate facts. I was there, so I can speak on it personally. If you weren't there, these posts are just what you think. And that's not something I care about, fam. Sorry.

 

[JustCKing]

I love all of this beats, lol.

Point is, Danja was still getting mad placements with A-list artists, and Tim fell off crazy. Dana's work picked up after Tim, Tim's work vanished after Danja.

And he was one of my favorite producers but I have to be honest about it. He went from doing tracks solo in the 90's, to all of his placements in the 00's being co-produced by people we hadn't heard of at the time. Everything he did after Danja, was also co-produced with some unknown dude who was just trying to get on. One of my people also sat in that slot with Tim for a few years too.

Wrong.

Tim still had placements on Drake, Jay Z, and PCD 2008-2009. Then Timbaland had a huge resurgence in 2013 with 20/20 Experience, Magna Carta Holy Grail, and Beyonce's self titled album.

This isn't a debate, bro.

The work that JRoc did with Tim a year after Danja left, and everything for the following almost 10 years, is why he sued Tim. You're talking about credit. These people made tracks that Tim said he worked on and didn't. And then they had to sue to get paid. These are facts, not some bullsh*t to post back and forth over.

So I understand that's how dudes like to do sh*t on here, but there's a difference from doing our usual thing where we post our opinions on music, and actually speaking about events we were actually there for and know to be fact.

You're wrong again. J Roc didn't collect royalties that he was owed from the work he did with Timbaland. That is NOT the same as Timbaland taking credit for work that he did. Timbaland withheld money. I read the article.

You're all over the place misconstruing facts.

 

[Goat poster]

Low key I don’t know what a current era Timbaland track sounds like. Outside of this Tee Grizzley album that I can’t remember, I haven’t really listened to Timbaland beats since stuff he did for Drake and Justin Timberlake ages ago.

He did the first single off J.Coles last album.

 

[JustCKing]

Again, I can tell you're just posting to post. LOL!!!

I didn't say Tim never worked again. I said he fell off and vanished. I literally just spoke about JRoc in the last post. JRoc was the one that worked on the Jay album with Tim in '08-'09 and sued Tim because he didn't get paid for that work. So this isn't about Tim never working again. It's about the process of claiming you've done work that you didn't do, and not paying the people who actually did the work.

So like I said, there are times when we can get into our opinions over music and go back and forth over what we think is wack or not. That's perfectly cool. But what we won't do, is sit and debate facts. I was there, so I can speak on it personally. If you weren't there, these posts are just what you think. And that's not something I care about, fam. Sorry.

And your post is crazy because Timbaland didn't vanish. Danja's production credits post 2008 are spotty. The A Listers are few and far in between.

Not paying someone =/= taking credit for their work. If I contract you to help me a build a house and I give you credit, but I don't pay you, I didn't take credit from you. While I would still be wrong, you just weren't compensated for your work.

 

[Awesome Wells]

Wrong.

Tim still had placements on Drake, Jay Z, and PCD 2008-2009. Then Timbaland had a huge resurgence in 2013 with 20/20 Experience, Magna Carta Holy Grail, and Beyonce's self titled album.

You're wrong again. J Roc didn't collect royalties that he was owed from the work he did with Timbaland. That is NOT the same as Timbaland taking credit for work that he did. Timbaland withheld money. I read the article.

You're all over the place misconstruing facts.

You're clearly Googling and trying to understand the music business, by guessing.

JRoc sued Tim because he sold his catalogue, along with the publishing rights for songs that Roc did, but were credited to Tim. That's how royalties work, bro. If Roc got the credit he deserved, his publishing would've paid him automatically whatever royalties he was owed, without the need to sue Tim for that bread. But because Tim sold those songs under the guise of him owning them to sell, people like Roc, who actually made the songs and owned them, were not being paid. This is how people get jerked in music, and what happens when people take credit for your work. You are NOT supposed to sell sh*t you don't own outright. There are other owners of that music. Their rights have to be credited to the material. And they have to be in on the sale. Not just you.

The fact that you still don’t understand this, and have to be told by a stranger on a forum, is a testament to how much people don’t know about the music business and why so many people get jerked. Your posts alone show why it's so easy for these people to constantly do it. Learn the business first. Then post.

 

[JustCKing]

You're clearly Googling and trying to understand the music business, by guessing.

JRoc sued Tim because he sold his catalogue, along with the publishing rights for songs that Roc did, but were credited to Tim. That's how royalties work, bro. If Roc got the credit he deserved, his publishing would've paid him automatically whatever royalties he was owed, without the need to sue Tim for that bread. But because Tim sold those songs under the guise of him owning them to sell, people like Roc, who actually made the songs and owned them, were not being paid. This is how people get jerked in music, and what happens when people take credit for your work. You are NOT supposed to sell sh*t you don't own outright. There are other owners of that music. Their rights have to be credited to the material. And they have to be in on the sale. Not just you.

The fact that you still don’t understand this, and have to be told by a stranger on a forum, is a testament to how much people don’t know about the music business and why so many people get jerked. Your posts alone show why it's so easy for these people to constantly do it. Learn the business first. Then post.

And breh, you're still wrong. Read and pay attention:

Producer Royalties
Some producers are paid a flat fee through a Work for Hire Agreement or an advance from a record label for their work. But another way to pay a producer is through a music royalty known as points. Producer points are also commonly referred to as points, album points, producer percentage, or producer royalties. One point is equal to 1% of the revenue earned by the song. Points can be awarded in a few different ways:

They might be paid on the entire album. Example: producer gets 3 percent of the music royalties a record earns. (3 points)

They might only be paid on particular songs on an album. Example: If the producer gets 2 points on 5 songs on an album that includes 10 songs, he would get 5/10 of 2 percent of the music royalties earned by the album; equalling only 1%.

Points and songwriting credits are not the same things. However, it is possible for a producer to earn songwriting royalties. It occasionally happens that a producer will take a hand in tweaking an existing song, or helping to create one from scratch. In this case, the producer might be entitled to a songwriting credit in addition to points for his other work on the project. Pretty sweet deal!

Music Royalties Explained: The Ultimate Guide for 2023

How do music royalties work? How do I collect music royalties? We cover the biggest topic of the music industry and explain how musicians get what they are owed.

www.indiemusicacademy.com

^^^ this is nowhere near as simple as you're making this out to be. Even though J-Roc was properly credited, it didn't guarantee his payment. See "work for hire agreement". It seems he and Timbhad one of those and Tim breached it by not paying him. Then J-Roc also got messed over on his points when Timbaland sold off the catalog. Still, nothing to do with taking credit.

 

[Awesome Wells]

this is nowhere near as simple as you're making this out to be. Even though J-Roc was properly credited, it didn't guarantee his payment. See "work for hire agreement". It seems he and Timbhad one of those and Tim breached it by not paying him. Then J-Roc also got messed over on his points when Timbaland sold off the catalog. Still, nothing to do with taking credit.

Bro, it's what I do for a living. And have been since I was 17. It's simple if you've learned and know the business.

It's not simple, if you have to Google your way around it to understand. Be chill, fam.

 

[JustCKing]

Bro, it's what I do for a living. And have been since I was 17. It's simple if you've learned and know the business.

It's not simple, if you have to Google your way around it to understand. Be chill, fam.

If you've been doing this simce you were 17 and you are equating not being compensated for work to someone taking credit for work, clearly you don't understand the business. It isn't the same. And no I don't have to Google. I post articles because people sit up and post misinformation all the time. If you have a problem with it, that's on you. Stop posting lies and misinformation and I won't post Google articles simple as that.

Just because a producer is properly credited doesn't guarantee they are properly compensated. It depends on the agreement he had with Timbaland in regard to how he was supposed to be compensated. Clearly, you have NO CLUE what you are talking about. And he didn't just go after Tim, he went after the publishing companies as well.

If you can show me where J-Roc is actually saying he made all those beats and Tim took credit, I will be the first to say "you know what I am completely wrong, I'm sorry". You were even wrong about Danja AND Wizz Dumb.

 

[Meowth tote da Uzi]

Im good on JT fukk that cac

 

[jadillac]

I worked with Danja on tracks for T.I. and Ciara. And sat in interviews with him when he said exactly what I posted.

The interview he went into the details in, was actually with SOHH. LOL!! And him doing the interview and saying what he did for the first time, was why he and Tim stop working together after that. Tim told him to recant the statements. There's another dude named JRoc who started working with Tim right after Danja, who had the exact same experience on mad records. It's not exactly a secret. Tim was taking credit for beats dude did, and slid dude into that "co-producer" seat, so he had to sue Tim for his bread because he wasn't getting paid for the work he did. Another dude I know named Wizz Dumb went through the exact same thing with Tim. Everyone in the business knows this is what Tim does now. Not back in the day, but now.

Danja literally spoke about 'My Love" and the session and said, "Tim will play a beat and the room will go crazy and then he'll look at me and be like "Your turn". This is in the sessions for Justin.

"I put my headphones on and started doing my thing then, Justin heard it through my headphones, took them off like 'What is that?' That's how that came about. Tim really tried me a little bit so I had to show him up. It's real simple. I think we have a lot of fun and that's why it works so well. It's just a big vibe session." But when the album came out, it said Timbaland produced the track.

Dude was literally making beats by himself, and Tim was taking credit. I saw most of this in person. And when he started speaking out about this, after Scott Storch said the same, that's when Tim had an issue with him and they parted ways. It's not about sh*ttin' on GOAT's. Tim is still one of the best ever. But nobody is gonna lie to cover up what was really going on with the process, lol.

Isn't Jroc the dude that did IceBox for Omarion?

I don't know if Tim actually plays the keys like that, so I think any super musical track is not him by himself.

Even now i think he does the Beatclub thing where ppl submit beats to him and if he likes it, he'll take it and possibly get it placed under his name bc he has that cache.

I dunno, he might kick them a few bucks, but really the credit is the most important part. Because a hit record will get you more opportunities....then you make money.

That said, I do think Tim is still a great overseer and executive producer. It's like Diddy in that regards

 

[360dagod]

although this cannot be proven either way obviously, i always take these kind of things for what they are: lesser known producer claiming he was the one making the beats while the other took credit... my problem with this is: what has danja been producing after he left Timbo in the dust ? hmm im inclined to say not much

Timbaland had producers playing their beats and submitting tracks to him...

I knew right then and there what it was

 

[Awesome Wells]

Isn't Jroc the dude that did IceBox for Omarion?

I don't know if Tim actually plays the keys like that, so I think any super musical track is not him by himself.

Even now i think he does the Beatclub thing where ppl submit beats to him and if he likes it, he'll take it and possibly get it placed under his name bc he has that cache.

I dunno, he might kick them a few bucks, but really the credit is the most important part. Because a hit record will get you more opportunities....then you make money.

That said, I do think Tim is still a great overseer and executive producer. It's like Diddy in that regards

There was a dude called "J Que" that was in The Clutch, at the time.

He was doing a lot of writing and production with Keri Hilson back then. They worked on 'Icebox" for Omarion.

And like you said, a hit record is everything. It can make your entire career to be credited properly. Saint Denson is the dude that actually produced "Good Times" for Styles P. Knew Swizz from high school, so he gave the beat to Swizz and Swizz took the credit and no one ever knew who Saint was. And even after suing and coming out and tellin your story, your moment is gone. Dude said if people knew he did that beat, his whole career would've been different. And that's true. You get lucky enough to get a big record, you need people to know you did it because that's what brings all the other placements.

 

[JustCKing]

Timbaland had producers playing their beats and submitting tracks to him...

I knew right then and there what it was

But they got credits. In what world would a producer play beats in front of an audience, tell you they are submissions, and then give himself credit. Come on.

This is one of the biggest reasons why I even joined forums because people were sold on this idea that anyone who did co production work was actually responsible for the entire production. You had people thinking Mel Man and Scott Storch were making beats for Dre. People discredited Dre's entire existence. Did the same with Timbaland saying Danja made all those beats. Then when you look at what these guys accomplished on their own l, it doesn't compare to what they did when they worked with a Timbaland or Dre. Why?

And the goofiest part about it, the people who say these co-producers did all the work, never even checked for their work like that prior or even after. And the goofiest part about it, they are silent when they see a Dre or Timbaland on a co-production or additional production and never claim they did all the work. Same goofs will talk about how great of a producer Pharrell is and will go as far as call a full on Neptunes production a Pharrell track knowing full well it was Pharell AND Chad.

 

[JustCKing]

There was a dude called "J Que" that was in The Clutch, at the time.

He was doing a lot of writing and production with Keri Hilson back then. They worked on 'Icebox" for Omarion.

And like you said, a hit record is everything. It can make your entire career to be credited properly. Saint Denson is the dude that actually produced "Good Times" for Styles P. Knew Swizz from high school, so he gave the beat to Swizz and Swizz took the credit and no one ever knew who Saint was. And even after suing and coming out and tellin your story, your moment is gone. Dude said if people knew he did that beat, his whole career would've been different. And that's true. You get lucky enough to get a big record, you need people to know you did it because that's what brings all the other placements.

Correction on that. Swizz Beatz produced "Good Times". Saint Denson made the beat. He shoukd have gotten credit for that, but he definitely didn't produce the song as he ain't even know Styles P was on the song until he heard it like everyone else.