"WAS THERE A CONSPIRACY TO GET RID OF CONSCIOUS RAP???" | DJ RED ALERT GIVES US THE HISTORY...

[Kenny West]

I cited four and a half decades worth of rock and metal having subversive lyrics including drugs and violence which were accused of influencing school shootings and teen pregnancies, and your response boils down to "but Coldplay and pop rock were popular in the 00s." You don't know what "cherry picking" means clearly.

You really want to die on that hill i see.

The censorship committee type complaints from rock were dwarfed by the same complaints being made against violent tv shows and video games at the time. Slipknot era rock was a fukking footnote compared to the scrutiny from the Columbine shootings.

This just demonstrates the weakness of the rock example, if anything it more consistently followed [white] American culture trends whether its the druggy hippy shyt in the 70s, fukk yeah sex drugs rock n roll in the 80s, the line toeing censorship rebels in the 90s, going all the way to its dry politically correct current state.

Rock is a cherry picked example to the max because your original point was some "all music and cultures do this" when it isn't remotely true.

Nu metal was extremely popular in the early to mid 00s as well, when pop rock started taking over. Mainstream rock music is less subversive now, sure. Maybe that's why rock is effectively dead and white kids listen to way more rap now....

The jazz example is bad to you because you aren't familiar with the music or its history. The country has a century worth of history banning dance music like jazz and other black forms of expression, accusing them of all types of shyt. Promoting drugs, promoting sex, promoting violence, etc. The lack of lyrics in most jazz didn't prevent it from being viewed as subversive. Not to mention the origins of jazz being intertwined with New Orleans brothels and prostitutes.

The most subversive music tends to attract the youngest audiences in America. We've got over 100 years worth of evidence of this. Singling out rap in this equation is something only a white racist would do, or someone who is simply oblivious to music history.

No its just bad because most of complaints against it at the time was very thinly veiled racial propaganda that you'd have to be an idiot to take seriously. It's not something you want to use as evidence of a trend that "The evolution of rap is normal, all music becomes needlessy violent"

 

[Piff Perkins]

You really want to die on that hill i see.

The censorship committee type complaints from rock were dwarfed by the same complaints being made against violent tv shows and video games at the time. Slipknot era rock was a fukking footnote compared to the scrutiny from the Columbine shootings.

This just demonstrates the weakness of the rock example, if anything it more consistently followed [white] American culture trends whether its the druggy hippy shyt in the 70s, fukk yeah sex drugs rock n roll in the 80s, the line toeing censorship rebels in the 90s, going all the way to its dry politically correct current state.

Rock is a cherry picked example to the max because your original point was some "all music and cultures do this" when it isn't remotely true.

No its just bad because most of complaints against it at the time was very thinly veiled racial propaganda that you'd have to be an idiot to take seriously. It's not something you want to use as evidence of a trend that "The evolution of rap is normal, all music becomes needlessy violent"

Tipper Gore was literally trying to ban and censor music during that time, and much of it was rock because that was the most popular music of the time. Are you really going to pretend like the most iconic, memorable image of those hearings was not Dee Snider/Twisted Sister debating against her? Rock was a huge target.


Columbine happened in 99. when nu metal was extremely popular. Marilyn Manson was directly blamed for the shooting. By 2007 when the VT shooting (amongst others) happened, multiple rock and metal bands were again blamed for fostering violence. Alongside video games.

There's a clear pattern of rock music being blamed for violence in the 80s, 90s, and early to mid 00s. Metal and nu metal especially. The ironic thing about this entire conversation is that white people, specifically white boys/young men, are the predominant consumers for all of this shyt. From drug rock to metal to gangsta rap, they're the primary listener. With rap today, most of the most gangsta/drill/etc shyt is clearly aimed at them by labels.

If you can't see how criticisms of rap have largely been thinly veiled racial propaganda as well there's no point in continuing the conversation. It's the same playbook by the same types of people. The only difference is that rap is no longer as interesting to them, and they're far more interested in targeting media portrayals of sexuality (especially homosexuality) and alleged political messaging.

 

[ISO]

Of course it was

To believe otherwise means you have not the slightest knowledge of past history.

Rap music was hijacked and WEAPONIZED against the black community mainly as a propaganda tool as someone in here has already mentioned.

Rap Music is a continuation of Minstrel Shows of the past:

Rap Music is an updated version of Minstrel Shows being used to perpetuate the most negative stereotypes of blacks to a worldwide audience, which is why the main image of rappers pushed are gangbangers, thugs and drugdealers.

And the people doing the pushing and funding look like this:

Again, if you deny this, all I can do is assume you have zero awareness of past history.

This is tinfoil conspiracy and false equivalency.

U posted a picture of Chief Keef with Jimmy Iovine when Chief Keef built a local, to regional, to national buzz independent of labels and was one of the first viral/YouTube sensations. He was chosen by the people and his career as a major label recording artist was a disaster and independently he remains a cult favorite because the people chose him. Post-Kanye and into the blog era gangsta rap was in serious decline and labels were only going for clean cut, 20 something year old, every man rappers, swag rap, lifestyle rap, introspective conscious rappers were popping that’s how we got the generation of Drake, Cole, Kendrick, Wiz, Wale, Sean, Rocky, etc. and even the street rappers like Meek and Nipsey had substance. Keef blowing up opened the doors for other teenage gangsters to become rappers and get deals.

In the 90’s when this shyt all started politicians, community elders, labels all fought against gangsta rap meanwhile the people and artists fought against that push back to get us where we’re at today.

It’s supply and demand.

 

[MasterThought]

This is tinfoil conspiracy and false equivalency.

U posted a picture of Chief Keef with Jimmy Iovine when Chief Keef built a local, to regional, to national buzz independent of labels and was one of the first viral/YouTube sensations. He was chosen by the people and his career as a major label recording artist was a disaster and independently he remains a cult favorite because the people chose him. Post-Kanye and into the blog era gangsta rap was in serious decline and labels were only going for clean cut, 20 something year old, every man rappers, swag rap, lifestyle rap, introspective conscious rappers were popping that’s how we got the generation of Drake, Cole, Kendrick, Wiz, Wale, Sean, Rocky, etc. and even the street rappers like Meek and Nipsey had substance. Keef blowing up opened the doors for other teenage gangsters to become rappers and get deals.

In the 90’s when this shyt all started politicians, community elders, labels all fought against gangsta rap meanwhile the people and artists fought against that push back to get us where we’re at today.

It’s supply and demand.

Wait,hold up.


So you deny the historical fact that there has been an assault on the image of blacks by using mass media to push the most negative imagery to the world?

You're calling this fact a tinfoil conspiracy???


Are you really sitting here saying that Minstrel Shows and other forms of anti-black propaganda pushed to the world throughout history was just ..... A tinfoil conspiracy???

Please my brother , explain. I HAVE to be misunderstanding you. There's no way you're saying this in 2022 with all of the information we have at our fingertips.

 

[timeless]

Yes. Conscious rap was/is for the people, and that's bad business for those who want absolute power. That's really what all of this is about. You don't have power if you cant control people, and the easiest way to control people is through music. The metaphysics of sound is real. Pray to God and keep destructive music in all forms away from your ears.

 

[ISO]

Wait,hold up.


So you deny the historical fact that there has been an assault on the image of blacks by using mass media to push the most negative imagery to the world?

You're calling this fact a tinfoil conspiracy???


Are you really sitting here saying that Minstrel Shows and other forms of anti-black propaganda pushed to the world throughout history was just ..... A tinfoil conspiracy???

Please my brother , explain. I HAVE to be misunderstanding you. There's no way you're saying this in 2022 with all of the information we have at our fingertips.

Comparing minstrel shows to gangsta rap ain’t it.

U have to understand these rappers today that you see as minstrel show actors are blowing up on their own before a label touches them due to accessibly in the digital world and supply and demand from consumers. We were warned by elders but fought against it up to court decisions for the right to make this music.

 

[Big Boss]

No. Kids and teenagers gravitate to more subversive shyt, across art mediums. It's why if your parents didn't let you watch R-rated movies you tried to sneak watch them. If you found porn as a kid, you hid it so you could look at it. In the 60s-90s rock kept getting more and more subversive. More drug content, and later more violence. I don't think it's shocking that rapping about killing people and fukking bytches is far more enticing to teenage boys than rapping about Afrocentricity or learning.

Once NWA showed that rap could sell as much as rock, it was over for positive shyt. There is no conspiracy about the market deciding based on popularity/sales/etc. Things are probably more balanced now in the since that most of the biggest rappers, if not the biggest, aren't making gangster music (Drake, Kendrick, Cole, Travis, Uzi, etc).

Facts

 

[O.Red]

It's being forced because consumers aren't given other choices in black music they even took away r&b

Again with the excuses. Nobody took away r&b nikkas STOPPED MAKING IT

The r&b nikkas wanted to be like rappers and their content reflected it, and the r&b that was around was being far less consumed

That's not even just an R&b issue. Teenage white kids aren't making bands anymore. Why? Because they all listen to rap damn near exclusively now. EVERYBODY listens to rap at a higher rate than just about everything. The streaming services exposed this

This idea of not having choices is bullshyt. Whatever music you want to hear is out there. We're not given choices we MAKE them

The label pushes the fukk out of Cordae but don't nobody wanna listen to that nikka

 

[O.Red]

Wait,hold up.


So you deny the historical fact that there has been an assault on the image of blacks by using mass media to push the most negative imagery to the world?

You're calling this fact a tinfoil conspiracy???


Are you really sitting here saying that Minstrel Shows and other forms of anti-black propaganda pushed to the world throughout history was just ..... A tinfoil conspiracy???

Please my brother , explain. I HAVE to be misunderstanding you. There's no way you're saying this in 2022 with all of the information we have at our fingertips.

You're not misunderstanding you're misrepresenting. It's like you didn't even read that post

Nobody's denying the ubiquity of propaganda, but y'all are denying the people's appetite for certain content. Content they SEEK out. It makes you look like you're eschewing full accountability to have Illuminati rants, because that's the easiest shyt to do

In those same pics you posted of Lyor and Iovine, you're conveniently leaving out the fact that there are rappers right next to them

Ironically Keef didn't even last on Interscope. That whole situation was a mess and he was dropped soon after. That same year Good Kid Maad City came out on the same Interscope

Your refusal to accept that this is a two way street will be the reason you'll be saying the exact same shyt posting the exact same links in 20 years

 

[$cam-U-Well_Jack$on]

Again with the excuses. Nobody took away r&b nikkas STOPPED MAKING IT

You're wasting your time. He and others are hell bent on absolving these entertainers of accountability and placing blame elsewhere as if they had no agency in certain choices/decisions that have been made and da hand that they've played in da state of things.

 

[MasterThought]

Comparing minstrel shows to gangsta rap ain’t it.

U have to understand these rappers today that you see as minstrel show actors are blowing up on their own before a label touches them due to accessibly in the digital world and supply and demand from consumers. We were warned by elders but fought against it up to court decisions for the right to make this music.

I highly disagree and alot of others would disagree with this take also my G.

How you can listen to rap and watch the videos and say that it doesn't invoke the negative stereotypes that were purposely pushed throughout history of blacks is insane to me.

Rap Music has literally reduced the image of the black man to drugdealers, thugs and gangbangers. A menace to society.

Rap Music is a continuation of their mass media attack on the image of blacks.

The fact that black people can't see this is insane to me

 

[MasterThought]

You're not misunderstanding you're misrepresenting. It's like you didn't even read that post

Nobody's denying the ubiquity of propaganda, but y'all are denying the people's appetite for certain content. Content they SEEK out. It makes you look like you're eschewing full accountability to have Illuminati rants, because that's the easiest shyt to do

In those same pics you posted of Lyor and Iovine, you're conveniently leaving out the fact that there are rappers right next to them

Ironically Keef didn't even last on Interscope. That whole situation was a mess and he was dropped soon after. That same year Good Kid Maad City came out on the same Interscope

Your refusal to accept that this is a two way street will be the reason you'll be saying the exact same shyt posting the exact same links in 20 years

Dude, nobodies denying that WE play a part in this.
Wtf????? This is definitely a 2 way street and a testiment to OUR stupidity. No other group would allow this. No other group would rap and make songs about destroying themselves and sell it to the world.

Hell, that's the biggest issue. I agree with everything you are saying but you alluding that this is some sort of conspiracy has you looking funny in the light.

Check out the first 10 seconds of this video. Listen to what he says:





In 2022, If you don't believe that there was a concerted effort to weaponize rap music against blacks i don't know what to tell ya my dude.

I know it's a tough pill to swallow.

 

[Mike the Executioner]

While not gangsta rap, the initial success of Public Enemy also backs this up. I don't think any label exec thought the political raps of Public Enemy would appeal to white kids. Despite many urban radio stations refusing to play their music they had multiple gold and platinum albums in large part because white kids viewed it as subversive music. What better way to annoy your suburban white parents than to blast Fight The Power? And by the time they started collaborating with metal bands, the cross over was complete.

Looking back, Public Enemy's success was crazy. They were talking about supporting Farrakhan, the FBI tapping their phones, and Elvis being a racist, but they were selling like Run-D.M.C. at the same time. They were able to channel the aggression and rebellion from rock music and put it in a different form without trying to cross over. People crossed over to them. New Kids on the Block were wearing their shirts on stage.

 

[O.Red]

Dude, nobodies denying that WE play a part in this.
Wtf????? This is definitely a 2 way street and a testiment to OUR stupidity. No other group would allow this. No other group would rap and make songs about destroying themselves and sell it to the world.

Hell, that's the biggest issue. I agree with everything you are saying but you alluding that this is some sort of conspiracy has you looking funny in the light.

Check out the first 10 seconds of this video. Listen to what he says:





In 2022, If you don't believe that there was a concerted effort to weaponize rap music against blacks i don't know what to tell ya my dude.

I know it's a tough pill to swallow.

This is how I know you're not reading or your comprehension just ain't all there

I agreed a few posts ago that it's being weaponized. I called bullshyt on it being hijacked

If you now agree that it was sold to the world where's the concerted effort? That's where you conspiracy heads lose people and get into tinfoil hat shyt when it's usually a lot simpler than you make it

Then ended with that "I know it's a tough pill to swallow" bullshyt like you're dropping knowledge

You screaming at the clouds trying to be smarter than you are

 

[ISO]

I highly disagree and alot of others would disagree with this take also my G.

How you can listen to rap and watch the videos and say that it doesn't invoke the negative stereotypes that were purposely pushed throughout history of blacks is insane to me.

Rap Music has literally reduced the image of the black man to drugdealers, thugs and gangbangers. A menace to society.

Rap Music is a continuation of their mass media attack on the image of blacks.

The fact that black people can't see this is insane to me

I don’t disagree with that.

The difference between a minstrel show and modern day gangsta rap is that it was whites writing and performing minstrel shows. That’s different from today where rappers are the ones writing, producing, and performing the music. Where the black masses are the one who determine what’s cool. Why ain’t Cordae and Joey Badass multi?

You’re not seeing my points and I don’t see how labels are at fault and I don’t see conspiracy here this is supply and demand and unfortunately the shyt is constitutionally protected. Labels would get behind conscious rap again if people supported it. One of the biggest reasons for that conscious rap of the late 80’s and early 90’s is that those rappers were part of huge movements that don’t have reverence today/died out. Zulu Nation, NOI, 5% Nation, Panafricanists, etc. In modern day Harlem you don’t even see the street speakers of old. The entire 90’s NYC hip hop was influenced by those movements. Today we have gangs and BLM.