Who ranks higher , Timmy or Kobe ?
- Thread starter bucks3115
- Start date
It wasn't "regular". During the Shaq-Kobe years they went 3-2 against the Spurs with Duncan not having a sidekick or lineup anything close to the Lakers' level.
Pop said his strategy was to focus on getting the ball out of Shaq's hands and leave Kobe single-covered hoping he'd shoot them out of the game. Sometimes it worked and sometimes it didn't, but it's the main reason Kobe had crazy FGA in those series.
The only year 1999-2004 where Kobe clearly looked like the best player on the court was 2001 and that was when Duncan had his WOAT lineup (due to injuries, career bench player Antonio Daniels was forced to be Duncan's #2 AND guard Kobe on the other end).
Duncan was the best player in '99, '02, and '03 and in '04 Duncan had been dealing with injuries and still played them pretty much even.
Duncan wasn't a complete player and Kobe was?
In his prime Duncan was the Spurs' dominant scorer (both inside and outside), rebounder, defender, on-court leader, and the guy they ran their offense through. Claiming he wasn't a complete player is wild.
Breh you talk like you weren't even around the Spurs until the 2010s.
There was NO question who the best Spur was from 1998-2008. Most of those years Timmy was an MVP candidate and they didn't even have another all-star around him.
I understand what Pops strategy was against the Lakers, it's effectiveness explains the losing record and doesn't take away from the fact that Kobe used to regularly cook the Spurs in the playoffs.
And while we're at it, Kobe is a career 4-2 against the Spurs. In 2008 he very noticeably was the best player in that series with the Spurs coming off a 2007 championship with 29-6-5 and no Shaq for you to try to marginalize his excellence. And let's be real, 21-6-4 in the playoffs at an age where Tim Duncan was still not winning shyt in college is extra credit, it doesn't work against a players legacy being a 20 year old in the league. If you gotta use that to bolster Tim Duncan's legacy in comparison to him then.
Last edited:
Its effectiveness was beating the Kobe-Shaq Lakers twice despite them having 2 MVP candidates and the Spurs not even having anyone close to all-star level next to Duncan most of those years.
The only year that Kobe "cooked" was 2001 when the Spurs had their #1 and #2 swings get knocked out and fielded an absolute shyt team that had no chance. The other years Duncan played better than Kobe ('99, '02, and '03) or even ('04 when Duncan played hurt).
And while we're at it, Kobe is a career 4-2 against the Spurs. In 2008 he very noticeably was the best player in that series with the Spurs coming off a 2007 championship with 29-6-5 and no Shaq for you to try to marginalize his excellence.
'07 is irrelevant to '08 because Horry was out, Manu got hurt, and most of the Spurs cast was aged out and ready to retire. San Antonio was a 2-man team by the playoffs and Kobe was scoring on two guys who were 36+ and a guard whose ankle was the size of a grapefruit.
It's effectiveness lead to a losing record and you harping on 20 year old Kobe's performance to make your point about Duncan. What was Duncan doing in the league at 20?
Right.
You gotta come up with a lot of excuses for why Kobe used to cook the Spurs bro. Stop it.
Check the tape
Duncan: 2 MVPs and 2 runner-up finishes
Kobe: 1 MVP and 1 runner-up
Duncan: 3 Finals MVPs, best player on 4-5 title teams
Kobe: 2 Finals MVPs, best player on 2 title teams
Duncan: 15 All-NBA selections, 10 1st-team selections
Kobe: 15 All-NBA selections, 11 1st-team selections
Duncan: 15 All-Defensive selections
Kobe: 12 All-Defensive selections (but most in the second half were a huge stretch)
Finals record is stupid, but Duncan is 5-1 while Kobe is 5-2, so according to the people who claim Finals losses are a bad thing.....
Kobe was the better scorer but Duncan was the more efficient scorer
Duncan was the better defender
Duncan was the better rebounder
And Duncan's '03 title run was more impressive than any Kobe run considering the team he pulled there. In the absolute most difficult to score season in NBA history and with a 20yo TP as his #2:
Duncan averaged 28-12-5 and 1.3 blocks/game on 53% shooting to take out the Shaq-Kobe lakers
Duncan averaged 28-17-6 and 3 blocks/game on 57% shooting to take out the Dirk-Nash mavs
Duncan averaged 24-17-5 and 5 blocks/game on 50% shooting to take out the Kidd-KMart-Jefferson nets
Again, all that in the TOUGHEST defensive season in NBA history, when hand-checking and zones were both legal and pace was slow as fukk. No kobe run was nearly that impressive on both ends of the court.
Duncan's got this, and it's "close" in some ways but still indisputable.
Duncan: 2 MVPs and 2 runner-up finishes
Kobe: 1 MVP and 1 runner-up
Duncan: 3 Finals MVPs, best player on 4-5 title teams
Kobe: 2 Finals MVPs, best player on 2 title teams
Duncan: 15 All-NBA selections, 10 1st-team selections
Kobe: 15 All-NBA selections, 11 1st-team selections
Duncan: 15 All-Defensive selections
Kobe: 12 All-Defensive selections (but most in the second half were a huge stretch)
Finals record is stupid, but Duncan is 5-1 while Kobe is 5-2, so according to the people who claim Finals losses are a bad thing.....
Kobe was the better scorer but Duncan was the more efficient scorer
Duncan was the better defender
Duncan was the better rebounder
And Duncan's '03 title run was more impressive than any Kobe run considering the team he pulled there. In the absolute most difficult to score season in NBA history and with a 20yo TP as his #2:
Duncan averaged 28-12-5 and 1.3 blocks/game on 53% shooting to take out the Shaq-Kobe lakers
Duncan averaged 28-17-6 and 3 blocks/game on 57% shooting to take out the Dirk-Nash mavs
Duncan averaged 24-17-5 and 5 blocks/game on 50% shooting to take out the Kidd-KMart-Jefferson nets
Again, all that in the TOUGHEST defensive season in NBA history, when hand-checking and zones were both legal and pace was slow as fukk. No kobe run was nearly that impressive on both ends of the court.
Duncan's got this, and it's "close" in some ways but still indisputable.
You're the one making excuses breh, I already pointed out to you that your claims he cooked them every year were false. You're bytching about Kobe's age when Duncan was just 2 years older than him and had 2 years less experience in the NBA and a far worse supporting cast.
1999: Duncan 29-11-3 and 2 blocks/game on 51% shooting
Kobe 21-7-4 and 2 steals/game on 45% shooting
2001: Duncan 23-12-4 and 4 blocks/game on 48% shooting
Kobe 33-7-7 and 1 block/game on 51% shooting
2002: Duncan 29-17-5 and 3 blocks/game on 43% shooting
Kobe 26-5-5 and 1 steal/game on 46% shooting
2003: Duncan 28-12-5 and 1 block/game on 53% shooting
Kobe 32-5-4 and 1 steal/game on 43% shooting
2004: Duncan21-12-3 and 2 blocks/game on 47% shooting (playing injured)
Kobe 26-6-6 and 2 steals/game on 46% shooting
Kobe wasn't even the focus of the Spurs defense, he got to volume shoot as much as he wanted, and he STILL only cooked the Spurs in 2001 when he faced an absolutely shyt lineup with no perimeter defenders. What other season did he cook them? Since when is 26-5-5 on mediocre shooting as the 2nd option "cooking" a team? Or shytty volume shooting in a loss even though you had a dominant Shaq right next to you?
In the Shaq-Kobe era, Duncan was clearly the better player than Kobe and everyone agreed on this. It's the reason when Duncan won 2 MVPs, 2 MVP runner-ups, and 3 Finals MVPs in that span while Kobe didn't field a single one.
Name 1 excuse I've made? I've acknowledged Kobe is 4-2 vs Duncan in the post season. You're the one who comes in here with one sided excuse making for why things didn't go Duncan's way. And then get mad when I call you on that. Pointing out Kobe was 20 in one of the years you keep arguing is excuse making? I'm going to need you to walk back every age related statement you've made then. Because it will then seem to me like context only matters when it fits your narrative, which is why I had to call you out since you're clearly in here with bias.
And the topic is Timmy or Kobe, who ranks higher all time. Not Timmy or Kobe in the Shaq-Kobe era. Either actually adhere to the topic or stop with all this loose ass rhetoric.
Last edited:
But they did go Duncan's way. He has 5 titles as team leader, more than twice as many as Kobe, and got his team to the playoffs every year and deep most years. He can't help it that Kobe didn't even play well enough to face him most of those seasons.
Which is meaningless in a team sport when Kobe wasn't even the best player in 80% of those series and literally every time he faced Duncan's Spurs his team was stacked. If Kobe had gotten crap teams deep in the playoffs like Duncan did, then his record against the Spurs would be ass because he would have lost to them in '05, '06, '07, and '12. And would have lost in '13 and '14 too if he wasn't injured.
The only reason Kobe has a positive record against Duncan is because Duncan regularly drug absolute shyt teams deep into the playoffs. Those '01 and '02 lineups were horrible. Whereas when Kobe had shyt teams he never faced the Spurs, who would have destroyed him. The peak Kobe-Shaq Lakers got to play Duncan's Spurs 5 times, but Duncan's best squads never got to rack up any easy wins on bad Kobe-led teams.
You said Kobe was only 20yo in 1999 as if that means that year doesn't count or some shyt.
I already posted on the topic and you ignored it.
Duncan has more MVPs, more Finals MVPs, more MVP runner-ups, more All-Defensive teams, more titles as the team leader, more impressive Finals runs, and a more consistent history of performing well regardless of his supporting cast.
Literally all you can argue for Kobe is a better head-to-head when they don't even guard each other and Kobe wasn't even the best player on his team.
The argument is over.
@Rhakim is not even trying to acknowledge 2008.
Like he straight up erases that in every one of his posts and got all kind of words for why in this all time debate, 2008 don't count talking about age.
But then when I talk about Kobe being 20, I'm making excuses.
2-4 but things were going Duncan's way. Oh right, they weren't, Tim Duncan was hurt (but playing), his teammates weren't up to snuff, the Spurs were too old, the Spurs perimeter defense was weak, etc, etc, etc, excuse, excuse, excuse.
What was Tim Duncan doing aged 20 in this all time debate again? Getting bounced early in the March Madness?
Like he straight up erases that in every one of his posts and got all kind of words for why in this all time debate, 2008 don't count talking about age.
But then when I talk about Kobe being 20, I'm making excuses.
2-4 but things were going Duncan's way. Oh right, they weren't, Tim Duncan was hurt (but playing), his teammates weren't up to snuff, the Spurs were too old, the Spurs perimeter defense was weak, etc, etc, etc, excuse, excuse, excuse.
What was Tim Duncan doing aged 20 in this all time debate again? Getting bounced early in the March Madness?
Last edited:
My nikka even pop would pick kobe
I’m not reading these paragraphs. It’s Kobe. And I don’t know who it was but trying to downplay Kobe sending Tim home in 5 and being regarded as the better player when they were both in their primes is pretty funny. The Spurs were leading basically every game by double digits and Tim couldn’t close while Kobe basically beat the Spurs on mid range jumpers. No else on the Lakers did shyt that series. I have no idea what son is talking about saying the Spurs were thin. The Lakers were young, inexperienced and giving up big leads. Bean was simply the best in the world. There was legitimately a span from 2005 to 2013 when Kobe went down that no one considered Tim better but Spurs stans and Kobr haters. Like that is literally half their careers and an entire period with no Shaq. They’re close but Bean edges. It’s probably easier to build around Tim though but he’s not doing shyt with the 05 yo 07 Lakers either. Tim Smush Walton Odom Kwame aren’t winning shyt.
Kobe beat Duncan head to head so many times.
Better poll would be who is better all time Duncan or LeBron.
Better poll would be who is better all time Duncan or LeBron.
How come Duncan was never lead his team to back to back titles despite having a HOF backcourt for a decade plus and a GOAT level coach?
He didn’t even play on a team that went to 2 straight finals until he was a role player in 2014
He didn’t even play on a team that went to 2 straight finals until he was a role player in 2014