Why are so many of you still holding onto American exceptionalism?

[DrBanneker]

With all things considered, America is really one of the few countries where people can really make something of themselves regardless of their outcome at birth (not saying it won't be hard or there won't be obstacles).

I look at my parent's immigrant story. I can't think of any other country where this might have been close to possible (maybe Canada but there's a "ceiling" of sorts, similar to the EU).

As an immigrant it’s funny to see how people born here hate it so much while every immigrant in the world loves the US and is dying to come here. America is far from perfect but it’s still the top destination for a better life.

While we’re at it...what country is overall better than the US?

I acknowledge your perspective and it isn't wrong. The US has a lot going for it and I am not planning on bailing to anywhere else unless shyt gets 1930s-ish.

However, you need to understand why the AA perspective, even amongst successful Blacks, seems to clash with the immigrant perspective. It's not that we don't value America or opportunity, etc. etc.

For immigrants, especially from bad situations, America is where you can come to start anew and make your own road, story, etc. Whatever country you came from, you leave that historical baggage behind if you want to. Americans are historically illiterate they barely know what Russian Jews or Ibos are, much less czarist pogroms or Biafra. Combine that with a relatively open marketplace and you can do your thing.


On the other hand, Black Americans with deep ties in this country basically all have to constantly battle with history. That historical baggage and crap you left at the airport abroad is in our face and on our back from cradle to grave. That's what people don't get about how Black immigrants do well, besides the regular thing of immigrants being self-selected. A Black immigrant facing racism in interactions is not the same as an entire Black community dealing with historical BS and intergenerational poverty you mainly see from the outside in. Also, you are a good foil for the American meritocracy. If Nigerians and Jamaicans can make it, the only answer is AAs, in general, ain't shyt. You become part of the narrative whether you like it or not.

 

[phcitywarrior]

I acknowledge your perspective and it isn't wrong. The US has a lot going for it and I am not planning on bailing to anywhere else unless shyt gets 1930s-ish......

I respect your post. I'm not AA/ADOS so I can't speak on the history, relationships etc.

However, from what I've seen in my travels around the world. If I were AA, I'd still prefer to be in the US over anywhere else.

 

[Cynic]

Your family settled in the most "exceptional" place in America.

NYC is literally the epitome of the American Dream for all foreigners. Are you even serious right now?

No shyt this country is a different experience for black and brown people. No one said America is perfect. Why do you guys keep going down this road?

This is a discussion based on RELATIVISM. How do we compare to the rest of the world. And I hate to break the news to you, but your parents clearly knew better than you do and they picked one of the best places on Earth to resettle and provide a better life for you.

And like i said earlier, I'm open to hearing about which countries are more "exceptional" than America. All we have so far is Canada, and some Asian kid thinking Taiwan and Singapore are good places for the common person. Feel free to chime in and let us all know which "exceptional" country is best for black and brown people.

And @Pressure you can stop being a little bytch at any time. You wanna come at my thesis go for it. Stop saying shyt then ducking out when you cant answer my simple question. You clearly can't come up with a more exceptional country than America so maybe the entire premise of this thread is dumb af.

Suka blet!

There isnt a nation that offers more inclusivity than America, as a black man, im not entertaining any other nation... and I believe this conversation is silly on this board.

You saw what happened to George Floyd and Breanna Taylor ... Statist aggression against unarmed civilians based on their melanin content isn't inclusive - it's retroactive.

There are glaring social issues which not personally impact you but they impact others.

 

[Cynic]

@ the way lefties discount military might and its ability to maintain world peace and preserve life.
I cant think of anything thats preserved more innocent life, and provided peace and stability for mankind than America's military might.

Ya'll talking like its Canada's healthcare thats preventing genocides in Sudan and Syria...

Would you be comfortable with aliens putting 800 military bases on earth to "maintain peace and preserve life " ?

The military is nothing but a bloated occupying force to prop up defense stocks and keep the citizenry employed while dominating the world.

There is no ethereal benevolent cause except to keep the petrodollar afloat.

Where them Iraq WMDs bReh?

Still waiting on you Lockheed Martin boys to tell us where Gadaffis gold went ?

All that military might got washed by Afghan goat herders and viet changs in flip flops.

Even failed to get Assad out the paint


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Exceptional

 

[DrBanneker]

I respect your post. I'm not AA/ADOS so I can't speak on the history, relationships etc.

However, from what I've seen in my travels around the world. If I were AA, I'd still prefer to be in the US over anywhere else.

I have traveled and lived abroad and I don't disagree. I am not saying we would be better off in another country. I mean this in a population-wide, collective sense though; I have seen plenty of AAs do better and live happier abroad but I question if their situation would scale easily into the millions, especially in Europe not to mention Asia.

You just have to understand why this is both encouraging and damning simultaneously. America was never the land of milk and honey for us that even Black immigrants perceive it as. Almost all immigrant groups, two to three generations in, are basically integrated and seen as just another flavor of the majority. Hispanics seem headed that way too. I don't think we will ever be that but I am not a die hard integrationist either and would like AA to retain community and culture.

We have always loved and fought for our country, warts and all, but knowing and having experienced those warts, we have a deeper, and sometimes sadly cynical, view of the entirety of the American experience. Not sure if I am explaining this well.

 

[phcitywarrior]

Not sure if I am explaining this well.

You definitely explained it very well. And yes, I fully won't be able to comprehend a few things being that I'm an immigrant. There are some lived experiences and history I just will never have.

 

[ColdSlither]

Holding on to American exceptionalism? I don't even love America. Not loving it is what allows me to see its faults that needs to be fixed.