A QUESTION FOR THE OLD HEADS.....DID ILLMATIC REALLY HAVE AS MUCH OF AN IMPACT AS PEOPLE SAY.....

[Kill Dat Noize]

Personally I'm of the belief that sales have little to do with impact. Like GRODT sold a shyt ton of records but that's cause 50 had that crossover appeal and cause he was bein hyped up by Eminem and he had catchy songs and shyt. When you sell a fukkin million records in a week it ain't all hip hop nikkas coppin that shyt. It's casuals. So with all due respect, just cause you sell X amount of copies doesn't mean you're really impacting the GAME more than the next nikka. It could mean a lotta things. MC Hammer went plat and ain't no rappers tryna sound like his ass at the time.

Fact is HIP HOP took notice when Illmatic dropped. Who cares if Becky from West Virginia didn't cop the shyt. That album MOVED the game in a different direction.

 

[Wacky D]

Personally I'm of the belief that sales have little to do with impact. Like GRODT sold a shyt ton of records but that's cause 50 had that crossover appeal and cause he was bein hyped up by Eminem and he had catchy songs and shyt. When you sell a fukkin million records in a week it ain't all hip hop nikkas coppin that shyt. It's casuals. So with all due respect, just cause you sell X amount of copies doesn't mean you're really impacting the GAME more than the next nikka. It could mean a lotta things. MC Hammer went plat and ain't no rappers tryna sound like his ass at the time.

Fact is HIP HOP took notice when Illmatic dropped. Who cares if Becky from West Virginia didn't cop the shyt. That album MOVED the game in a different direction.

I cant stand 50 cent bu

in the hip-hop world, 50 made a huge impact before he even got down with aftermath. culturally, Eminem was the one that benefited from being down with 50.

I agree with the point that youre trying to make but 50 cent is a horrible example.

 

[How Sway?]

I cant stand 50 cent bu

in the hip-hop world, 50 made a huge impact before he even got down with aftermath. culturally, Eminem was the one that benefited from being down with 50.

I agree with the point that youre trying to make but 50 cent is a horrible example.

You gotta explain this one I have an idea what you mean but i'm not sure

 

[Kill Dat Noize]

I cant stand 50 cent bu

in the hip-hop world, 50 made a huge impact before he even got down with aftermath. culturally, Eminem was the one that benefited from being down with 50.

I agree with the point that youre trying to make but 50 cent is a horrible example.

My bad if it sounded like I was tryna get at 50. That wasn't my intention. Actually I love 50. I'm just sayin that album sellin millions upon millions of copies didn't really mean shyt when it came to movin the needle. That same year you saw Lil Jon and that crunk shyt start to really make wave and then of course you had Kanye a lil bit after that. Yea 50 and G-Unit had the game in a vice grip but I gotta be honest their significance on the culture didn't really measure up when you look back in retrospect.

50 was just a really, REALLY popular rapper for a few short years and that was about it. Compare him to a dude like Weezy who literally changed the game and moved the needle... even if some of the punks on here don't wanna give the man his credit.

 

[lutha]

Stop trying to play up for the camera, lil nikka.
If you were really there culturally.
We would not be having this discussion.
it is completely obvious to anyone in the know culturally.
That you exhibit the experiences of someone who does not and did not culturally experience what was to it when illmatic dropped.
If youu did ,...
You would be talking about it from a cultural standpoint and not one of sales.
Let alone mentioning the chronic that dropped on Oct 5, 1992.
The same year year and day that common sense and Redman debuted.
Also,...
If you want to be entertained by getting tabled by me.
By even bringing up why the chronic never got five mics.
Make a thread, asking why the source never have the chronic five mics originally.
You keep mentioning the chronic because you can only refer back to the nineties using mainstream mtv basd ideals.
Not actual real cultural experiences.
That alternatively, I have consistently provided .
Not just in this thread a lone.
Yet for close to twenty years online in the cultural context.
alternatively, You have provided nuffin.


Talking about culture, then using your talks about sales as validation in a discussion about culture.
Already shows you have no idea wtf, you even talembout.


Art Barr

what the fukk you talking about?...not once in my post did I mention sales....as for the albums you mentioned, I know when they came out, I bought them....also, I kept mentioning the chronic cause it was just as good an album as illmatic, had a bigger impact on the culture, yet it didn't get the hype illmatic did in part due to media bias...

now: if you wanna continue this convo, make points in regards to what I posted, not some made up shyt in your head

 

[MINT]

 

[Wacky D]

You gotta explain this one I have an idea what you mean but i'm not sure

50 cent made Eminem somewhat relevant in urban America during that time. not just Eminem but aftermath had no real presence in the streets before 50. and seeing that 50 had his own imprint, aftermath still didn't have much of a wave, but they still benefited.

before 50, he was just a TRL rapper for the most part. then when he got down with 50, hes trying to hop in beefs, hes on mixtapes, hes relentlessy wearing du-rags, etc etc.

My bad if it sounded like I was tryna get at 50. That wasn't my intention. Actually I love 50. I'm just sayin that album sellin millions upon millions of copies didn't really mean shyt when it came to movin the needle. That same year you saw Lil Jon and that crunk shyt start to really make wave and then of course you had Kanye a lil bit after that. Yea 50 and G-Unit had the game in a vice grip but I gotta be honest their significance on the culture didn't really measure up when you look back in retrospect.

50 was just a really, REALLY popular rapper for a few short years and that was about it. Compare him to a dude like Weezy who literally changed the game and moved the needle... even if some of the punks on here don't wanna give the man his credit.

dog, 50 RULED 2003 and was huge thru that whole era. and I don't even like dude, but the run that he had was something that doesn't come around too often, and we havnt seen anything like that since.

lil jon, lil wayne, kanye west. none of those dudes could carry 50's towel. its not even a comparison.

 

[Kill Dat Noize]

dog, 50 RULED 2003 and was huge thru that whole era. and I don't even like dude, but the run that he had was something that doesn't come around too often, and we havnt seen anything like that since.

lil jon, lil wayne, kanye west. none of those dudes could carry 50's towel. its not even a comparison.

You're not gettin it man. Yea 50 was the #1 dude in the game popularity wise but his music wasn't havin that same effect on the culture. 50 and G-Unit existed in like a vacuum where they were just like in their own space. They had huge hits on the radio but outside of In Da Club no one from that camp were droppin game changers. Did they have the mixtape game on smash? Absolutely. Was 50 head and shoulders the most colossal dude in the game? Absolutely.

But Lil Jon came in and CHANGED THE GAME. You had east coast muthafukkas tryna make crunk records cause that was the sound that was gaining the most ground. The south was takin over. Then you had Kanye come in like around 04 and I don't even have to tell you the type of impact he had on this shyt. Muthafukka practically wiped the slate clean with gangsta rap in only a few short years. By Graduation 50... and everyone makin music like 50... was a fukkin artifact.

Wayne's been hot now since like 05... 07 if you wanna say the shyt started with DD3. And he's STILL a dominant force in the game. Not like he was back in like 08-09 but he's still a major player. But like I said Weezy CHANGED THE GAME. His style, the way he was rappin, his metaphors, his punchlines... shyt was contagious. His stamp... his DNA... it's ALL OVER this era. Him and Kanye are like the fukkin SYMBOLS of these last 5-6 years... at least as far as mainstream hip hop are concerned. Meanwhile 50 has become a fukkin joke and can't even get a hot song out there.

And I'm again I'm NOT tryna disrespect 50 cause I love the man's music even to this day but his success on the charts and his dominance really didn't do much when you consider the overall impact it had on the culture and the music. You couldn't really point to a single time in the last 10 years and be like... "Yea this shyt all started with 50 and G-Unit". I mean yea they definitely changed the way rappers came up with the mixtapes and shyt... actually you could say 50 REVOLUTIONIZED the mixtape scene... but his impact on the MUSIC and the CULTURE doesn't compare.

 

[intilectual recipricol]

no one listened to illmatic in 94... even today nikkaz dont. Thats why im able to drop a garbage ass line in any thread and nikkaz clown the line, then I tell em it was drom illmatic and they start coppin pleas.

kinda like when I tell my OG about the story about the bears killin the 42 kids because they made fun of a bald guys head and she thought it was horrific, then i let her know that its directly from her bible and she wanna cop pleas...

nobody gave a shyt about that album, but about 60 nikkaz in Queens and art barr

 

[gluvnast]

what's tripping me out about this thread is people are acting and trying to make it seem like illmatic came out at a time when there was a bunch of bullshyt coming out...and that's far from the truth...during that time, we were getting quality music every month....there were just as good, if not better albums that came out around the same time of illmatic...ex: outkast - southernplayalistic.....that's why it didn't have this huge impact like people trying to say...the only place it impacted like that was ny...the rest of the country, not so much...people thought it was a good to great album, but that's about it....and i'm not hating on the album, I had the bootleg and bought a retail couple of the album when it dropped...

Um, here's another one that presume 1994 and no different from 2013. During that time period, you didn't have the internet that makes the hip hop world smaller. Second, hip hop at that time was region based, not like how it is today where you could be from anywhere and no matter what region you are from anybody from another region will be f*cking with it. Back in those days, the west coast only played west coast music. East coast only played their sh*t. And the South generally was west coast leaning or only f*cked with that miami bass sound, until Outkast came along and nobody is arguing that Southernplayalistic... didn't have impact either, but that's not in discussion right now.

Illmatic is the Citizen Kane of rap albums. Something that upon its release wasn't a huge commercial success but decades upon decades later is regarded as one of the most influential and impactful things ever released.

 

[up in here]

My question is, why would y'all think people would go back and pick an album that didn't move units and wasn't a nationwide hit and all of a sudden start using it as THE definitive hip hop album against which all other hip hop albums are to be compared? If it had zero impact as people in here are suggesting, why call that album the hip hop bible? Why not choose The Chronic or Doggystyle or RTD? Why choose a random nas album that was a commercial failure?

 

[intilectual recipricol]

My question is, why would y'all think people would go back and pick an album that didn't move units and wasn't a nationwide hit and all of a sudden start using it as THE definitive hip hop album against which all other hip hop albums are to be compared? If it had zero impact as people in here are suggesting, why call that album the hip hop bible? Why not choose The Chronic or Doggystyle or RTD? Why choose a random nas album that was a commercial failure?

Its not revisionist thats why. You gotta understand the landscape. This was before the EC/WC beef, and the east centric hip hop mags/media were shyttin on everything not from the East. The mags hyped the shyt outta illmatic... then it was a tremendous failure, so much so that naS had to go back and copy the style of shyt that ACTUALLY HAD AN IMPACT. think about that, other nikkaz didnt go back and make illmatic soundin shyt, naS went back and made shyt that sounded like what other people were doing AND THEN HE MOVED UNITS.

 

[up in here]

Its not revisionist thats why. You gotta understand the landscape. This was before the EC/WC beef, and the east centric hip hop mags/media were shyttin on everything not from the East. The mags hyped the shyt outta illmatic... then it was a tremendous failure, so much so that naS had to go back and copy the style of shyt that ACTUALLY HAD AN IMPACT. think about that, other nikkaz didnt go back and make illmatic soundin shyt, naS went back and made shyt that sounded like what other people were doing AND THEN HE MOVED UNITS.

So why would it still get praise to this very day? A lot of albums get hype, flop and are forgotten forever. If illmatic really had zero impact, why would it still to this day be recognized as THE quintessential hip hop album?

 

[intilectual recipricol]

So why would it still get praise to this very day? A lot of albums get hype, flop and are forgotten forever. If illmatic really had zero impact, why would it still to this day be recognized as THE quintessential hip hop album?

Its not. Thats the point, look at this thread. Only old dust heads or NY nikkaz are sayin it had any impact at all. The hype cant go away because the magazines hyped it, its not like they can pull back all the magazines and change em. Dumb nikkaz fell for the hype. For the record the Source also rated that Lil Kim shyt 5 mics... over The Chronic, Doggystyle, MATW, AEOM, and 7DT... is that lil kim shyt really better?

 

[gluvnast]

So why would it still get praise to this very day? A lot of albums get hype, flop and are forgotten forever. If illmatic really had zero impact, why would it still to this day be recognized as THE quintessential hip hop album?

I said it before, I say it again: WORD OF MOUTH.