You might be right, but I wouldn’t count him out just yet. Caucuses can be weird. Two out of the first three contests are caucuses.
2020 Democratic Primary Thread: Focus on House & Senate races
- Thread starter mc_brew
- Start date
Do white women like kamala more than tulsi gabbard and amy klobuchar and gillibrand?"He's just too real" is a weird critique of Bernie, but okay.
Let's talk about Kamala and her utter failure. Posed to finish behind Yang, the 4cac meme candidate. I think it's entirely due to the racism of white women. They were reluctantly fukking with Kamala at first, but when the media started pushing Warren, they breathed a sigh of relief. Hillary 2.0, but without 25 years of programmed hate from the right. And the Indian thing doesn't bother them in the slightest because they're racist.
Sorry, Kamala. Female solidarity wasn't as real as you were hoping for.
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@tru_m.a.c hey breh where’s that thread on the congressional races. Maybe you should sticky that to keep us up to date on what’s going on.
storyteller
Veteran
My only real complaint here is that you're calling Bernie disingenuous for giving an honest answer with a different strategy aimed at the same goal (reducing the racial wage gap). He literally said "nah, I have a better idea" to cash reparations. His "better idea" is 10 20 30 and when he had more than a debate clock to explain it, he brought up HBCU's, black owned banks and black owned businesses as targets for funds as well as targeting systemic racism (referencing redlining as an example). That's not a platitude, it's a substantive answer that suggests the same end goal as cash reparations would be targeting.
Playing politics wouldn't be asking for clarification so that he could give an answer that everyone knew wouldn't go over well. Playing politics would be just saying "I support a study..." Because he does and that's all we know about any of those other candidates. I'm not kidding or fronting when I say that I believe if a commission came back and said "cash reparations are the best solutions..." that Bernie would be more likely to attempt to implement the suggestion in earnest than 3/4's of that list of candidates you named (Warren I'd trust to completely). That's why I say he has the same position as all the other candidates, unless they've actually expressed open support for cash reparations then they don't have a stance on cash reparations for you to point to. Marianne Williamson does and that's it. She's got Bernie beat on the issue. Otherwise, they're all signed on to the same thing. Bernie could give you the same answer as the rest of them and would not be lying at all.
ADevilYouKhow
Rhyme Reason
I supported Bernie in 2016, and Obama in 08. So caucuses actually have helped my candidates in the last two democratic primaries. I also think it could help both Bernie, and Warren in this cycle. However, I still don’t support caucuses. IMO they should be illegal. They are undemocratic, and don’t truly capture how much support a candidate have. Both caucuses and the electoral college need to be in the bushes, so we can have a true democracy.
We are going have to agree to disagree about if it was disingenuous. I think we both made a clear argument on why we believe what we believe.
If other candidates come out and state explicitly that they don’t support monetary reparations, I will have the same criticism for them. The only thing i’m asking is that whoever the dem candidate/next president is support HR40 fully, and don’t steer the commission.
One last thing in reparations. Let’s compare it to the fight for gay marriage. If you remember, most dems didn’t support it. Instead they supported civil unions. Civil unions would of gave gay people the exact same rights as straight married people. The LBGTQ community rejected civil unions and demanded gay marries even though civil unions were the same thing. Some Black people feel the same way about reparations. Part of reparations is the acknowledgment of the wrong doing, and taking active steps to reverse it.
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storyteller
Veteran
Yeah, that's fair.
The fact that Bernie believes there are better solutions is exactly why a commission and a study is required, which is to say that he fully supports HR 40.
The belief that he would ignore those conclusions or push the committee to ignore potential solutions is a fear that warrants mentioning; but it's pure speculation...I equate that sort of speculation to people feeling Warren doesn't really support M4A because of some questionable rhetoric. Just because Warren has expressed being open to hearing other solutions and her campaign manager has said Bernie's fully written out bill is a framework; I can look back at her record and her comments on other issues to come away confident that she'll make the most practical choice when push comes to shove. I feel the same way for Bernie. That's why I leave the silo of reparations and explore the rest of his rhetoric with regards to the PoC. He's spoken on systemic racism with regards to the prison system and housing; he's proposing increased funds to HBCU's and spoken openly about pumping more funding to black owned businesses and banks. He talks the talk on all of those issues, so I trust that if HR 40's study concluded with cash payments as the best solution; he would be willing to move from his stance that there are better solutions to income inequality.
Out of curiosity, how do you define reparations and what would constitutes markers of a successful reparations program (as in what measurables would you be watching for)? I hear everything you're saying and agree with all of it. But I think acknowledging the wrong doing and taking active steps to reverse it absolutely exists in Bernie's responses with or without him co-signing cash payments when he speaks on redlining, the prison industrial complex, discriminatory lending practices to people of color. Those answers are what I keep coming back to and thinking, "he recognizes the problems and has ideas for how to address them."
this chick is GARBAGE 
Yeah I've been meaning to since we're a day out. Been busy on the homefront. I'll up it now and work on it this weekend.
this chick is GARBAGE
Clearly an agent. Her supporters are trash.
