Dwight easily getting in
Big Ben 2021 HOF
- Thread starter Controversy
- Start date
one of the GOATS, my childhood forever preserved in the hall 
Negro Caesar
Superstar
Ud argue that a 4x defensive player of the year isn’t a better defender than a man that didn’t even make 1 all defensive team?So Big Ben was selected to the 2021 HOF class
No one in their right mind can convince me that Ben was a basketball better player than Sheed or even Chauncey
I'd even argue that Ben wasn't a better defender than Sheed
I know counting stats seduces y'all...but Sheed was one of the best defenders at the PF position in nba history
Ben was an active help defender who accumulated counting stats
There was a reason Pistons won a title as soon as they got Sheed
Congrats to Ben tho
Controversy
Superstar
In your mind, Gobert is a top defender in the league. Big diff between help defender & a lockdown defender. Which do you consider more valuable?
Negro Caesar
Superstar
In my mind? Just read a article yesterday where Gobert having greatest defensive season ever.
So yes. He not DPOY to u? Who is?
Lakerman0834
Veteran
CasualSheed being better defensively than Ben is a ridiculous take. He's not even the better post defender despite being significantly taller/bigger. And Ben was also capable of guarding on the perimeter, Sheed's fat/lazy ass wasn't switching out and guarding wings for shyt.
Sheed is obviously more talented, but Ben being in the hall over him is a testament to work ethic. Sheed would be an easy first ballot HOFer and an a consistent all-NBA guy if he brought his A game every night. But he coasted through games and was content being just pretty good instead of great on most nights. Ben maximized his abilities, despite being no where near as skilled and talented.
Controversy
Superstar
Gobert isn't the type of guy you can throw at an all star caliber big like an AD, Joker, Embiid, Giannis and say hold him to under 22
Based on the eye test, Jrue Holiday doesn't get enough respect and I feel he has been excellent defensively this season
Ppl have Benamin winning but he doesn't check superstars for 4 qtrs, only in spurts
I value man to man defense, and guys that can defend their position well...help defense is a support function, not primary defensive function
And guys that play disciplined man to man defense don't accumulate a ton of counting stats
GOAT
The bubble was fraudulent
Great help/team defense and rim protection is literally what anchors elite defensive teams. It is unequivocally more important than man to man defense. And Sheed wasn't even a better one on one defender than Ben. He was good as a post defender, but he couldn't guard shyt on the perimeter or on the face up. Ben was significantly quicker and more mobile, on top of being stronger despite being smaller than Sheed. It's no coincidence the '04 Pistons were the most stifling defense ever and the '05 team wasn't far behind, but they were never quite at that level again after Ben leftIf you hoop, you'd understand the diff between help def & disciplined man def
when you play great man def, you don't get a ton of counting stats...Ben got most of his stls and blks from help def
It's the reason why Gobert can win DPOY but Joker & Biidy Biid drop 47 & 40 on his head...great help defender with sexy counting stats
Every great PF from that era compliments Sheed
and if we're being honest, Sheed was the diff in the 04 finals...he terrorized the Lakers on the def end
Ben Wallace was DPOY and they put Sheed on Timmy in the finals
Gobert has consistently anchored some of the best defenses in the league over the last handful of years. If anything, he proves the importance of help defense and rim protection.
GOAT
The bubble was fraudulent
Yeah, I know you are. Don't need to remind me. Which is precisely why you should sit back and take notes when people who actually know the game of basketball speak.
That player doesn't exist
Controversy
Superstar
We can agree to disagree...I'll always give more respect to a guy who can check his opponent straight up vs a guy who plays great help defense
Ben is so great of a defender but didn't check Tim in the 05 Finals...make it make sense
Controversy
Superstar
Or the alternative is for him to check them and contain them while making everything difficult
get these nets
Veteran
This is a straw man. You can't teach height. Duncan had a well rounded game ,could operate in different parts of the court, and didn't need to establish low post position to score.
Ben would have done a good job defending him, but Sheed's length and defensive ability would slow Tim down more than Ben would.
Controversy
Superstar
Ben was Shaq's primary defender in the Finals but not Duncan...make it make sense
Are there people out there who think otherwise?
