Classics Discussion: Too $hort

[Inspect Her Deck]

Personal connections? I dont know too short.
My problem is that albums like ob4cl,illmatic,,supreme clientele arent even remotely on a chronic,death certificate or doggystyle level but get pumped up like they are due to east coast bias from this board and other places like bias east coast mags and disc jockeys.
Meanwhile albums that might that are closer to that doggystyle level from other genre's wont get the same props.
Like too short or even spice 1's early work

your bias is clearly in reverse because now you're denying albums like Illmatic and OB4CL

Naw,you're just now finding out,because whatever media you refer to is bias and successfully kept you ignorant while bigging up nikkas whom arent anymore relevant then too short but beloved by whatever bias media is influencing you.

maybe...but I've somehow heard of the Pharcyde, Ras Kass, Above the Law etc.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

your bias is clearly in reverse because now you're denying albums like Illmatic and OB4CL



maybe...but I've somehow heard of the Pharcyde, Ras Kass, Above the Law etc.

Lol none of the west coast artists you just named are anymore relevant as short and never were.
Why can't i deny Illmatic and OB4CL? what makes them exempt from being denyed?

 

[StraightUpMenace]

Lol none of the west coast artists you just named are anymore relevant as short and never were.
Why can't i deny Illmatic and OB4CL? what makes them exempt from being denyed?

Because both albums made a large impact when they came out and influenced a large amount of rappers. There's no denying that.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

Because both albums made a large impact when they came out and influenced a large amount of rappers. There's no denying that.

So an album that took 7 years to go platinum and another album that is gold 20 yrs later (according to riaa) made a large impact? Lmao
So albums that did better than those must have made an even larger impact,right?

 

[Inspect Her Deck]

So an album that took 7 years to go platinum and another album that is gold 20 yrs later (according to riaa) made a large impact? Lmao
So albums that did better than those must have made an even larger impact,right?

the impact is more than just sales

Cuban Linx pretty much shaped the direction of an entire sub-genre of rap that dominated the mid-90's, certainly regionally and elements of it transcended the region

don't get me started on Illmatic lol.....everyone changed their pen game post-Illmatic, even rappers who were already established prior to its release

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

the impact is more than just sales

Cuban Linx pretty much shaped the direction of an entire sub-genre of rap that dominated the mid-90's, certainly regionally and elements of it transcended the region

don't get me started on Illmatic lol.....everyone changed their pen game post-Illmatic, even rappers who were already established prior to its release

How old were you back then?

 

[Inspect Her Deck]

How old were you back then?

Lol it's always this argument, but I have no shame anyway

I was barely 2 when Illmatic came out

I remember blasting the hell out of NY State of Mind when I was in my cot...gr8 times

Also on the subject of age, Illmatic and OB4CL have stood the test of time, nobody remembers Too Short's stuff other than nostalgic Bay residers. Other West Coast albums have held up better.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

the impact is more than just sales

Cuban Linx pretty much shaped the direction of an entire sub-genre of rap that dominated the mid-90's, certainly regionally and elements of it transcended the region

don't get me started on Illmatic lol.....everyone changed their pen game post-Illmatic, even rappers who were already established prior to its release

So raekwon influenced the game and this is reflected by what. He didnt run the game at all,so...
Illmatic was such a big influence that Nas changed his entire style afterwards and never returned to that illmatic style for a full album. Meaning he led nothing.
On illmatic he was rhyming aimlessly flossing his rhyming skills.
From it was written to current he has been more about social commentary and staying on subjects and also being very creative
.
There's nothing creative about illmatic. There's no deep songs on illmatic.
The nas we know now is the IT WAS WRITTEN nas.

 

[360dagod]

So an album that took 7 years to go platinum and another album that is gold 20 yrs later (according to riaa) made a large impact? Lmao
So albums that did better than those must have made an even larger impact,right?

It took 7 years for E-40's album in a major way to go platinum...But that shouldn't be a barometer on impact

 

[StraightUpMenace]

[

So raekwon influenced the game and this is reflected by what. He didnt run the game at all,so...
Illmatic was such a big influence that Nas changed his entire style afterwards and never returned to that illmatic style for a full album. Meaning he led nothing.
On illmatic he was rhyming aimlessly flossing his rhyming skills.
From it was written to current he has been more about social commentary and staying on subjects and also being very creative
.
There's nothing creative about illmatic. There's no deep songs on illmatic.
The nas we know now is the IT WAS WRITTEN nas.

It Was Written barely has any social commentary. Really, the only conscious songs on that album were "I Gave You Power" and "Black Girl Lost."

 

[Inspect Her Deck]

So raekwon influenced the game and this is reflected by what. He didnt run the game at all,so...
Illmatic was such a big influence that Nas changed his entire style afterwards and never returned to that illmatic style for a full album. Meaning he led nothing.
On illmatic he was rhyming aimlessly flossing his rhyming skills.
From it was written to current he has been more about social commentary and staying on subjects and also being very creative
.
There's nothing creative about illmatic. There's no deep songs on illmatic.
The nas we know now is the IT WAS WRITTEN nas.

Even if Illmatic were, as you say, an aimless "flossing" of rhyme skills, it was still impactful for the way lyricism was being evoked, the same way Paid in Full was impactful earlier without having much in the way of social commentary. Also Illmatic was more than just lyrical flexing come on now. It was a portrayal of NY streets and life from a 3rd world, and had some touching songs like One Love.

Funny you say IWW, which was a byproduct of Cuban Linx, not just subject matter, but the Nas Escobar shyt was taken straight from the Wu Gambinos.

As for the transition from Illmatic to IWW, well he was simply riding the wave, maybe to attain some commercial success or whatever. But his lyrical template was already established from Illmatic, they aren't drastically different albums, only by song writing measures and theme.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

Lol it's always this argument, but I have no shame anyway

I was barely 2 when Illmatic came out

I remember blasting the hell out of NY State of Mind when I was in my cot...gr8 times

Also on the subject of age, Illmatic and OB4CL have stood the test of time, nobody remembers Too Short's stuff other than nostalgic Bay residers. Other West Coast albums have held up better.

This is where you got it wrong,you werent around so you're just a product of what you were brainwashed to believe. I turned 15 the year illmatic came out. And no one gave a shyt about it as a whole. We had it and OB4cl (a year later) in my household. Neither ran the game or dominated anything. Media mags radio etc are dominated by east coast. So whatever they say has big influence.
As far as creating a narrative how they want it to be. Ask yourself (i'm not looking for an answer,just want you to think about it) why are east coast albums that didnt have huge sales the only albums that are heralded as undeniable classics to you. Meanwhile any west coast album deemed as undeniable would have to had sold millions in a short time to get similar props. Because they're strictly going off what the albums did to the east coast. And if an album came from the south or west and wasnt a huge project,it probably didnt saturate the east coast unless it had a sound that catered to the east coast. There's plenty of artists whom talked about having #1 records but got no play in the east. This creates a false narrative to east coast fans,due to east coast writers,disc jokcey's etc and their hating ways.

 

[StraightUpMenace]

And no one gave a shyt about it as a whole. .

Illmatic was critically acclaimed by almost everyone back when it came out so I'm not sure what you mean here.

 

[Inspect Her Deck]

This is where you got it wrong,you werent around so you're just a product of what you were brainwashed to believe. I turned 15 the year illmatic came out. And no one gave a shyt about it as a whole. We had it and OB4cl (a year later) in my household. Neither ran the game or dominated anything. Media mags radio etc are dominated by east coast. So whatever they say has big influence.
As far as creating a narrative how they want it to be. Ask yourself (i'm not looking for an answer,just want you to think about it) why are east coast albums that didnt have huge sales the only albums that are heralded as undeniable classics to you. Meanwhile any west coast album deemed as undeniable would have to had sold millions in a short time to get similar props. Because they're strictly going off what the albums did to the east coast. And if an album came from the south or west and wasnt a huge project,it probably didnt saturate the east coast unless it had a sound that catered to the east coast. There's plenty of artists whom talked about having #1 records but got no play in the east. This creates a false narrative to east coast fans,due to east coast writers,disc jokcey's etc and their hating ways.

you have a valid point about EC bias no doubt but I also feel the reason more classics came out of the region was because it was a bigger market generally, so more shyt was being released as well

but I don't know when you are focusing on consensus classics like OB4CL and Illmatic. You literally picked the two most acclaimed albums ever to make your argument?

at least talk about Muddy Waters or something..

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

Even if Illmatic were, as you say, an aimless "flossing" of rhyme skills, it was still impactful for the way lyricism was being evoked, the same way Paid in Full was impactful earlier without having much in the way of social commentary. Also Illmatic was more than just lyrical flexing come on now. It was a portrayal of NY streets and life from a 3rd world, and had some touching songs like One Love.

Funny you say IWW, which was a byproduct of Cuban Linx, not just subject matter, but the Nas Escobar shyt was taken straight from the Wu Gambinos.

As for the transition from Illmatic to IWW, well he was simply riding the wave, maybe to attain some commercial success or whatever. But his lyrical template was already established from Illmatic, they aren't drastically different albums, only by song writing measures and theme.

There was nothing new about Illmatic" lyriciscm" and illmatic sound more cartoony than a ill portryal of ny streets. His lil homies did a much better job on the infamous. I dont listen to illmatic and feel like i'm being walked through NY. I feel like someone's at their folks pad scribbling comic tales. I could care less about that mafioso escobar shyt. I'm specifiacally talking about nas becoming more creative and having a more focused direction in his writing. Which is fact.
On illmatic you could damn near trade the verses on most of the songs and it would still be the same song. I agree that illmatic and ob4cl meant something on the east but neither album ran the game as a whole and it was what biggie and puffy was on that brought the east back to the top and nikkas that followed their pattern are came through them became the east coast dons that took the crown back