Defense proving how overrated the QB position is

[Joe Sixpack]

If you have to have a great team surrounding your qb, why are qbs overpaid like crazy?

The best all around LB of perhaps last decade or maybe more in Von Miller had to hold out after a spectacular playoffs performance in which he had a key role, only to get LESS money then Jay cutler Alex smith or Matt Stafford are getting, qbs that are not even close to elite at their positions and never were elite at their position.

Qbs are overrated and now overpaid. You can get like two elite defensive players for a price of an average qb

It's not that simple.. There is a lot that goes into it.

This premise that the thread starter made is more nuanced then how he framed it and requires alot of typing but I will say this.

I think the problem is people in the league are so desperate to win at all costs they just hop on trends. Whoever wins the SB teams around the NFL will try to win it the way that team won it but it's not that simple you're right..

15 years ago when the Ravens won the SB everyone said you don't need a great QB to win a title. Ok but do you have the same personnel that the Ravens have? Do you have Sam Adams, Tony Siragusa and Ray fukkin Lewis arguably the greatest defensive player of all time?



Look at the Packers chip in 2010. They got hot in the playoffs an Aaron Rodgers went nuts. They had no running game at all that season. After that everyone said RBs ain't shyt and you don't need a running game to win titles



Football is a year to year thing. It's mad hard to sustain success year after year in a salary cap league where the rules are set up for offenses to put up points..

That's why Belichick is the greatest coach ever cause he wins year after year after year while every other team falls off..

There is no magic formula other then the basic tenets of the game that are timeless.

 

[yseJ]

This is all over the place. Does bad QB play correlate to losing?

LOL at that post being over the place when it's concise logical statement, to which you have no answer

Again there is not a single reason to overpay qbs if you have to have a great team around them. Great teams and defenses will win with average qbs and average qb performances anyway. Great qbs won't win with average defensive performqnces

Does bad qb play correlate to losing? No. Bad qb play can be passable on a very good team. Utter bum qb play will correlate to losing, just as, let's say utter bum play by ilbs not being to stop the run game in any sense

 

[Trip]

LOL at that post being over the place when it's concise logical statement, to which you have no answer

Again there is not a single reason to overpay qbs if you have to have a great team around them. Great teams and defenses will win with average qbs and average qb performances anyway. Great qbs won't win with average defensive performqnces

Does bad qb play correlate to losing? No. Bad qb play can be passable on a very good team. Utter bum qb play will correlate to losing, just as, let's say utter bum play by ilbs not being to stop the run game in any sense

So Seattle would have been better off lettting Wilson leave? Who has Seattle had to let walk because of Wilsons contract? Is Wilsons contract preventing Seattle from winning the Super bowl this year?

You're speaking in absolutes.

 

[yseJ]

And this says the Steelers should let go of Ben why?

I never said steelers need to get rid of big ben
I asked you why overpay for a position that doesn't correlate to having playoff success. You keep on rambling about stability but facts show that steelers have been consistently putting out great defenses for like two plus decades and their playoff successes correlated with their defensive prowess

Logically, it would make sense to pay for whatever correlates to success, but I know you aren't too good with logic

 

[Joe Sixpack]

I never said steelers need to get rid of big ben
I asked you why overpay for a position that doesn't correlate to having playoff success. You keep on rambling about stability but facts show that steelers have been consistently putting out great defenses for like two plus decades and their playoff successes correlated with their defensive prowess

Logically, it would make sense to pay for whatever correlates to success, but I know you aren't too good with logic

What did the Steelers accomplish with a top rated defense all those years with Kordell Stewart and Tommy Maddox at QB?

 

[Axum Ezana]

teams that win have defense for sure in the playoffs. I know that colts team and saints team had the best d rated during the playoffs.

defense just got to get hot in the playoffs.

 

[Trip]

I never said steelers need to get rid of big ben
I asked you why overpay for a position that doesn't correlate to having playoff success. You keep on rambling about stability but facts show that steelers have been consistently putting out great defenses for like two plus decades and their playoff successes correlated with their defensive prowess

Logically, it would make sense to pay for whatever correlates to success, but I know you aren't too good with logic

Because playoff games generally come down to a few plays. The Steelers were a fumble away from playing in the AFC champ game last year. The regular season matters- you can't have playoff success without getting there first. The one constant for Pittsburgh the past 15 years has been Ben

 

[yseJ]

It's not that simple.. There is a lot that goes into it.

This premise that the thread starter made is more nuanced then how he framed it and requires alot of typing but I will say this.

I think the problem is people in the league are so desperate to win at all costs they just hop on trends. Whoever wins the SB teams around the NFL will try to win it the way that team won it but it's not that simple you're right..

15 years ago when the Ravens won the SB everyone said you don't need a great QB to win a title. Ok but do you have the same personnel that the Ravens have? Do you have Sam Adams, Tony Siragusa and Ray fukkin Lewis arguably the greatest defensive player of all time?



Look at the Packers chip in 2010. They got hot in the playoffs an Aaron Rodgers went nuts. They had no running game at all that season. After that everyone said RBs ain't shyt and you don't need a running game to win titles



Football is a year to year thing. It's mad hard to sustain success year after year in a salary cap league where the rules are set up for offenses to put up points..

That's why Belichick is the greatest coach ever cause he wins year after year after year while every other team falls off..

There is no magic formula other then the basic tenets of the game that are timeless.

The Packers had #2 scoring defense in 2010. I'm sure it's just a coincidence that their only sb trip in Rodgers era (or since 2001 for that matter because they haven't had a top 5 scoring D since then) was the one with their defense being a top 2 D right?

Just a coincidence I'm sure

 

[Trip]

teams that win have defense for sure in the playoffs. I know that colts team and saints team had the best d rated during the playoffs.

defense just got to get hot in the playoffs.

If anyone deserved help from their defense that year it was Peyton

 

[Joe Sixpack]

The Packers had #2 scoring defense in 2010. I'm sure it's just a coincidence that their only sb trip in Rodgers era (or since 2001 for that matter because they haven't had a top 5 scoring D since then) was the one with their defense being a top 2 D right?

Just a coincidence I'm sure

Ok so do you think they would of won the SB that year with Matt Cassell at QB?

 

[yseJ]

Because playoff games generally come down to a few plays. The Steelers were a fumble away from playing in the AFC champ game last year. The regular season matters- you can't have playoff success without getting there first. The one constant for Pittsburgh the past 15 years has been Ben

LOL you keep moving the goalposts. Don't you know by now I have easy rebuttals?

First, lol at 15 years. Ben wasnt even in the league 15 years ago. Second, he might've been constant but steelers offense never correlated to playoff success. so, again, facts are against your point. How have the Steelers done since they stopped being a top d?

Second, how are the Saints doing last few years with Drew Brees? They're killing it in regular season in that shytty division right? Oh wait how is the league mvp qb doing now that the Panthers d is in the shytter?
Why are last three undefeated teams in the league fielding Shaun hill, Sam Bradford, Siemian and a rookie?

 

[Trip]

LOL you keep moving the goalposts. Don't you know by now I have easy rebuttals?

First, lol at 15 years. Ben wasnt even in the league 15 years ago. Second, he might've been constant but steelers offense never correlated to playoff success. so, again, facts are against your point. How have the Steelers done since they stopped being a top d?

Second, how are the Saints doing last few years with Drew Brees? They're killing it in regular season in that shytty division right? Oh wait how is the league mvp qb doing now that the Panthers d is in the shytter?
Why are last three undefeated teams in the league fielding Shaun hill, Sam Bradford, Siemian and a rookie?

Jesus Christ dude. 13 years. The Steelers basically make the playoffs every year. Yes their defenses have not been as strong but that's because they haven't drafted as well. Polamalu retired, Harrison is old. Who have they had to let go because of Ben's contract? The Steelers defense not being as good has nothing to do with Ben.

The saints defense is awful because they've drafted like shyt and made terrible signings. Byrd has sucked. Who have the Saints let leave that was worth keeping on defense?

 

[yseJ]

Ok so do you think they would of won the SB that year with Matt Cassell at QB?

Way to address my question
I'll answer your question to my question with a question too

Do Packers win if they have Mike Rumph instead of Charles Woodson? Because if you have watched that game you probably can remember what happened once Woodson had to leave

 

[Joe Sixpack]

Way to address my question
I'll answer your question to my question with a question too

Do Packers win if they have Mike Rumph instead of Charles Woodson? Because if you have watched that game you probably can remember what happened once Woodson had to leave

Bottom line is yeah you have to have a great defense to win but that isn't enough. Other then last year's Broncos and the 2000 Ravens no other team has won SBs that way

 

[yseJ]

Jesus Christ dude. 13 years. The Steelers basically make the playoffs every year. Yes their defenses have not been as strong but that's because they haven't drafted as well. Polamalu retired, Harrison is old. Who have they had to let go because of Ben's contract? The Steelers defense not being as good has nothing to do with Ben.

The saints defense is awful because they've drafted like shyt and made terrible signings. Byrd has sucked. Who have the Saints let leave that was worth keeping on defense?

You are again moving the goalposts. I asked you why overpay for qb position if it doesn't correlate to winning? Simple question. Once steelers defense stopped being good they stopped winning. Steelers built around defense were factually better teams with more success than those centered around the qb. Once saints d started being shyt it didn't matter having an elite qb in there, did it?

You've yet to answer this very simple question. Part of me hopes it's because you now understand that 'qb iz thee best position because look big arm just give him whatever he wants' is not an acceptable answer.