Democrats are splitting into three camps: Which one (if any) do you agree with?

[duncanthetall]

Damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

But honestly I don’t trust Biden and his administration to even do the shyt this country actually NEEDS to make abolishing the filibuster worth it. There will be no large scale changes done by Dems that’ll make potentially handing that power over to republicans in 2 years worth it. Just my opinion.

So I guess throw me in 2

 

[OfTheCross]

In respect to removing the filibuster, is there any concern over what happens when rethugs have control and Dems can’t push back against their agenda?

1. Defunding the epa
2. Defunding any and everything attached to abortion
3. Fossil fuel subsidies and permits
4. Undermining gov healthcare
5. Deregulation of financial markets
6. Privatizing usps
7. Further court expansion
8. Child prison camps along the border
9. Tougher voter is laws
10. Increased public school opt outs

Etc.

Based on what we’ve seen I think opening the flood gates benefits the zero fukks given party (rethugs) more than the timid left... and what good some liberals think will come of removing the Filb will be an extremely bad trade.

1. EPA's Budget and Spending | US EPA Not worried about EPA funding, funding seems stable.
2. Public Funding for Abortion abortions are already not Federally funded, only the Courts can make it illegal
3. Fact Sheet | Fossil Fuel Subsidies: A Closer Look at Tax Breaks and Societal Costs | White Papers | EESI fossil fuel subsidies already happen, nothing would change
4. running / governing on taking away people's healthcare isn't politically expedient. not worried.
5. anything de-regulated can be re-regulated. not worried.
6. USPS is enshrined in The Constitution. not worried.
7. both parties can expand the courts. not worried. (Ideally, I'd like to see the Sup. Court expanded and balanced by the DEMs and locked from further meddling, though)
8. Americans don't care about immigrants. not worried.
9. The Constitution limits how "tough" voter laws can be.
10. School choice legislation can be passed by either party. not worried.

Based on what the US Congress can actually do, and the fact that the States can sue over any laws that they deemed unconstitutional, there's nothing to worry about with getting rid of the filibuster.

 

[Gus Money]

I mean, this is the same Republican Party that couldn’t get 50 votes to appeal the ACA, and that was their big boogeyman for years. I think the rewards far outweigh the risks of republicans getting enough sociopaths and morons on the same page when it comes to anything besides tax breaks for the wealthy.

 

[BaggerofTea]

Democrats are controlled opposition

 

[OfTheCross]

If Dems got rid of the filibuster and actually passed popular bills that the people want, it will be very hard for the Republicans to ever hold all 3 branches again. Dems gotta stop making these p*ssy arguments against doing anything bold.

There needs to be an end to gerrymandering and Ranked Choice Voting in America. With gerrymandering, the GOP is poised to win out

 

[mastermind]

Democrats are controlled opposition

The establishment of the party aren't in opposition.

 

[New Jeruzalem Journalist]

Worrying about what republicans are gonna do if they regain control is a waste of time and it’s why the Dems are chasing themselves in circles so often now. We already know conservatives are gonna play dirty if they regain control because it’s what they’ve always done. Believing that they’ll somehow play fair if Dems go easy requires ignoring history. These people forced through a Supreme Court justice before RGB’s body was cold only a few months ago.

If you maintain a clear message and actually help people by passing impactful, popular legislation then you don’t need to worry so much about losing because people will continue to vote for you. See Georgia. And if you do lose then actually play the role of an opposition party and force republicans to walk back all the laws that are benefiting their own constituents.

I'm still torn on all the filibuster removal talk and it has to do with the bolded. I never saw reluctance to it as a fear of what Republicans might do without it, but rather an important defense strategy against what we KNOW they're going to do. Now I might be giving Dem leadership too much credit on having that type of foresight but I personally don't trust relying on voters to the extent that you do.

If they fail to provide substantial assistance to their constituents by not doing all of those very things you suggested, who was responsible for putting them into office in the first place?

 

[BaggerofTea]

The establishment of the party aren't in opposition.

True, but they feign it for votes.

 

[Hood Critic]

Worrying about what republicans are gonna do if they regain control is a waste of time and it’s why the Dems are chasing themselves in circles so often now.

Wield your power and let the other side make themselves politically unviable for even mentioning the idea of taking away what's universally desired.

 

[Hood Critic]

The filibuster argument is a simple one, you get rid of it so you can pass everything you want or you decide to keep it where you will pass next to nothing or watered down versions of bills.

 

[Loose]

I'm going to say we'd regret getting rid of the filibuster

 

[Hood Critic]

I'm going to say we'd regret getting rid of the filibuster

Irrational fear.

Kill the filibuster and pass H.R.1. The GOP's power is in the rampant voter suppression and gerrymandering that they lean on. The 2020 election should have taught/convinced everyone that if Democrats have total access to the ballot box like what was envisioned through things like the Voting Rights Act, they are more likely to hold one of the chambers of congress and the WH far more than their counterparts.

Georgia in 2020 is all the reason anyone should need to get rid of the filibuster.

 

[mr. smoke weed]

theres a high likelihood that the republicans take all 3 back in 2024

Oh? Based on what>?

 

[Pressure]

The filibuster argument is a simple one, you get rid of it so you can pass everything you want or you decide to keep it where you will pass next to nothing or watered down versions of bills.

The problem here seems to be you have similar opposition to removing the filibuster as you do with passing the bills with a simple majority.

 

[the cac mamba]

Oh? Based on what>?

-the democrats are being pussies on reopening the economy, and the resentment will be massive. ask gavin newsom

-kamala is a weak candidate

-82 year old biden is a weak candidate

-republicans are cheating and suppressing votes all over the country

-momentum tends to swing back and forth. this country is easily gonna be ready to elect the right repub in 4 years, and trump will be back in the picture but not the actual nominee

even if its a 50/50 chance. can you imagine if the republicans take control with no filibuster