Does Learning To Code Outweigh a Degree In Computer Science?

[rapbeats]

Its not disjoint sets. I learn theory in my classes and work on coding on my own. If your school's curriculum sucks thats on you. If you cant understand how discrete math relates to programming thats on you.

I have a software engineer friend from Wesleyan who is considering changing careers because the programming that does not require knowledge of mathematical principles will not be a sellable skill when everyone learns programming. Its the more intensive math and theory stuff that makes you the big bucks.

The only reason articles like this exist is because of the power of modern high level languages. It's not like we went from PL/I to Scala overnight.

Im sick of the anti cs education propaganda it reeks of 'upper class white my parents will pay my living expenses no matter what' priveledge.
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i here what ya saying but this is the mentality that keeps these schools not teaching you anything of value while you still paying them like they are.

its not on you to bridge the gap between the math you take and programming. thats their job at your school. they are TEACHERS/PROFESSORS for a reason. TEACH/PROFESS

 

[keepemup]

In order to have a meaningful conversation we need to define what a computer science degree will provide someone as opposed to simply, and forgive my usage of the word simply, programming.

 

[Air Game Rule]

I graduated last yr with a CS degree and no question it's what you need to get your foot in the door in lieu of 'real world experience'. But I do wish the curriculum had more enterprise/big company level tools, concepts and technologies. I mean we did plenty of projects (alone and group) and all that, but making the transition to working for a company where hundreds of other ppl are writing code as well, and you're contributing to the code too, has been a bit of an adjustment.

That being said, it's definitely on you to bridge knowledge gaps and self-teach if you want to excel, esp. if you got a late start in the programming game like me

 

[keepemup]

I graduated last yr with a CS degree and no question it's what you need to get your foot in the door in lieu of 'real world experience'. But I do wish the curriculum had more enterprise/big company level tools, concepts and technologies. I mean we did plenty of projects (alone and group) and all that, but making the transition to working for a company where hundreds of other ppl are writing code as well, and you're contributing to the code too, has been a bit of an adjustment.

That being said, it's definitely on you to bridge knowledge gaps and self-teach if you want to excel, esp. if you got a late start in the programming game like me

You'll get used to it. That was something that was totally new to me but there are good change management/workflow tools out that that make it simple. With the advent of github, this will be addressed by educators in a few years (I hope).

And this is normal for everybody. This type of thing, change management, was new largely new to the industry some 15 years ago.

Are you disappointed that you are not working on more academic problems, such as figuring out the optimizing algorithms, graphs, hash tables etc?

My job as an embedded systems engineer, allows us to great creative with the algorithms we implement as far as using sensor input with consideration to their mathematical and physical meaning, so that is definitely gratifying.

However I would like to have more experience with optimizing data structures and working on the quickest way to query information - that sort of thing.

 

[Air Game Rule]

You'll get used to it. That was something that was totally new to me but there are good change management/workflow tools out that that make it simple. With the advent of github, this will be addressed by educators in a few years (I hope).

And this is normal for everybody. This type of thing, change management, was new largely new to the industry some 15 years ago.

Are you disappointed that you are not working on more academic problems, such as figuring out the optimizing algorithms, graphs, hash tables etc?

My job as an embedded systems engineer, allows us to great creative with the algorithms we implement as far as using sensor input with consideration to their mathematical and physical meaning, so that is definitely gratifying.

However I would like to have more experience with optimizing data structures and working on the quickest way to query information - that sort of thing.

Ya I've gotten somewhat of a hold on it now. For ex. we use a fairly simple revision ctrl application.

Well I'm fine with what I contribute to: I work for a telecom company, and my team works on the applications reps use in our stores, for customer service, etc..It's been great to learn and see the behind the scenes of all that. A little more academics in it would be cool, but I'm fine without it, wasn't the best student tbh

More like I wish I worked more with and/or learned about Java EE, Spring, etc. during college. I suppose it would have to have been more the concepts of those things since EE doesn't really apply to students in college (we used SE), but still...would've been helpful

That's what's up for you though, Devices was one of the 8 "threads" we had to choose two from to make our CS degree at Ga Tech, and it involves embedded systems: http://www.cc.gatech.edu/future/undergraduates/bscs/threads

 

[semtex]

I graduated last yr with a CS degree and no question it's what you need to get your foot in the door in lieu of 'real world experience'. But I do wish the curriculum had more enterprise/big company level tools, concepts and technologies. I mean we did plenty of projects (alone and group) and all that, but making the transition to working for a company where hundreds of other ppl are writing code as well, and you're contributing to the code too, has been a bit of an adjustment.

That being said, it's definitely on you to bridge knowledge gaps and self-teach if you want to excel, esp. if you got a late start in the programming game like me

I'm right there with you breh

 

[Notorious Jerry]

I use to work, with a programming major student, it amazed me how little he knew of current Technology,he use to come to me for computer help and with his build but coding is what is keeping me from a career in the field I was show a line of coding and it blew my mind.

 

[Bomberman]

What are some of these bootcamp resources?

 

[Liquid]

I think the best combo is a degree in the arts and then teach yourself how to code. My comm + improving skills are kicking people's ass in these meetups I go to.

Some of these nerds have no clue what matters to people

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

i here what ya saying but this is the mentality that keeps these schools not teaching you anything of value while you still paying them like they are.

its not on you to bridge the gap between the math you take and programming. thats their job at your school. they are TEACHERS/PROFESSORS for a reason. TEACH/PROFESS

this is a cop out.

its like saying "oh why teach bio chem if you don't use it on a daily basis as a doctor"

 

[OCCAMS_RAZOR]

It's good to know your data structures & your Big-Ohs. However, for most folks that knowledge is superflous once you actually get into industry. I'm planning on going to go to grad school & possibly doing breakthrough research so my perspective is different. But remember that if you want to fly with the eagles, you have to know your algorithms & your data structures. To ace Google's interviews you have to know Cormen's classic Introduction to Algorithms textbook from front to back.

& to be honest, it's never a bad thing to know more. even though a lot of the information we'll be unnecessary to you in your future career, it's good to have an overview or a little bit of background knowledge. you might forget a lot of it but it will be much easier to pick back up on the off chance that you'll need it again.

to answer the thread: a degree doesn't mean shyt, especially in computer science. the people who really go far are the people who have a genuine love for coding, algorithms, math, etc and would be doing this whether or not they were getting paid for it. if your entire reason for doing cs or engineering is to get big booty hoes and a big house then do yourself a favor and do business or economics. merely being a code monkey will not get you far. also, a degree in and of itself is more worthless than toilet paper if you don't have an extensive portfolio to back it up. i'm studying computer science at a top school, and i feel bad that i'll graduate with the same degree as some of my peers. i honestly feel bad for whoever's going to hire those guys. they are shiftless, passionless and borderline incompetent (& that's not to say that i'm a superstar programmer either).

 

[OCCAMS_RAZOR]

How many times have I posted here that the best programmers in my company are those without degrees?


it takes one hell of a dedication to self teach programming. If a programmer is self taught believe me...he knows it

a degree does not preclude indepth knowledge of a programming language. if those same programmers had gone to school they'd have benefited from it. if you can afford it and/or you're a serious, ambitious person then going to school isn't a bad idea.

also, at the end of the day, if you really want to be good, you're going to have to teach yourself. as much as a bachelor's teaches you a lot, it still only barely scratches the surface. so many different areas in computer science too, databases, web dev, artificial intelligence, machine learning.

so yeah, if you can get a degree (at a good school) then do it. you'll get exposed to a wide variety of subjects, some may spark your interest, some not, and you'll pick up a lot of skills that will help you in your future endeavours. also, we need, NEED more black folks in STEM doing research. one of you cats could be the next donald knuth and you don't even know it.

 

[OCCAMS_RAZOR]

programming is actually about being able to DO something. You can't hide behind a degree with programming. Either you know how to build something or you don't. If you don't, you'll get exposed quickly.

realest post in the thread. if you're a programmer & you're unemployed then you have to take a serious look at yourself because the way i see it there's no way you can be exceptional and not get noticed / paid good money for it. imho, the folks who complain about outsourcing & such and such are the ppl who don't even have any business being in the field in the first place.

 

[OCCAMS_RAZOR]

As long as you stay away from game/graphics programming in your career

this thread reeks of underachievers. i couldn't possibly fathom how you'd want to shoot yourself in the foot like this. like someone already said, if you don't see the value in learning about disjoint sets, binomial heaps and linear algebra then get the fukk out of this thread and take your fail with you because all you're doing is turning ppl away; ppl who could potentially be interested in the subjects. what we should be trying to do is cultivating interest in these topics not actively looking for ways to discredit them.

 

[TRUEST]

This is a thread that i just cant ignore.

first of all, to those of u who keep saying a degree is worth it, u need to find a place to sit down and digest what im about to say.

yes, a degree is always good to have. matter of fact, i will encourage people to strive to get a degree in anything but gymnastics. but the one thing u must never do is take out a loan to go to an expensive school. that has the very strong potential of being one of the worst mistakess u ever make in ur life. go to a county college, or the cheapest college (online schools dont count) you can find, and get ur degree there.

now, as far as management positions are concerned, listen, real programmers have ZERO interests in being managers. we've all had managers and not one programmer would want to do what they do. all we wanna do is sit in front of a computer and come up with innovative ways to accomplish whatever task we have to perform. managers go to meetings all day and they sit there discussing bullsh1t and talking on the phone, going over crap. sh1t like that will incense the genuine programmers.

so most of u who are in this thread arguing against programmers and degrees really dont have a fuccking clue what you're saying.