How did Kendrick Lamar become considered 'lyrical'?

[mr. smoke weed]

Honestly, I didn't ready any of it. The way the thread title was written.....bothers me. Did you finish high school?

Yea I did just fine in school, good lookin though.

 

[No1]

I think you are confused thinking that an effective communicator and a lyricist are some how some mutually exclusive things.

To be an effective communicator you need to be able to put your words together well and in a way many people can understand directly.

To be someone who gets their point across while rhyming you need to be able to put your words together well and in a way many people can understand directly.

Can you tell me why this is lyrical....



but this isn't...



????

I'm not confused. You literally spent an entire paragraph breaking down messaging and how Pac was more effective and then came back to talking about so what if so and so can do this and that if it is not effective.

My point is simple, that "so and so" shyt is considered "bars" and Dear Mama is not considered bars despite being a classic. I never said someone could not do both. Andre, Lupe, Jay, etc. do both. You just used an awful example of it in Pac (who is one of my 3 favorite rappers). I go on and on all the time about "who cares if you can rap if I don't want to listen to you rap" when people bring up dudes like Elzhi and shyt like that.

Let me rephrase it--there is a definition of lyricism which involves metaphors, punchlines, etc. Having "bars" and having a point do not need to go hand in hand. By adding in the "messaging" part you are getting into being a communicator. That is why guys like Wale call people like Slaughterhouse lyricists even if most of them cannot carry an album. You are running with your own definition of lyricism, and you're trying to expand what it means--that is fine. But I'm telling you what it means in the context of how it is commonly used. I can think that being able to "sing" means more than being able to hold a note and that you have to be able to evoke certain emotions or have "soul," but that does not mean that my definition is the one that has been adopted. In summation, you're arguing about what is SHOULD BE and I'm telling what IT IS. I never argued about what it should be at any point, and I never do.

 

[Kyle C. Barker]

Because his lyrics are so good you can see a vision in your mind. He doesn't need a song full of ironic one liners. He can talk to you through rhyme and you can see what he's saying rather clearly. It's poetic.

But what about punchlines. Yall probably think Lloyd Banks better then kendrick.

There isn't one way to rap or be considered lyrical.

This.

He's definitely lyrical.

And I'm not even a fan of the guy like that (mainly because I don't care for his delivery).

 

[Jack Don the G]

Wow, what a surprise.

You did exactly what I thought you would. Focus on me calling you a well know troll and deflect the question.

I called you a well know troll since you have the WOAT banner, thats a fact and not a personal attack. You make attention seeking threads and post sarcastic answers to anyone that make a real argument.

That Kendrick thread you made just proved my point. A thread where you don't argue your point just make other people write stuff which you later dismiss with sarcastic answers and smiles.

I gave you a song since you made such an outlandish remark that Kendricks writing is low level, middle school poetry (before your edit you wrote trash).

Since its YOUR statement its up to YOU to defend it.

My statement is that Sing about me is top tier song writing.

I already wrote why in my other post:

"He weave the lines so good with the beat and flow. Its effortless. Like damn. How can you not call that lyrical. The lyrics punch through the song.

People is so attached to the idea that to be considered lyrical you have to have lines that takes you out off the song and go "damn let me rewind that line".
But true genius writing makes you so engaged with the song that you are hypnotized and forget you just listened to a 12 minute song without become being bored."

I wont take single lines out of context for you since it goes against my own argument. If they are out of context they don't have any power. Its the way they are weaved together to make an effortless stream of introspective narrative of three different people while still painting a vivid picture of exterior surroundings which makes it great poetry. But you have to listen to it to really get whats genius about it. And sure you can say that is "wiggly" but thats how music and rap lyrics work.
Lyrics is not whats good on paper, its making words work together in a flow.

If you cant make an argument why it is low level, middle school poetry with out having single lines to judge then you are not fit to question a rappers level of lyricism.

If you cant argue why a song is lyrical without singled out lines. Then at lest explain why you have to be specific to the point of singled out lines with out calling it "wiggly".

How much to you need to break stuff down anyway? Maybe lines are even too wide of a concept. Maybe people should start compering words and single them out. If you judge a painting, you dont single out single brush strokes.

But sure if you really want to keep the discussion to single lines/bars then point out whats low level, middle school poetry about this part?

This is the life of another girl damaged by the system
These foster homes, I run away and never do miss 'em
See, my hormones just run away and if I can get 'em back
To where they used to be then I'll probably be in the denim
Of a family gene that show women how to be women
Or better yet, a leader, you need her to learn somethin'
Then you probably need to beat her, that's how I was taught
Three nikkas in one room, first time I was tossed
And I'm exhausted, but fukk that "Sorry for your loss" shyt
My sister died in vain, but what point are you trying to gain
If you can't fit the pumps I walk in?

I take your silence as a sign of agreement that your statement that Kendricks writing is trash or low level middle school poetry as an over the top troll statement or as you would put it, trash.

@SirBiatch

 

[Piff Perkins]

@mr. smoke weed what I think hasn't been mentioned... to me, Kendrick before he changed his name was a punchline rapper or a more "traditional" lyrical rapper. He became a better artist once he started figuring out his "own" style, which was around the same time he changed his name.

Yup. Similar to how Jay got more introspective once his flow slowed down a bit.

I know some rappers that use big words to make their similes curve
My simplest shyt be more pivitol

 

[10bandz]

I take your silence as a sign of agreement that your statement that Kendricks writing is trash or low level middle school poetry as an over the top troll statement or as you would put it, trash.

@SirBiatch

ether

He'll probably come up with some deflecting bullshyt as a response now that you pressed him about it. He might just snitch on you to the mods as well

 

[OnlyInCalifornia]

I'm not confused. You literally spent an entire paragraph breaking down messaging and how Pac was more effective and then came back to talking about so what if so and so can do this and that if it is not effective.

Again, being a good communicator and being a good lyricist are not two exclusive things. You cannot be lyrical and not be a good communicator.

My point is simple, that "so and so" shyt is considered "bars" and Dear Mama is not considered bars despite being a classic. I never said someone could not do both. Andre, Lupe, Jay, etc. do both. You just used an awful example of it in Pac (who is one of my 3 favorite rappers). I go on and on all the time about "who cares if you can rap if I don't want to listen to you rap" when people bring up dudes like Elzhi and shyt like that.

Your point is that the NYC mixtape punch line rapper is what is 'lyrical' and others are not. You are saying it below...

Rakim was lyrical with out punch lines and metaphors about coke or guns so I think you are not connecting the dots here....Guru used very few punch lines and his songs were often simple but they sent strong messages or had a lesson in them. That is lyrical just the same.

NYC punch line rappers CAN be lyrical but they are not the only definition of it. It's actually really boring repetitive hip hop for the most part and nothing lyrical about hearing guys spit coke/gun metaphors a thousand types.

Let me rephrase it--there is a definition of lyricism which involves metaphors, punchlines, etc. Having "bars" and having a point do not need to go hand in hand. By adding in the "messaging" part you are getting into being a communicator.

The metaphors, punchlines and big words mean nothing if their is no message or reason behind them. That is why people really don't care about battle rappers like Canibus and Papoose. "I am a weight watcher cuz I got weight to watch' really is not saying anything at all. It's trying to hard and adding extra words to add them.

A true lyricist gets their message across in a unique way to a beat. That's what seperates a 'lyricist' from a 'rapper' It isn't big words. It isn't bad punch lines. It's the ability to send a message through someone's ears and into their core. You cannot do that with out being a good communicator and a person who knows how to get your point across well.

 

[10bandz]

Kendrick became known as a lyricist because he is a lyricist.

 

[10bandz]

yo @SirBiatch why you always crying like a bytch in every Kendrick thread like a little ho

nikka you look like this and you're from Canada hating on black americas favorite rapper

 

[The God Poster]

Because his lyrics are so good you can see a vision in your mind. He doesn't need a song full of ironic one liners. He can talk to you through rhyme and you can see what he's saying rather clearly. It's poetic.

But what about punchlines. Yall probably think Lloyd Banks better then kendrick.

There isn't one way to rap or be considered lyrical.

negged. No need to tear down one dope rapper to hype another

 

[Mowgli]

negged. No need to tear down one dope rapper to hype another

I didn't need to I just felt like it because one has no purpose. And I'll do it again

 

[Mowgli]

yo @SirBiatch why you always crying like a bytch in every Kendrick thread like a little ho

nikka you look like this and you're from Canada hating on black americas favorite rapper

 

[10bandz]

ETHER!!!

repped @Mowgli

 

[The Ruler 09]

"Tangling with the devil over history"

 

[Mowgli]

ETHER!!!

repped @Mowgli

Kendrick trash. I listened to his entire catalogue 5 times today and I still don't know what yall see in him