How do you propose discussing immigration without sounding like a racist/nazi/xenophobe?

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

I feel like you are grossly misinterpreting what I'm saying.

Folks are crossing the border because employment opportunities are slim to none back home and better here. But for people here employment opportunities are becoming scarce as well. So for those countries as well as ours the best course of action is to increase employment within one's borders. If people are trying to border jump you are too late. It's like trying to stop crime with tougher policing. Curing symptoms won't fix underlying causes.

Laws won't increase investments in countries that have no money to invest. If the countries had money they could employ their people, and those people wouldn't be border jumping. Only countries in NA with money to invest are the US, Canada and Mexico- all of which have their own employment issues that take priority. US money building factories in Mexico is jobs leaving the US. That's a net zero solution. I wasn't talking about people here sending money back, though it is documented that many poor countries' economies depend heavily on foreign inflows between relatives.

Bottom line, you want less illegal immigration into the US, you have to give the folks trying to get in a reason not to leave their countries in the form of political stability, low crime and gainful employment. Those things can't be created by writing a law. If it were that simple it would have been done already.

but again, we gotta start shaming some of these countries to get their shyt in order...or maybe its by design

I mean then again, would the US be happy if another country was doing better than them? Next door?

 

[MajorVitaman]

Honest question...do you really think if the USA gave California, Texas and Arizona back to Mexico that Mexicans still wouldn't come into the country illegally? They'd just be running through Utah and Colorado instead.

That depends on the drug war.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

That depends on the drug war.

The drug war ain't the only thing keeping people coming across that border.

Fact is, the border is physically too porous. The fact we can't agree on that is a problem

You shouldn't be able to literally hike across. At no point.

 

[GunRanger]

mexicans are unlike other immigrants. they have invaded every workforce, and school. spanish shyt is everywhere

 

[MalikReloaded]

at all these black liberals defending illegal immigration. Let 12 million undocumented blacks sneak into Mexico.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

at all these black liberals defending illegal immigration. Let 12 million undocumented blacks sneak into Mexico.

I'm saying!!!

I don't support my people only being eligible for low wage shyt ...but damn, those positions are better filled by people who at least LIVE here and can fill those positions in.

 

[Red Shield]

at all these black liberals defending illegal immigration. Let 12 million undocumented blacks sneak into Mexico.

Shiiiiiit they would be gunning them and mining them at the border

 

[tmonster]

avoid saying shyt like, "dey teuk ou jebs" after saying shyt like, "USA is th leader of free world"

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

but again, we gotta start shaming some of these countries to get their shyt in order...or maybe its by design

I mean then again, would the US be happy if another country was doing better than them? Next door?

What will shame do? These countries already face the shame of being associated with poverty and disorder. All us piling on will do is build unnecessary animosity.

I recently went to Peru and was on a train with my wife and some Mexican teachers. When the conversation shifted to narco crime one of the girls was visibly embarrassed. Everything comes down to money and commerce. If we can enable central America economically and profit from it everyone will win. Those folks will stay in their borders and we will get more $$$. Thats the only way I see actually making any headway with the immigration. When humans get desperate u see what they do. Syrians are fleeing on death rafts....... u think tough talk and a fence will do anything?

 

[88m3]

You're asking a bunch of racist, bigots, and xenophobic people as to how not to show said traits, op?

 

[Brown_Pride]

I think you're being too nice here.

it IS destroying the community in some places.

The people who are already here, who are already poor can't even have the opportunity to fill these niches BECAUSE of illegal immigrants.

I don't know if some of ya'll live in border states, but the effects are definitely real in lower and middle classes among small business owners.

I live in AZ.

Here's the thing. It's illegal now, meaning, you can't make it MORE illegal. The problem of immigration is inherent to having the most prosperous nation in the world right next to a shytty country in the world. You're going to have ILLEGAL immigration no matter what you do. There are jobs to be had out there and they're NOT, let me repeat NOT all filled by illegals.

The issues regarding poor performance of poor people, e.g. perpetual welfare recipients, should not be blamed on immigration, that's a scapegoat. I grew up in the ghetto, have family still in these situations and guess what? They're not losing their jobs to illegals. When they get jobs, and they do, they fuk up and lose them. There's a whole set of underlining issues cause woes for the communities you are so concerned about and blaming those woes on immigration does nothing to address those issues.

IF right now, like TODAY you were able to magically get rid of 11.5 million illegals do you think everyone on welfare would have a job by the end of the week? Month? and do you think that once employed they'd have that job in 6 months? A year?

 

[TLR Is Mental Poison]

nikkas need jobs B

$$$$ cant fix everything....... but having enough damn sure dont hurt

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

I live in AZ.

Here's the thing. It's illegal now, meaning, you can't make it MORE illegal. The problem of immigration is inherent to having the most prosperous nation in the world right next to a shytty country in the world. You're going to have ILLEGAL immigration no matter what you do. There are jobs to be had out there and they're NOT, let me repeat NOT all filled by illegals.

The issues regarding poor performance of poor people, e.g. perpetual welfare recipients, should not be blamed on immigration, that's a scapegoat. I grew up in the ghetto, have family still in these situations and guess what? They're not losing their jobs to illegals. When they get jobs, and they do, they fuk up and lose them. There's a whole set of underlining issues cause woes for the communities you are so concerned about and blaming those woes on immigration does nothing to address those issues.

IF right now, like TODAY you were able to magically get rid of 11.5 million illegals do you think everyone on welfare would have a job by the end of the week? Month? and do you think that once employed they'd have that job in 6 months? A year?

No.

...But I do believe in that irrational part of everyone's brain that convinces you of anecdotal bullshyt being somehow objectively valid...that more of those people on welfare might compete for better jobs or even gain employment.

Most of the work done by illegals is unskilled labor...but I do believe that need might be filled.

 

[Brown_Pride]

Yeah pretty much, the "tariffs" should stay until an agreement is worked out between both countries and employment rules are regularized across both countries

That is the proper way to do it

People try to take the moral high ground by being all sympathetic toward illegal aliens when the actual moral high ground is discussing the laws in the countries the illegal aliens are coming from

There should be free movement of labor.....across an even playing field

You can't really expect this to happen can you? Even the playing field between Mexico and the US? Do you understand how vastly different the two countries are? Me and you have danced this dance before and I stick to my original argument AND my original suggestions.

Quick summary in case you forgot
1. Make coming to the USA LEGAL but, make it cost people 2k a year to live here (they already pay that to coyotes)
2. They MUST be identified via licenses, and ID.
3. Children born here by people under this new immigration program do not get american citizen status until they have been here for 5 years.
4. Must pay income taxes, are not eligible for a tax refund.
5. Must have a job, 2 month window to find a new job if you lose your old job.
6. No violent criminals
7. Penalties on businesses hiring illegals should be astronomical. AND build in a whistle blowing program where people can BECOME citizens or have time reduced on path to citizenship if they turn in businesses. (new idea, still in its infancy in terms of reward)
9. Federal assistance capped at 2 months, and only eligible if you've been here 6 months. In other words you can get emergency assistance
10. Create a path to citizenship. Maybe 5 years and you become quasi, like you no longer have to pay the 2k a year. 10 Years and you can test to become a citizen.

The point being capitalize on a problem with no real tenable solution. Make your weakness a strength and such.

 

[Brown_Pride]

No.

...But I do believe in that irrational part of everyone's brain that convinces you of anecdotal bullshyt being somehow objectively valid...that more of those people on welfare might compete for better jobs or even gain employment.

Most of the work done by illegals is unskilled labor...but I do believe that need might be filled.

The core problems still aren't addressed and you'd still have shyt going on to those communities. Why? Because the problem isn't immigration.

The need for unskilled labor would be filled and businesses would have their needs met, the "community", as it were, is still going to have the EXACT SAME problems. My point here isn't to discount the idea that immigrants don't fill jobs. It's to highlight the idea, yet again, that immigration is not the real problem.