"I Didn't Speak to Jay for 2 weeks after Ether" - Dame Dash

[MartyMcFly]

Bottom line: Regardless of what you thought or think about Ether as a track from the beat to the rhymes, the fact that dudes in that man's camp admitted he took an L and the man himself admitted he took an L on multiple occasions, including on record and on radio where he was damn near in tears, means he lost. It doesn't matter what your personal opinion is, once the man comes out on radio and admits he took an L, then he took an L, plain and simple. Doesn't mean you can't keep living vicariously through him, but in every battle there is a winner and a loser and for this particular battle, dude lost. shyt happens

 

[AntLive1981]

Bottom line: Regardless of what you thought or think about Ether as a track from the beat to the rhymes, the fact that dudes in that man's camp admitted he took an L and the man himself admitted he took an L on multiple occasions, including on record and on radio where he was damn near in tears, means he lost. It doesn't matter what your personal opinion is, once the man comes out on radio and admits he took an L, then he took an L, plain and simple. Doesn't mean you can't keep living vicariously through him, but in every battle there is a winner and a loser and for this particular battle, dude lost. shyt happens

And that's itIt's just that simple.

 

[HNIC973]

Bottom line: Regardless of what you thought or think about Ether as a track from the beat to the rhymes, the fact that dudes in that man's camp admitted he took an L and the man himself admitted he took an L on multiple occasions, including on record and on radio where he was damn near in tears, means he lost. It doesn't matter what your personal opinion is, once the man comes out on radio and admits he took an L, then he took an L, plain and simple. Doesn't mean you can't keep living vicariously through him, but in every battle there is a winner and a loser and for this particular battle, dude lost. shyt happens

summed up perfectly

 

[MartyMcFly]

And that's itIt's just that simple.

And on top of that, he admitted how Ether was "vulgar" and how it affected him as a man and how he felt disrespected. Come on man, what part of the game is that? How can anyone say that he won that battle? Jay pulled a Roberto Duran..no mas. Doesn't mean I'm a Nas stan. Jay and Nas are two of my favs to ever do this shyt and I can point out issues with both of their discographies but let's call the shyt what it is.

 

[Dominic Brehetto]

People don't wanna ask Nas questions about real shyt like getting fukked for his publishing, Jay leaving condoms in his baby momas cars and shyt like that.
They are friends now, there's no reason for that. People (Jays friends like Cypha) still ask him about the beef, cause there's nothing personal really. Camel and shyt like that are old jokes that Jay has recognized. Nas has been asked about the beef as well but he deads the discussion quite quick. The difference is the "classic battle elements" in Ether with nearly all jokes and unreasonable opinions like Beans being better while Takeover was like 3 facts and nothing else.

And Jay thought Ether was dope, he was shocked to hear Nas that mad/energetic I'm assuming.. How that is relevant to anything does not make sense, he'd be lying to himself and the public if he didn't admit that it was a good job.

So beans being better than jay is an unreasonable opinion, but nas having one hot album in ten years is a fact?

Even though some people like beans better and some people think it was written is a classic?


You jay stans are hilarious.

 

[hex]

Bottom line: Regardless of what you thought or think about Ether as a track from the beat to the rhymes, the fact that dudes in that man's camp admitted he took an L and the man himself admitted he took an L on multiple occasions, including on record and on radio where he was damn near in tears, means he lost. It doesn't matter what your personal opinion is, once the man comes out on radio and admits he took an L, then he took an L, plain and simple. Doesn't mean you can't keep living vicariously through him, but in every battle there is a winner and a loser and for this particular battle, dude lost. shyt happens

This is what I've been trying to explain to people for years. I personally prefer "Takeover" to "Ether" but it doesn't matter what I prefer, because Jay obviously feels like he lost. His whole camp does. So they lost. It's not rocket science.

What's makes this whole thing sad is Jay stans are still denying a loss that Jay conceded to 13 years ago.

Fred.

 

[The Dust King]

This is what I've been trying to explain to people for years. I personally prefer "Takeover" to "Ether" but it doesn't matter what I prefer, because Jay obviously feels like he lost. His whole camp does. So they lost. It's not rocket science.

What's makes this whole thing sad is Jay stans are still denying a loss that Jay conceded to 13 years ago.

Fred.

breh nggaz is lookin for styles p songs right now when he said he didnt the other day, for a second time

denial is powerful

 

[T.H.E.GOD]

nikkas saying jay won the war..... If that's the case, nas seems to b picking up steam while grandfather clock is catching up to jay so does this mean we can start saying nas might end up winning the over all war? fukking smart dumb nikkas ya r. I like that comparison son said about. George foreman. Perfect way to shut these retards the fukk up.

 

[Sam Peel]

lightening to stillmatic i just realized jay dikk rode nas again, nas mentions che guevera on my country, then jay hopped on the bandwagon

 

[Standing on business]

I bet dame spoke to him the next day after he heard that IRS diss

 

[<<TheStandard>>]

A lot of rationalizations in this thread...

Ether was the best track in that battle, but it doesn't even matter. Even if Takeover had been better musically or even if Jay had another 5 songs that were musically better than Ether, Jay still lost because of the impact Ether had on him.

This was more than just a contest of who had the better music, it was a strategic battle straight out of Sun Tzu. And in the end, Nas just outmaneuvered and outplayed Jay.

Jay thought he had the advantage so he hit first. He thought Nas was done anyway and he wanted to take credit for ending him, and also to get revenge because Nas didn't extend him the respect he thought he deserved.
Nas was hit hard, but he remained calm. He didn't rush into responding like Jay later did with Superugly. Nas bided his time, got his shyt together and came out not only with his best punch musically, but with a full blown psychological attack on Jay. Unlike Nas, Jay didn't know how to act. The truth is that Ether broke him. He went from being on top of the world one day to sounding like a rape victim on Hot 97 the next.
Instead of doing what Nas did, Jay rushed out into damage control mode and put out half-baked shyt like Superugly and the track where he called himself "European Hov"(). And the fans didn't miss that.

That was where the battle was lost. Everyone started riding with Nas after that, not because Ether was that much better musically than Takeover(it wasn't), but because Jay acted like the loser and Nas acted like the winner. Even people in Jay's own camp could see that he lost and told him so.

People see what you let them see, and when they looked at Nas they saw a confident dude who acted like he won, and when they looked at Jay they saw an insecure, broken dude sounding like "d-d-did I warrant that?", not like his usual cocky and aggressive self.

Even a year later that demeanor still hadn't changed:
- on Last real nikka alive Nas had the attitude of "ok it's over, I won, let me tell all of you what happened"
- on Blueprint 2 Jay still acted inferior, he was still campaigning for the people to ride with him("but but I donate alot of money, how much does Nas give?") and trying to save face("even in defeat...")
***
I'm a Nas stan but from my POV, while Nas' music was better, it wasn't that much better than Jay's. If you compare Ether + Stillmatic freestyle + random subliminal jabs vs Takeover + Superugly + random subliminal jabs, Nas won, but not by a lot. I'd say it was 60% vs 40% in Nas' favor.

But the real 'war' was fought the way I described above, and Nas won. Jay-s hundreds of millions or his pretty wife don't retroactively change that.

This and the fact that literally 4 years later on the Jim Jones Ballin remix Jay-Z says a line about how the Joneses can't keep up, maybe my nikka NaS but I got stronger after Ether. It obviously bothered him a lot.

 

[Scotch Hall]

man i remember hearing it with my boys when it dropped, everyone was quiet in that car
it was a long ride

 

[Cabbage Patch]

Imagine if Biggie never died, started the commission w/ jay z; big L never died, joined the commission through his rockafella ties, then they got a 190 lb big pun to feature on said work. What about the alternate reality where Hitler cured cancer, @Long_Live_The_Kane ? The answer is don't think about it!

Those are still potent what ifs, though. How would the game have changed? What possible evolutions would have occurred that were stopped short? What completely different but inevitable collaborations would we have been blessed with, how would the landscape have changed? (And Hitler needed anti-depressants and some anti-psychotics to deal with his personal paranoias. That shyt fukks up your fertility and babies, allegedly, long term, but he wasn't about having kids anyway so who cared. Dope his ass up, get rid of the strong influence of the racist/classist American eugenics movement, might have been a different ballgame.)

 

[MartyMcFly]

This is what I've been trying to explain to people for years. I personally prefer "Takeover" to "Ether" but it doesn't matter what I prefer, because Jay obviously feels like he lost. His whole camp does. So they lost. It's not rocket science.

What's makes this whole thing sad is Jay stans are still denying a loss that Jay conceded to 13 years ago.

Fred.

Shyt befuddles me. This isn't some rick Ross 50 cent beef where both of them crow about being the winner; this was huge and not just confined to message boards and Jay openly admits he lost. You can still be a fan of him if you admit it. Bleek is still in his will and he admitted it as soon as he heard ether. Nikkas act like jay will disown them. Oh that's right he doesn't know y'all nikkas yet you're for a 13 year old cause that's already been decided.

You ole south shall rise again nikkas

 

[director_of_bands]

just listened to ether for the first time in years... the "foxy got you hot 'cause you kept your face in her puss" line got me right now