Irrational Games (Bioshock developer) shutting its doors

[lutha]

another thing i'll throw in: I disagree that the game tackles racism..it used racism to help draw you in before they hit you with that sci-fi haymaker, but that's about it....it didn't address anything/say anything important....in fact all people got shytted on in the game: blacks, whites, native americans, jews, Asians, irish, etc....

 

[Bboystyle]

what's with the infinite hate? that game was great....yea, it wasnt the best thing since sliced bread and it didnt play how they showed in early demos, but it was still a great game...

I dunno about ya'll but Infinite on PC was

 

[lutha]

I dunno about ya'll but Infinite on PC was

it was like that on consoles...that's why i dont get the hate for it...

 

[King Koopa]

Getting close to finishing this and will be getting the season pass afterwards for the dlc. Better late than never on this great game

 

[Hypris]

Studio head Ken Levine will form a leaner, 15-person team inside Take-Two and work on smaller, more narrative-driven titles. "My passion has turned to making a different kind of game than we’ve done before," wrote Levine on Irrational's blog. "In many ways, it will be a return to how we started: a small team making games for the core gaming audience."

Never good to see a good dev go down but at least there's something left of them. You don't need a giant budget for good games.

 

[BasedPrime]

Sure is a pity. Infinite was trash though

 

[Mr. Somebody]

Never good to see a good dev go down but at least there's something left of them. You don't need a giant budget for good games.

I think thats a way of saying, we're going to make Mobile games to get more money with a smaller investment.

 

[Easy-E]

the 'cism was obviously part of the context of the story

That's wild. I screenshotted a lot of things, but, missed that.

there really are no "good guys" in Infinite.

there are however just causes and lofty ideals that are inevitably carried out in very imperfect ways
therefore leading to the causes and ideals manifesting themselves in tragic turns of events...very much like our own history in the real world.

very few games touch upon these subjects the way that Infinite did.

But in BSI, because Ken Levine wanted to make a science fiction game, but also wanted to latch on some pseudo-intellectual "point", we were left with some ridiculous statement about oppressors and oppressed being two sides of the same coin. He invokes real history....mangles it beyond imagination...then dumps it the second it no longer serves the purpose of "Press X to Elizabeth".

You didn't answer my question. I said, would you like someone like Khalid Muhammad to overthrow South Africa? Of course not. So how is Daisy Fitzroy a "good guy"? How is she making black people look bad, when there's obviously real world analogs worse than her?

Here's the thing:

White supremacists have argued the exact opposite point you're making. They said the game made white people look bad, and it was basically a "white person murder simulator" because a rather large plot point is over throwing Coumbia, which is an ultra-white, early 1900's conservative utopia. They said they had a problem with the subplot where you help black "terrorists" over throw the government.

They even argued the exact same point, concerning Ken Levine and his Jewish background.

You can't both be right. In fact, neither of you is right because you're both choosing to focus on the race of individual characters instead of seeing the bigger picture. Again, in a game where the protagonist sold his daughter over gambling debts, why would you expect a black woman to be a hero? Because she's black? There isn't a "good" person in the entire game. I don't mean to sound like an @sshole but Irrational doesn't owe you a black hero just because the white people are evil.

And for the record a ton of races caught hell in that game, not just black people. There was Voxophones, posters, and propaganda going in on Irish, Chinese, Native Americans, and yes, even Jews. The "multi-verse dreck" is the point of the game, not trying to make some profound statement on race relations. It honestly seems like you seen Daisy Fitzroy and the Vox, expected the game to go a certain route concerning them, and when it didn't you got upset. And that's fine, but that's not really the game's fault.

Fred.

the 'multi-verse dreck' as yall have labeled it is the main plot of the game, all the race relations is the sub plot/secondary, and by the end it doesn't matter...

And that's the problem the "THIS GAME IS RACIST" crowd has.

Yes, this is a interesting debate. I'm caught in the middle.

I totally agree with @Box Cutta (minus the "HE'S A J**!") ; the main reason I didn't wanna watch Django was because it was satirizing American slavery. It's a subject that's glossed over too much and has been poorly dissected in mainstream discussions.

I will say; I felt uneasy about it, but, ultimately looked at the religious commentary is the bigger issue--religion=slavery--more than the racial angle.

But, like @Orbital-Fetus posted; it was a very ambitious subject to cover, in a game, but; I come back to @Box Cutta 's side in that it was subjected to 3rd rate sub plot, when it couldve atleast resolved that part of the story. Sidebar: I'm not offended at the "turn" Daisy made in the alternate universe, but, @Box Cutta is right, in that, we never got to appreciation the motives and actions of World 1 Daisy.

 

[Batman]

I hate what they did to Elizabeth in this game but I know it had to be done. Hopefully Elizabeth makes a return in Bioshock 4. Hopefully.

 

[hex]

That's wild. I screenshotted a lot of things, but, missed that.








And that's the problem the "THIS GAME IS RACIST" crowd has.

Yes, this is a interesting debate. I'm caught in the middle.

I totally agree with @Box Cutta (minus the "HE'S A J**!") ; the main reason I didn't wanna watch Django was because it was satirizing American slavery. It's a subject that's glossed over too much and has been poorly dissected in mainstream discussions.

I will say; I felt uneasy about it, but, ultimately looked at the religious commentary is the bigger issue--religion=slavery--more than the racial angle.

But, like @Orbital-Fetus posted; it was a very ambitious subject to cover, in a game, but; I come back to @Box Cutta 's side in that it was subjected to 3rd rate sub plot, when it couldve atleast resolved that part of the story. Sidebar: I'm not offended at the "turn" Daisy made in the alternate universe, but, @Box Cutta is right, in that, we never got to appreciation the motives and actions of World 1 Daisy.

@Box Cutta

Without spoiling anything, Daisy's story and motivations are expanded upon in the "Burial At Sea: Episode 2" DLC. I'd like to say more but....I can't really.

This is why I said "let's wait until the 2nd DLC" earlier in the thread though.

Fred.

 

[Easy-E]

@Box Cutta

Without spoiling anything, Daisy's story and motivations are expanded upon in the "Burial At Sea: Episode 2" DLC. I'd like to say more but....I can't really.

This is why I said "let's wait until the 2nd DLC" earlier in the thread though.

Fred.

I do want to check that out.

But, that's what I don't like about this new game economy...I "get" that, but, don't like it... @ all the money (I enjoyed 'em) I spent on Mass Effect DLC

 

[hex]

I do want to check that out.

But, that's what I don't like about this new game economy...I "get" that, but, don't like it... @ all the money (I enjoyed 'em) I spent on Mass Effect DLC

I'm an OG gamer....I'm talking "Pong" from the early 80's....so I think DLC in general is some bullshyt....having said that, the "Burial At Sea" DLC for this game is worth it. Obviously get it on sale if you can, but Episode 1 and Episode 2 actually expand on the story in a meaningful way.

I have to word it carefully....neither of them necessarily changes the ending....but when you play them you'll see why it couldn't be part of the main game.

Fred.

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

Spoiler

Daisy was not going to kill that kid...she faked it so she would be killed by Elizabeth.
that made an entirely new universe where the Vox where so brutal?

 

[Orbital-Fetus]

No, because the question is about as irrelevant as the one I posted in response.

You're choosing to focus on black people in a game where pretty much everyone across the board caught Ls. The white "hero" protagonist is a man paid to kidnap a girl....who we find out sold his own daughter to pay off gambling debts. This same "white hero" is drowned by his daughter, the white ultra-conservative utopia Columbia is destroyed, and their idol Comstock is killed.

Should I say the game is racist against white people? The game makes white people look so bad white supremacists actually threatened to kill the people that made it:

http://kotaku.com/5968336/the-jew-ken-levine-is-making-a-white person-killing-simulator

But it's racist because the black characters died and/or weren't depicted as stalwart heroes?

You're smarter than this. If your argument uses the same logic as st0rmfr0nt it's time to rethink what you're saying.

Fred.

well said.

 

[Cat piss martini]