Kareem on Dirk: "One trick pony"

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

So much truth, I've said this for years!!!

Watching a game on tv versus watching one player all game in person gives you a much better perspective. I've been an off/on mavs season ticket holder since they were in reunion arena when he was the 3rd option behind nash and finley.

Yes absolutely he got so much better at his game from an offensive end but watching this guy on defense is almost comical. A lot of guys rather college or pro exaggerate their height but dirk is legit 7ft but watching him the paint over the years fighting for offensive/defensive rebounds is the equivalent of watching earl boykins or spud webb trying it. Most people around the metroplex who follow the mavs have known this forever.

I believe dirk and Carmelo are two of the same kind. Tremendous offensive players who can get any shot they want but their defense leaves much to be desired that's what I've said they are stars NOT "superstars" in my opinion, you gotta do it on both ends. That was a great run to the title a couple of years ago but Stevenson and marion did a number on LeBron and negated a lot of what he likes to do and terry and kidd stepped up big time, dirk didn't lead them to anything, it was other guys and not to mention barea.

:

Were you sleeping during the games or some shyt?

 

[DrX]

dirk is def top top 25....but Kareem is arguably the goat big man.....i still think dirk is the greatest big shooter tho

 

[Xerces]

The narrative - particularly on The Coli - that Dirk Nowitzki single-handedly took his team and won a championship is overblown and utterly ridiculous, and is used halfway to pump up Dirk's all-time status and halfway to downgrade LeBron's. Shawn Marion, Tyson Chandler, and Jason Kidd all playing great defense during that run (and covering up plenty of Dirk's mistakes) allowed Dirk to not even really have to play D and just worry about scoring (and he didn't have to even make plays for others) and get all of the credit. And Kidd and Jason Terry creating on the offensive end for others and at times for Dirk allowed for the only thing Dirk having to do to be shooting the ball. And while he did a tremendous job of it no doubt he didn't "win it alone" or anything close to it.

That's a lie, and I don't recall anyone saying that. However Dirk and bunch of roll players at the time did in fact defeat the Heat. Name one player on that Mavericks team ( outside of Dirk and even then most would say Dirk doesn't even compare) that Rivaled Lebron, Wade and Bosh?

 

[heart]

Nobody is acting like the role players didnt play well, but Dirk was FAR AND AWAY the single most important piece to that title run

I feel stupid for even having to tell someone that

now this is going too far in the other direction. Dirk most definitely did lead that team. Now him carrying a bunch of role players is certainly overblown but he most definitely keyed that run.

:

Were you sleeping during the games or some shyt?

Let me clarify, I didn't mean that in the literal sense. What I'm meant was the narrative from that championship was it was dirk "and everyone else", dirk played a key role but I felt the supporting cast is what put them over top. I'm NOT discounting what dirk did.

 

[FTBS]

EXACTLY!!!


Dirk one of the few players that never had another superstar of his level playing with him, Duncan had robinson and then manu and parker.

If those guys were on Duncan's level then Nash, Finley, and Kidd were on Dirk's.

 

[FTBS]

That's a lie, and I don't recall anyone saying that. However Dirk and bunch of roll players at the time did in fact defeat the Heat. Name one player on that Mavericks team ( outside of Dirk and even then most would say Dirk doesn't even compare) that Rivaled Lebron, Wade and Bosh?

JET rivaled Bron in the Finals

 

[im not you]

Exactly so the status or reputation of those players is irrelevant. How they perform is all that matters. You got all-stars that freeze up in the playoffs and you got role players that step up. It's one thing if your lack of all-stars forces you do have to dominate multiple aspects of the game like Dream and Duncan but Dirk was still allowed to just focus on scoring and those role players took care of everything else.

don't know what you're trying to argue here breh. no one is saying dirk is better than dream or duncan all time. his limitations keep him out of the top 15 all time, but everyone boiling what he did down to just 'scoring' is over simplifying things a bit.

the fact he had no other all stars on his team is important because - the attention and help he drew from the other defenders allowed his teammates the time and space to do whatever they wanted. case in point- barea benefitted the most, peja against the lakers. so yeah, he scored a lot, but few players in history have been able to be the singular hub of the offense like that with one other creator on the team, even if he didn't have to play too much defense.

 

[Xerces]

JET rivaled Bron in the Finals

Jet did have a good series however I legit doubt anyone would say Jet> Lebron, Jet > Wade or any other players on the Mavs

 

[FTBS]

don't know what you're trying to argue here breh. no one is saying dirk is better than dream or duncan all time. his limitations keep him out of the top 15 all time, but everyone boiling what he did down to just 'scoring' is over simplifying things a bit.

the fact he had no other all stars on his team is important because - the attention and help he drew from the other defenders allowed his teammates the time and space to do whatever they wanted. case in point- barea benefitted the most, peja against the lakers. so yeah, he scored a lot, but few players in history have been able to be the singular hub of the offense like that with one other creator on the team, even if he didn't have to play too much defense.

All great offensive players have been that at some point. Few of them have had non all-star teammates that they could count on to knock down those shots they created with that level of consistency and take all the defensive pressure off of them.

 

[Jesus]

fukk that disrespectful deadbeat dad Uncle Tom nikka....go sit somewhere with your white wife you fukking tall prune fakkit. Just mad that he's the 4th most popular Laker.

 

[im not you]

All great offensive players have been that at some point. Few of them have had non all-star teammates that they could count on to knock down those shots they created with that level of consistency and take all the defensive pressure off of them.

name three that were the sole focus of the defense, with a 2nd option that wasn't an allstar.

it's a reason the aim of every gm is to acquire multiple all stars on their team, and not to just have one and surround them with roleplayers. roleplayers are less reliable, and you have no idea if/when they're going to knock down shots that are created for them.

 

[FTBS]

Jet did have a good series however I legit doubt anyone would say Jet> Lebron, Jet > Wade or any other players on the Mavs

Of course not, but for that series (which is all that is relevant in this discussion) he outscored Bron. We can't use general, overarching points to discuss a specific circumstance that may or may not correspond with those points.

 

[Jesus]

Okay Dirk was one dimensional and won a ring...that's still hard to do.

AI tried and failed in 2000.
Rose failed his MVP year.
CP3 failed when he choked against the Spurs in 08.
Carmelo failed when Chauncey helped him to the WCF in 09.
Barkley failed in 93.
Nash failed numerous times with prime STAT.

So being responsible for offense and letting your role-players handle the defensive and rebouding aspects..you lose credit her on the Coli. But how many nikkas had the juice for the WHOLE playoffs to win it all other than Kareem or DIrk?

 

[FTBS]

name three that were the sole focus of the defense, with a 2nd option that wasn't an allstar.

it's a reason the aim of every gm is to acquire multiple all stars on their team, and not to just have one and surround them with roleplayers. roleplayers are less reliable, and you have no idea if/when they're going to knock down shots that are created for them.

Jordan, LeBron, Wade, Kobe, Duncan, Hakeem, McGrady, Pierce, Melo and plenty of others.

Obviously you want better players and role players are indeed less reliable, that's why they are role players. However, when they step up and make those shots consistently and take all the defensive pressure off the star for an entire playoff run we can't just try to act like they played like typical role players.

 

[basketball reasons]

So much truth, I've said this for years!!!

Watching a game on tv versus watching one player all game in person gives you a much better perspective. I've been an off/on mavs season ticket holder since they were in reunion arena when he was the 3rd option behind nash and finley.

Yes absolutely he got so much better at his game from an offensive end but watching this guy on defense is almost comical. A lot of guys rather college or pro exaggerate their height but dirk is legit 7ft but watching him the paint over the years fighting for offensive/defensive rebounds is the equivalent of watching earl boykins or spud webb trying it. Most people around the metroplex who follow the mavs have known this forever.

I believe dirk and Carmelo are two of the same kind. Tremendous offensive players who can get any shot they want but their defense leaves much to be desired that's what I've said they are stars NOT "superstars" in my opinion, you gotta do it on both ends. That was a great run to the title a couple of years ago but Stevenson and marion did a number on LeBron and negated a lot of what he likes to do and terry and kidd stepped up big time, dirk didn't lead them to anything, it was other guys and not to mention barea.

With this logic steph's not a superstar.