LeBron’s faced much better teams in the Finals than Michael Jordan...

[MrFantastic]

My point is, the 90s deserved better. I wish penny and Shaq played together longer. I wish Charles was able to leave in year 5 rather than bytch his way out in year 7 to have a teammate like KJ. I wish Kemp didn't get flabby. I wish Ewing didn't have to depend on old Harper, Doc Rivers and Starks to be his teammates. Those teams had the potential to be great, but they were just good and not as good as what we saw years prior

I get all that...but those teams were still better than other decade longivity teams..that Orlando team with Shaq and penny no matter of how short the time period was..is still better than any 80's team probably other than the Lakers..and maybe hou..

I don't get this blasphemy of horrible 90 basketball...saw some good teams...no all time great teams othe than the bulls...but it's like 4 or 5 all time great teams in history...the second tier of teams was much better in the 90's...

I feel like everybody just think of the Knicks and heat and their slow down pace and automatic remember bad basketball...

 

[I AM WARHOL]

Serves him right. Balances out the cake walks he gets to the finals by feasting in the east. This lowkey proves the strength of the modern Western Conference. Gotta be the cream of the crop to come out of the west.

 

[NYC Rebel]

I get all that...but those teams were still better than other decade longivity teams..that Orlando team with Shaq and penny no matter of how short the time period was..is still better than any 80's team probably other than the Lakers..and maybe hou..

I don't get this blasphemy of horrible 90 basketball...saw some good teams...no all time great teams othe than the bulls...but it's like 4 or 5 all time great teams in history...the second tier of teams was much better in the 90's...

I feel like everybody just think of the Knicks and heat and their slow down pace and automatic remember bad basketball...

No they weren't better.
You don't beat teams that play together for years like those 80s squads. Why do you think the U.S. Ran into trouble in the Olympics years back? The teams they faced didn't have better "name brand" players like you cite with Penny and Shaq. They had years together which meant more

 

[YoungMoneyCashMoneyBoy]

It's not that Jordan dominated "inferior" sg's, it's that the sg position was never a dominant position. Jordan was just a dominant player who happened to be a sg, a position that never dominated the landscape of basketball. SG's were never a centerpiece of the team before Jordan. He's the one that changed that whole perception of a sg.

So this belief that he played in some watered down sg era is false. It was weak in the 50s, in the the 60s, 70s, and even right fukking now with flabby ass harden as the best sg.

Like I said in another thread, one draft class got people thinking it's always been some talent deep position, and that's the 96 draft class with Ray, Kobe, and Iverson. Them dudes are gone, and it's back to being an afterthought of a position. One player changed the view of that position and that's Michael Jordan.

And the thought that Jordan would have trouble with any modern athlete is hilarious when a Jordan clone put up 35ppg in 2006...I'm sure the real thing who was faster, stronger, smarter, and more athletic would have no problem with any modern athlete. If 6', 160lb Iverson can drop 33ppg against nikkas who were stronger and more athletic than him.....you get the point.

There were what 2 expansion teams added to the league in 1995 when the bulls made their second run? Charlotte, Miami, Orlando and Minnesota were introduced in '88/'89 before/ during the piston reign, so they must've benefited from expansion as well. And if expansion waters down a league, Bill Russell and the Celtics ( when the league had between 8-14 teams) can say the only rings that matter the most are theirs, not some league with watered down talent and 22-23 teams (magic's/Kareem's Lakers era), or 27-29 teams(bad boys/bulls era).

 

[NYC Rebel]

It's not that Jordan dominated "inferior" sg's, it's that the sg position was never a dominant position. Jordan was just a dominant player who happened to be a sg, a position that never dominated the landscape of basketball. SG's were never a centerpiece of the team before Jordan. He's the one that changed that whole perception of a sg.

So this belief that he played in some watered down sg era is false. It was weak in the 50s, in the the 60s, 70s, and even right fukking now with flabby ass harden as the best sg.

Like I said in another thread, one draft class got people thinking it's always been some talent deep position, and that's the 96 draft class with Ray, Kobe, and Iverson. Them dudes are gone, and it's back to being an afterthought of a position. One player changed the view of that position and that's Michael Jordan.

And the thought that Jordan would have trouble with any modern athlete is hilarious when a Jordan clone put up 35ppg in 2006...I'm sure the real thing who was faster, stronger, smarter, and more athletic would have no problem with any modern athlete. If 6', 160lb Iverson can drop 33ppg against nikkas who were stronger and more athletic than him.....you get the point.

There were what 2 expansion teams added to the league in 1995 when the bulls made their second run? Charlotte, Miami, Orlando and Minnesota were introduced in '88/'89 before/ during the piston reign, so they must've benefited from expansion as well. And if expansion waters down a league, Bill Russell and the Celtics ( when the league had between 8-14 teams) can say the only rings that matter the most are theirs, not some league with watered down talent and 22-23 teams (magic's/Kareem's Lakers era), or 27-29 teams(bad boys/bulls era).

6 expansion teams added in an 8 year span created havoc in the league, tearing teams apart and giving CBA quality niqqas an NBA job

 

[YoungMoneyCashMoneyBoy]

6 expansion teams added in an 8 year span created havoc in the league, tearing teams apart and giving CBA quality niqqas an NBA job

And 8 expansion teams were added between '69 (the season after Russell retired) and '76. So like I said, he could easily degrade all the rings won after he played.

 

[NYC Rebel]

And 8 expansion teams were added between '69 (the season after Russell retired) to '77. So like I said, he could easily degrade all the rings won after he played.

I wasn't around to see that so why the fukk would I argue it? I just know there was a fall off in the 90s from what I saw in the 80s and your points about the evolution of the SG and MJ is pretty much moot

 

[YoungMoneyCashMoneyBoy]

I wasn't around to see that so why the fukk would I argue it? I just know there was a fall off in the 90s from what I saw in the 80s and your points about the evolution of the SG and MJ is pretty much moot

I'm just following your faulty logic.

And how are my points about mj moot?

 

[MrFantastic]

No they weren't better.
You don't beat teams that play together for years like those 80s squads. Why do you think the U.S. Ran into trouble in the Olympics years back? The teams they faced didn't have better "name brand" players like you cite with Penny and Shaq. They had years together which meant more

Agree to disagree...nobody in the 80s second tier teams other than pistons sixers and maybe hou in IMO are beating them 90's tier two teams

90's tier two teams have more HOF players on their teams than any other decade...

 

[MrFantastic]

It's not that Jordan dominated "inferior" sg's, it's that the sg position was never a dominant position. Jordan was just a dominant player who happened to be a sg, a position that never dominated the landscape of basketball. SG's were never a centerpiece of the team before Jordan. He's the one that changed that whole perception of a sg.

So this belief that he played in some watered down sg era is false. It was weak in the 50s, in the the 60s, 70s, and even right fukking now with flabby ass harden as the best sg.

Like I said in another thread, one draft class got people thinking it's always been some talent deep position, and that's the 96 draft class with Ray, Kobe, and Iverson. Them dudes are gone, and it's back to being an afterthought of a position. One player changed the view of that position and that's Michael Jordan.

This

When teams would build their roster SG would be 5th on the totem pole..MJ came and changed that...

Kobe era for SG is the best...but after that

 

[NYC Rebel]

I'm just following your faulty logic.

And how are my points about mj moot?

No you're not. I didn't get verbose about individual players

 

[YoungMoneyCashMoneyBoy]

No you're not. I didn't get verbose about individual players

I'm talking about in relation to 6 expansion teams in 8 years wreaking havoc on the league. Following that logic, 8 teams in 8 years must've killed the league. Maybe that's why the league was considered dead with such watered down talent and infiltration of bum ass nikkas who didn't deserve to be in the league.

And I wouldn't say I got verbose about individual players, I just mentioned a few to solidify my argument.

 

[NYC Rebel]

[

I'm talking about in relation to 6 expansion teams in 8 years wreaking havoc on the league. Following that logic, 8 teams in 8 years must've killed the league. Maybe that's why the league was considered dead with such watered down talent and infiltration of bum ass nikkas who didn't deserve to be in the league..

You're not following my logic. Why on earth am I going to talk on a league I didn't see? Because that's what you're doing now?

How are you going to argue on the fall off, myself, Bird, Dr. j and many others saw?

Too many of you get caught up into star players and and the quality of teams they played on.

Doc Rivers would have been out of a job if the league didn't create a spot for him in adding these jobs and forcing teams like the Knicks to reach out for him since the quality was so thin.

He NBA saw four teams in an expansion draft in a span of two years and here you are acting as if players being pulled off of teams to play for expansion teams didn't hurt the teams they left, forcing them to make up for the marginally talented player they saw leave the team with even lesser players.

The CBA saw its greatest influx of players enter the NBA in the 90s. Man please.

 

[YoungMoneyCashMoneyBoy]

[


You're not following my logic. Why on earth am I going to talk on a league I didn't see? Because that's what you're doing now?

How are you going to argue on the fall off, myself, Bird, Dr. j and many others saw?

Too many of you get caught up into star players and and the quality of teams they played on.

Doc Rivers would have been out of a job if the league didn't create a spot for him in adding these jobs and forcing teams like the Knicks to reach out for him since the quality was so thin.

He NBA saw four teams in an expansion draft in a span of two years and here you are acting as if players being pulled off of teams to play for expansion teams didn't hurt the teams they left, forcing them to make up for the marginally talented player they saw leave the team with even lesser players.

The CBA saw its greatest influx of players enter the NBA in the 90s. Man please

No one is saying you're talking about a league you didn't see.

You said there was a fall off in the 90's from what you saw in the 80's and that "expansion allowed lower quality players who couldn't find jobs a job opportunity." Expansion is expansion. It can't be the worst thing for the league during jordan's era because you saw it, but then a wonderful thing in the 70's because you have no clue about it. On a basic, rudimentary level the nature of expansion is the same. So, again, following your logic, which is actually strengthened by the fall off of play in the 70's to the point that the league was considered dead, expansion allowed lower quality players who couldn't find jobs a job opportunity. The difference you saw between the 80's and 90's can also be seen between the 60's and 70's. So, again, Russell can easily take your position and diminish every ring won after 1969.

And I'm not acting like anything, if you're saying "players being pulled off of teams to play for expansion teams hurt the teams they left, forcing them to make up for the marginally talented player they saw leave the team with even lesser players," then again, you strengthen the position that expansion teams also hurt the quality of play in the 70's and really even moreso since more teams were added in the same length of time.

 

[NYC Rebel]

No one is saying you're talking about a league you didn't see.

You said there was a fall off in the 90's from what you saw in the 80's and that "expansion allowed lower quality players who couldn't find jobs a job opportunity." Expansion is expansion. It can't be the worst thing for the league during jordan's era because you saw it, but then a wonderful thing in the 70's because you have no clue about it. On a basic, rudimentary level the nature of expansion is the same. So, again, following your logic, which is actually strengthened by the fall off of play in the 70's to the point that the league was considered dead, expansion allowed lower quality players who couldn't find jobs a job opportunity. The difference you saw between the 80's and 90's can also be seen between the 60's and 70's. So, again, Russell can easily take your position and diminish every ring won after 1969.

I'm not acting like anything, if you're saying "players being pulled off of teams to play for expansion teams hurt the teams they left, forcing them to make up for the marginally talented player they saw leave the team with even lesser players," then again, you strengthen the position that expansion teams also hurt the quality of play in the 70's and really even moreso since more teams were added in the same length of time.

I don't care about the 60s or 70s. That's a
Useless point.