Should *edited* cooperation and respect from a woman be conditional and if so what caliber or type of man deserves one

[CreepyMcCreeperson]

Thats a form of submission...actually the ultimate if its raw. You are putting your body and well being of your potential future child...shyt the future of your family on the line for this dude.

Exactly. What does that say about her? She is willing to risk all of that for a man she doesn’t respect or think highly enough to submit to. Submission doesn’t mean she doesn’t have choices, or opinions, or a say. It just means she trusts him to lead.

 

[No_bammer_weed]

So when it’s time to get up in middle of the night because a strange sound was heard, who’s getting out of bed? Your wife? No disrespect. Just wondering how that co-captain life works where a man is expected to protect his family and lay his life on the line for them so his wife can stay behind to raise the children.

If people were trying to break into your home multiple times a week, I could see how that would be an issue concerning male “leadership”, (maybe the wife would suggest moving) but how often is an in home break in going to happen in a couple’s lifetime? Once would be catastrophic

 

[Shadow King]

I dunno. The whole “leadership” stuff sounds weird if you’re partnering with someone as accomplished and educated as yourself, which should be the goal. Not sure why I would constantly need to “lead” another grown up. That’s what you do for children.

Well that's on the women for desiring that leadership in spite of being accomplished and educated.

People want to have their cake and eat it too. Guys wanna be Mr Big Bad Alpha while splitting bills and providing limited if any protection and no actual leadership. Ladies want a man that provides and allows her to live the soft life without telling her what to do or cheating on her.

You are right...being a leader is a big deal and deeper than most folks realize. A lot of people only see the instructive aspect or percieved freedom and fail to see the pressure or expectations that a leader must carry.

Most men don't do this. Y'all sound like y'all take your sister's stories too close to heart, and a lot of this dynamic comes from the insistence on men valuing a woman's degrees and career at the same level that women value ours. A lot of confusion is bred from this because one relationship style is pushed as the "right way forward" while another style is what's truly desired.

Is leadership about sole financial execution or not? If not, then questions have to be raised or reemerged as to what makes a man worth following. Because if it's really about "how much of a man" he is and his character, the 50K man can lead the 80K woman. But the vast, vast, vast majority don't want to hear that.

 

[Wig Twistin Season]

If people were trying to break into your home multiple times a week, I could see how that would be an issue concerning male “leadership”, (maybe the wife would suggest moving) but how often is an in home break in going to happen in a couple’s lifetime? Once would be catastrophic

The point is all that submission is because a man is supposed to sacrifice himself for his family. Submitting is her sacrifice smart guy.

 

[No_bammer_weed]

The point is all that submission is because a man is supposed to sacrifice himself for his family. Submitting is her sacrifice smart guy.

The idea of a man giving his life for his family is roughly on the same level of frequency of winning the lottery. We’re talking the normal day to day functionality of a relationship.

 

[Jalether]

OK change the premise to cooperation and respect. That's really what most men mean when they use the word submissive anyway, including myself. I don't want a slave or puppy no

Now back on topic instead of getting fixated on the word submissive

It's undeniable that women of older generation were more cooperaive and respectful to their men regardless of his income level.

What has changed

 

[Wig Twistin Season]

The idea of a man giving his life for his family is roughly on the same level of frequency of winning the lottery. We’re talking the normal day to day functionality of a relationship.

Stop being so literal.

Why men often die earlier than women - Harvard Health

...

www.health.harvard.edu

So why do men, on average, die first?

There are many reasons why the ratio of men to women (which is roughly equal in young adulthood) starts to favor women over time. Among the most powerful factors? Men tend to

• take bigger risks. Some of the reason seems to be "biological destiny." The frontal lobe of the brain — the part that controls judgment and consideration of an action’s consequences — develops more slowly in boys and young men than in their female counterparts. This may contribute to the fact that far more boys and men die in accidents or due to violence than girls and women. Examples include biking, driving drunk, and homicide. This tendency toward lack of judgment and consideration of consequences may also contribute to detrimental lifestyle decisions among young men, such as smoking or drinking to excess.
• have more dangerous jobs. Men far outnumber women in some of the riskiest occupations, including military combat, firefighting, and working at construction sites.

 

[Shadow King]

OK change the premise to cooperation and respect. That's really what most men mean when they use the word submissive anyway, including myself. I don't want a slave or puppy no

It's undeniable that women of older generation were more cooperaive and respectful to their men regardless of his income level.

What has changed

Nah fuçk that.

Stand on the term. The fact you need to edit is why society is the way it is. I ain't a part of the He-Man Coli Club but male censorship is part of this confusion.

 

[Wig Twistin Season]

Nah fuçk that.

Stand on the term. The fact you need to edit is why society is the way it is. I ain't a part of the He-Man Coli Club but male censorship is part of this confusion.

Agreed.

 

[Shadow King]

The point is all that submission is because a man is supposed to sacrifice himself for his family. Submitting is her sacrifice smart guy.

Once he strawmanned into "breaking in multiple times a week" it became an unserious discussion.

 

[Phitz]

But the issue is there are men that cannot provide that and they are still expecting submission.The word submission is the wrong word and it is often used as means to have dominion over someone.Which is not healthy.

provide what exactly? is this a financial or more intangible concept.

I'm asking because most people on here and in the real world are lying and can barely provide anything for themselves much less anyone else.

Out here boldly lying with confidence

ALL of ya'll need to get out here nad learn to grow some beans and corn soon, instead of pretend like majority of men should "provide" like Jeff or Bill.

Even 6 cert gang out here watching their money evaporate with rising costs

Better stop debating and poole your resources and plant some tomatos, it's getting wild out here

 

[No_bammer_weed]

So why do men, on average, die first?

• take bigger risks. “This may contribute to the fact that far more boys and men die in accidents or due to violence than girls and women. Examples include biking, driving drunk, and homicide. This tendency toward lack of judgment and consideration of consequences may also contribute to detrimental lifestyle decisions among young men, such as smoking or drinking to excess”

Whose fault is the above? Does that sound like a person who should be the “leader” of a household?

 

[Wig Twistin Season]

Whose fault is the above? Does that sound like a person who should be the “leader” of a household?

Granular arguments are for the slow and feeble minded. If I have to explain everything and give everything proper context for you, I’m wasting my time. Go ahead and neg me to complete the cypher of emotional arguing.

 

[No_bammer_weed]

Granular arguments are for the slow and feeble minded. If I have to explain everything and give everything proper context for you, I’m wasting my time. Go ahead and beg me to complete the cypher of emotional arguing.

Lol. That’s a tap out. All good

 

[Piff Perkins]

I don't care about submissiveness. I care about someone who values the things I value, thinks how I think on certain major issues (finances/money, raising children, retirement, basic decency, etc) who can raise our children properly if I pass away early, and who I want to spend the rest of my life with. Marriage is a partnership more than anything else. It's 2023, nobody is seeking the meek church girl who lives with her parents, has never had a job, and has bee trained to be a wife. Most people are working towards goals, working to get by, or in a profession they worked hard to get into.

Men want to cry about a lack of submissiveness while they display none of the leadership of men in the past. Dudes are out here struggling with no ambition, no goals, no education, and no shyt they own (car, house, whatever) yet are mad at women for not wanting to hop on their team. It's not 1965 anymore, factory jobs aren't paying the mortgage. But instead of changing with the time a lot of men just stay on the sidelines crying. Trust me, there are a LOT of successful men out here with wives and children living a good life. And their wives are as "submissive" as you can get in 2023 America because they're being taken care of and protected. If you can't do that, you shouldn't be talking about submissiveness.