The Issue is Not Trump. It is Us

[Dad]

would it have been better if he called them "mediocre negroes"?

Its cool for him to scrutinize his politics but, a white man referring to a black person as a slave in any form is unacceptable.

 

[Maschine_Man]

already have presence under UN most likely, so need need for a US base?

I can confirm 100% that the UN is in DRC.

 

[Maschine_Man]

Its cool for him to scrutinize his politics but, a white man referring to a black person as a slave in any form is unacceptable.

is it?

why?

 

[thatrapsfan]

My argument is clear and you have really done nothing to address it.
On top of it there is nothing you have presented to dance around.

My position is simple, US presence in Africa isn't exagerrated at all by the article, it falls in line with what the US government itself has admitted, you can not refute this it is simply a fact.
I never argued the US was the most influential foreign power operating in Africa, again this is a strawman presented by you because you actually can not address the point made, that the US admitted these areas exist and there could be more.

Your points have been addressed repeatedly, the question now is if you will read and comprehend what is written.

LOL this is childish and I suspect you know it.

I asked you from the start to show me evidence of U.S. outposts in Zambia, Namibia, Botswana, and Tanzania just to name a few countries marked on the articles map.

Google the words military outpost and fill in any of those countries. Find me a single source(outside of your article which I dispute) that claims U.S. military outposts exist in any of those places. None exist and thats why I can confidently stand by my original claim that the claim made is a huge exaggeration.


The U.S. Government has never "admitted" that it has outposts in over half the countries marked in that map. Unless you can prove this wrong, without citing the article under dispute, you have no real counterargument.

 

[Dad]

is it?

why?

you tell me why it's acceptable and then i'll tell you why it isn't.

 

[thatrapsfan]

you guys still putting stock in polls, survey's and other shyt?

you should know(by now) that they really aren't worth shyt. You really think they polled 350 million ppl? who got polled?


no, they take a sample of the population which is most likely biased.

So your position is surveys are only legitimate if they poll the entire population?

Are the polls that show Hilary is deeply unpopular also biased?

 

[David_TheMan]

LOL this is childish and I suspect you know it.

I asked you from the start to show me evidence of U.S. outposts in Zambia, Namibia, Botswana, and Tanzania just to name a few countries marked on the articles map.

Google the words military outpost and fill in any of those countries. Find me a single source(outside of your article which I dispute) that claims U.S. military outposts exist in any of those places. None exist and thats why I can confidently stand by my original claim that the claim made is a huge exaggeration.


The U.S. Government has never "admitted" that it has outposts in over half the countries marked in that map. Unless you can prove this wrong, without citing the article under dispute, you have no real counterargument.

What is childish about replying to you point by point on a factual basis?
I showed you links to articles that if you read would show you US government confirming or indirectly notifying that these outposts exist on that map, you are choosing no to read the articles and again that is on you, not me. Here you go again though, try to actually read the article. Tomgram: Nick Turse, America's Empire of African Bases | TomDispatch

AFRICOM’s Base Bonanza

When AFRICOM became an independent command in 2008, Camp Lemonnier was reportedly still one of the few American outposts on the continent. In the years since, the U.S. has embarked on nothing short of a building boom -- even if the command is loath to refer to it in those terms. As a result, it’s now able to carry out increasing numbers of overt and covert missions, from training exercises to drone assassinations.

“AFRICOM, as a new command, is basically a laboratory for a different kind of warfare and a different way of posturing forces,” says Richard Reeve, the director of the Sustainable Security Programme at the Oxford Research Group, a London-based think tank. “Apart from Djibouti, there’s no significant stockpiling of troops, equipment, or even aircraft. There are a myriad of ‘lily pads’ or small forward operating bases... so you can spread out even a small number of forces over a very large area and concentrate those forces quite quickly when necessary.”

Indeed, U.S. staging areas, cooperative security locations, forward operating locations (FOLs), and other outposts -- many of them involved in intelligence, surveillance, and reconnaissance activities and Special Operations missions -- have been built (or built up) in Burkina Faso, Cameroon, the Central African Republic, Chad, Djibouti, Ethiopia, Gabon, Ghana, Kenya, Mali, Niger, Senegal, the Seychelles, Somalia, South Sudan, and Uganda. A 2011 report by Lauren Ploch, an analyst in African affairs with the Congressional Research Service, also mentioned U.S. military access to locations in Algeria, Botswana, Namibia, São Tomé and Príncipe, Sierra Leone, Tunisia, and Zambia. AFRICOM failed to respond to scores of requests by this reporter for further information about its outposts and related matters, but an analysis of open source information, documents obtained through the Freedom of Information Act, and other records show a persistent, enduring, and growing U.S. presence on the continent.

“A cooperative security location is just a small location where we can come in... It would be what you would call a very austere location with a couple of warehouses that has things like: tents, water, and things like that,” explained AFRICOM’s Rodriguez. As he implies, the military doesn’t consider CSLs to be “bases,” but whatever they might be called, they are more than merely a few tents and cases of bottled water.

Designed to accommodate about 200 personnel, with runways suitable for C-130 transport aircraft, the sites are primed for conversion from temporary, bare-bones facilities into something more enduring. At least three of them in Senegal, Ghana, and Gabon are apparently designed to facilitate faster deployment for a rapid reaction unit with a mouthful of a moniker: Special Purpose Marine Air-Ground Task Force Crisis Response-Africa (SPMAGTF-CR-AF). Its forces are based in Morón, Spain, and Sigonella, Italy, but are focused on Africa. They rely heavily on MV-22 Ospreys, tilt-rotor aircraft that can take-off, land, and hover like helicopters, but fly with the speed and fuel efficiency of a turboprop plane.

This combination of manpower, access, and technology has come to be known in the military by the moniker “New Normal.” Birthed in the wake of the September 2012 attack in Benghazi, Libya, that killed U.S. Ambassador J. Christopher Stevens and three other Americans, the New Normal effectively allows the U.S. military quick access 400 miles inland from any CSL or, as Richard Reeve notes, gives it “a reach that extends to just about every country in West and Central Africa.”

The concept was field-tested as South Sudan plunged into civil war and 160 Marines and sailors from Morón were forward deployed to Djibouti in late 2013. Within hours, a contingent from that force was sent to Uganda and, in early 2014, in conjunction with another rapid reaction unit, dispatched to South Sudan to evacuate 20 people from the American embassy in Juba. Earlier this year, SPMAGTF-CR-AF ran trials at its African staging areas including the CSL in Libreville, Gabon, deploying nearly 200 Marines and sailors along with four Ospreys, two C-130s, and more than 150,000 pounds of materiel.

A similar test run was carried out at the Senegal CSL located at Dakar-Ouakam Air Base, which can also host 200 Marines and the support personnel necessary to sustain and transport them. “What the CSL offers is the ability to forward-stage our forces to respond to any type of crisis,” Lorenzo Armijo, an operations officer with SPMAGTF-CR-AF, told a military reporter. “That crisis can range in the scope of military operations from embassy reinforcement to providing humanitarian assistance.”

Another CSL, mentioned in a July 2012 briefing by U.S. Army Africa, is located in Entebbe, Uganda. From there, according to a Washington Post investigation, U.S. contractors have flown surveillance missions using innocuous-looking turboprop airplanes. “The AFRICOM strategy is to have a very light touch, a light footprint, but nevertheless facilitate special forces operations or ISR [intelligence, surveillance, and reconnaissance] detachments over a very wide area,” Reeve says. “To do that they don’t need very much basing infrastructure, they need an agreement to use a location, basic facilities on the ground, a stockpile of fuel, but they also can rely on private contractors to maintain a number of facilities so there aren’t U.S. troops on the ground.”

Now if you don't want to accept that fine by me, but don't try to claim no one answered your questions when it was addressed in my reply to your intial post.
Now have a good day.

 

[Maschine_Man]

So your position is surveys are only legitimate if they poll the entire population?

Are the polls that show Hilary is deeply unpopular also biased?

Its really not hard for researchers to skew statistics and polls are an easy way to do that.

I don't trust any polls or surveys unless they post HOW they got those numbers.

just saying the results doesn't mean anything to me. show me how you came up with the results(who you polled, what were the questions, etc.)



and yes, I believe that the poll on Hillary can be biased as well..

 

[Maschine_Man]

you tell me why it's acceptable and then i'll tell you why it isn't.

I'm not saying its acceptable or that it is unacceptable.
I wanted to know your reasoning in to thinking that a person can or cannot say something based on their skin color.

 

[Dad]

I'm not saying its acceptable or that it is unacceptable.
I wanted to know your reasoning in to thinking that a person can or cannot say something based on their skin color.

you can't be serious

 

[thatrapsfan]

What is childish about replying to you point by point on a factual basis?
I showed you links to articles that if you read would show you US government confirming or indirectly notifying that these outposts exist on that map, you are choosing no to read the articles and again that is on you, not me. Here you go again though, try to actually read the article. Tomgram: Nick Turse, America's Empire of African Bases | TomDispatch



Now if you don't want to accept that fine by me, but don't try to claim no one answered your questions when it was addressed in my reply to your intial post.
Now have a good day.

I read the article. I think it stretches the facts to make an exaggerated claim.

Here is AFRICOM's budget and personnel:

Africom has an annual budget of about $300 million and 2,000 employees worldwide — an operation that Senator Carl Levin, a Michigan Democrat who is chairman of the Armed Services Committee, calls “an ‘economy of force’ effort.” By comparison, the military’s Central Command, which oversees Afghanistan and the Middle East, has a yearly budget of about $800 million and 5,000 employees.

Militant Threats Test Pentagon’s Role in Africa

It's also a fact that the only permanent outpost is Djibouti. These facts do not support conclusion that AFRICOM is prelude to an American invasion of the continent. Fine by me if you dont agree either.

 

[Maschine_Man]

you can't be serious

so you don't have anything then?
just going to get outraged for no reason?

surely you must have a reason outside of sensitivity.

 

[Dad]

so you don't have anything then?
just going to get outraged for no reason?

surely you must have a reason outside of sensitivity.

i'm black, that's all the reason i need

 

[David_TheMan]

I read the article. I think it stretches the facts to make an exaggerated claim.

Here is AFRICOM's budget and personnel:

Africom has an annual budget of about $300 million and 2,000 employees worldwide — an operation that Senator Carl Levin, a Michigan Democrat who is chairman of the Armed Services Committee, calls “an ‘economy of force’ effort.” By comparison, the military’s Central Command, which oversees Afghanistan and the Middle East, has a yearly budget of about $800 million and 5,000 employees.

Militant Threats Test Pentagon’s Role in Africa

It's also a fact that the only permanent outpost is Djibouti. These facts do not support conclusion that AFRICOM is prelude to an American invasion of the continent. Fine by me if you dont agree either.

And again I don't think the US's presence in Africa is an exaggerated claim and I posted an graph and article detailing the graph as to why.
The only publicly acknowledged base is Dijbouti, again this isn't in dispute, the publicly acknowledged part, that said too much info was posted in this thread detailing US outposts in Africa that you initially denied existed but after I showed you the map and then had to actually show you the article with the map that had the US confirming the presence of these outposts, now you have gone to only talking about publicly confirmed bases on the continent.

It is what it is though and we can agree to disagree.

 

[Maschine_Man]

i'm black, that's all the reason i need

lol, and that's great...... so do you believe in censoring ppl because you feel uncomfortable with what they say?