These women on FOX are evil

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Sure.... let's analyze this!
First of all your image screengrab is wrong!

6 Million jews did not die during the holocaust, they originally said it was 6 million, since then they have reduced the number.
And not only that, the number was officially reduced, so official that they even changed the tombstone in Auschwitz to 1.5Mil.

auschwitz-birkenau-state.jpg



You know why people believe 6 million?
Because they don't realize how many people 6 million really is!

That's the amount that died in Auschwitz only. Seriously, did you graduate high school?

Your points are stupid!

That's not a valid counter-argument. Are you really male? I am picturing myself debating the ditz in your avatar.
 
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Israeli's will have the right to travel to whatever part of the new Palestinian state that they want in a new state because it will be occupied by Israel and therefore under Israeli protection.

I've never heard of this. Do you have a credible source that the final offer made to Palestinians included Israelis being allowed to travel to any area of a new Palestinian state without Palestinian permission?

Area C holds most of the natural resources and open spaces and that constitutes a massive theft against the Palestinian people. Even in a scenario where Area C is given to Israel, the Palestinian state would be totally disconnected and carved up.

I never said Area C was not offered or would not be offered to the Palestinians.... Some parts of it definitely would be. NY is disconnected too. There are bridges from one borough to the next.

As far as JEWISH ONLY highways, they DO exist. Only JEWISH SETTLERS live in the West Bank with Israeli citizenship, so de facto, they are Jewish Only highways.

Israeli Arabs travel back and forth to the West Bank all the time http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3970752,00.html

There are no roads that Israeli Arabs are not allowed to use.

http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2010710389_apmlisraelpalestinianscorrective.html

..... How do you justify calling a highway "Jewish-only" when non-Jews are allowed to use it too?

You're the one that wants an extension of hostilities.

Please point me to the part of my post where I indicated I prefer hostilities over peace.

You actually do not think any deal will satisfy your blood lust short of a full evacuation of Arabs from the region.

This is emotional rhetoric and has no place in logical discourse.

I will tell you again so you understand this concept, the further Israel goes away from its own laws and accepted international norms, the more it becomes a Pariah. Israel's greatest claim is that it pro-ports to be an inclusive liberal democracy. Now that we see obviously this facade is cracking with the occupation reaching critical mass in Gaza

Except that Gaza is occupied.

the sterilization of Ethiopian Jews

Which never happened.

with the massive camps in the Negev

No clue what you're talking about...

, and the demolition of Bedouin homes in the Negev

Jewish homes built without a permit are also demolished.

The Palestinians in the West Bank have followed to a tee Israel's instructions and the instructions of the international community. They even went to the U.N. to achieve statehood.

The fact that you put these two sentences one after the other shows you really have no idea what you're talking about... Unless you were going for the irony angle?

In 2014, Israel has protests where people en masse chant death to all Arabs, and sterilizes Jewish blacks because of their race, while it's parliamentary leaders call for mass expulsions and ethnic cleansing. If this to you seems like a course conducive to sustaining liberal democracy then I don't know what to say.

You went full retard.

Let's break down your points one by one

1) Some Israeli people said crazy things during protests, that works against Israel's claims as a democracy

2) Less than 1% of Israel's government said un-democratic things, this works against Israel's claim as a democracy.

3) Language miscommunication between Ethiopians and Israelis resulted in Ethiopians taking birth control, therefore Israelis sterilized (which is permanent) Ethiopians. And because of their race, no less.

4) Palestinians in the West Bank followed all of Israel's instructions, even though the PA continues to glorify terrorism, brainwash children to hate Jews, brainwash children to hate Israel, brainwash children that all of Israel is "Palestine," went to the UN, refused to negotiate, and never dismantled Fatah's terrorist organization.

5) I do not believe peace is possible therefore I don't want peace (using this logic, as much as I want the Knicks to win the championship next year, I do not according to you, simply because I know they won't).

6) Jewish only highways exist even though non-Jewish Arabs may use them :ohlawd:


Breh, none of these logical thought processes make any sense.
 

Broke Wave

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I've never heard of this. Do you have a credible source that the final offer made to Palestinians included Israelis being allowed to travel to any area of a new Palestinian state without Palestinian permission?



I never said Area C was not offered or would not be offered to the Palestinians.... Some parts of it definitely would be. NY is disconnected too. There are bridges from one borough to the next.



Israeli Arabs travel back and forth to the West Bank all the time http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3970752,00.html

There are no roads that Israeli Arabs are not allowed to use.

http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2010710389_apmlisraelpalestinianscorrective.html

..... How do you justify calling a highway "Jewish-only" when non-Jews are allowed to use it too?



Please point me to the part of my post where I indicated I prefer hostilities over peace.



This is emotional rhetoric and has no place in logical discourse.



Except that Gaza is occupied.



Which never happened.



No clue what you're talking about...



Jewish homes built without a permit are also demolished.



The fact that you put these two sentences one after the other shows you really have no idea what you're talking about... Unless you were going for the irony angle?



You went full retard.

Let's break down your points one by one

1) Some Israeli people said crazy things during protests, that works against Israel's claims as a democracy

2) Less than 1% of Israel's government said un-democratic things, this works against Israel's claim as a democracy.

3) Language miscommunication between Ethiopians and Israelis resulted in Ethiopians taking birth control, therefore Israelis sterilized (which is permanent) Ethiopians. And because of their race, no less.

4) Palestinians in the West Bank followed all of Israel's instructions, even though the PA continues to glorify terrorism, brainwash children to hate Jews, brainwash children to hate Israel, brainwash children that all of Israel is "Palestine," went to the UN, refused to negotiate, and never dismantled Fatah's terrorist organization.

5) I do not believe peace is possible therefore I don't want peace (using this logic, as much as I want the Knicks to win the championship next year, I do not according to you, simply because I know they won't).

6) Jewish only highways exist even though non-Jewish Arabs may use them :ohlawd:


Breh, none of these logical thought processes make any sense.


Well there are a lot of things you don't know so let me give you some links to click. Also, I thought we were having a civil discussion? How am I going full retard? :dahell:

Anyway, sterilization http://www.haaretz.com/news/nationa...re-given-birth-control-shots.premium-1.496519
http://www.salon.com/2013/01/28/isr...sh_immigrants_were_given_birth_control_shots/

Those are Ethiopian Jews/Beta Israel. Your people being sterilized by Israel. The onus is on YOU to prove that it was a language issue. I just reported the facts.

With regards to Area C being offered, I will say again, I am going off the parameters set by the offers by previous Israeli governments. You're going off your own predictions on the future.

When you said "there will never be peace" You are indicating that instead of going to a peace process which you think is futile, you want hostilities. It's simple logic.

As far as Jewish only highways, once again I will explain that they are de facto Jewish only. http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4353235,00.html

In Hebron and other places where there are settlements, the private developers do not give settlements to Israeli Arabs. Every single settler is Jewish. There are highways that cross through and separate Palestinian villages. If a bar in the south during segregation has a sign that says whites only, it is de facto whites only. Black people could have tried to go in the bar, and it would be up to the discretion of owner. So legally anyone can sit there and eat but de facto it is a white only bar. If 100% of the usage of a highway is Jewish, and the one thing separating Palestinians from using the highway is their religion, then obviously it's not a false characterization to say that it is a Jewish only highway. Finally, Israeli Arabs do not have access to the places that settlers do and therefore do not have access to some roads that are exclusively used by settlers.

Giant camps in the Negev http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saharonim_Prison that was easy...

As far as the PA following the world and Israeli instruction, your point is actually total non-sequitor. I have never heard any deal that entailed the Palestinians change their school curriculum and culture. That is moving the goal post. You cannot quantify how much somebody "hates" you and just be paranoid on that. There are endless videos of Isreali's saying even more hateful things yet somehow this isn't some kind of pre condition for peace. The fact remains that the PA is following to the letter exactly what Israel wants and the rest of the world wants.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Office_for_the_Coordination_of_Humanitarian_Affairs Isreali citizens are allowed freedom of movement in all but 18% of the entire West Bank. I'm wondering how that would change under a state deal. You still haven't given a rational solution to the problem therefore I can only conclude you like the status quo :manny: And since the status quo entails this violence on both sides... :manny:
 
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Well there are a lot of things you don't know so let me give you some links to click. Also, I thought we were having a civil discussion? How am I going full retard? :dahell:

I said you went full retard. Meaning, you are not in fact a retard. You're still calling roads that both Jewish and Arab Israelis can drive on "Jewish only roads."

Anyway, sterilization http://www.haaretz.com/news/nationa...re-given-birth-control-shots.premium-1.496519
http://www.salon.com/2013/01/28/isr...sh_immigrants_were_given_birth_control_shots/

Those are Ethiopian Jews/Beta Israel. Your people being sterilized by Israel. The onus is on YOU to prove that it was a language issue. I just reported the facts.

No, you did not report facts.

1) Sterilization is permanent. Israel is alleged to have coerced Ethiopians to take birth control.

2) You claimed that it was "because they're black" - this is not a fact. .

3) Israel's health ministry suggested there were language barriers which caused this. You're suggesting otherwise. The burden of proof is on you. Obviously, as you know, it is impossible for me to prove that there was NOT a language issue.

With regards to Area C being offered, I will say again, I am going off the parameters set by the offers by previous Israeli governments. You're going off your own predictions on the future.

I've never heard of this. Do you have a credible source that the final offer made to Palestinians included Israelis being allowed to travel to any area of a new Palestinian state without Palestinian permission?

When you said "there will never be peace" You are indicating that instead of going to a peace process which you think is futile, you want hostilities. It's simple logic.

That is bad logic. I would like to see a long peace process which involved de-radicalization of Palestinian youth to ensure the fidelity of the peace process. Knowing this will never happen does not mean I want hostilities.

As far as Jewish only highways, once again I will explain that they are de facto Jewish only. http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4353235,00.html

In Hebron and other places where there are settlements, the private developers do not give settlements to Israeli Arabs. Every single settler is Jewish. There are highways that cross through and separate Palestinian villages. If a bar in the south during segregation has a sign that says whites only, it is de facto whites only. Black people could have tried to go in the bar, and it would be up to the discretion of owner. So legally anyone can sit there and eat but de facto it is a white only bar. If 100% of the usage of a highway is Jewish, and the one thing separating Palestinians from using the highway is their religion, then obviously it's not a false characterization to say that it is a Jewish only highway. Finally, Israeli Arabs do not have access to the places that settlers do and therefore do not have access to some roads that are exclusively used by settlers.

All of which are of course incorrect.

It is not their religion that separates them, it is their citizenship. Does Israel or the PA issue their passports? The PA.

If a sign in the South said "Whites only" that is an indicator that the owner did not want Blacks in there. It was not "de-facto" Whites only. Horrible analogy, as that is race-based and not citizenship-based.

Can Israeli Arabs use the highways? Yes, absolutely. Do they? Yes, absolutely.

Giant camps in the Negev http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saharonim_Prison that was easy...

My bad, you threw me off with the word "camp." Yes, there is a prison in the Negev. I don't see a problem.

As far as the PA following the world and Israeli instruction, your point is actually total non-sequitor. I have never heard any deal that entailed the Palestinians change their school curriculum and culture. That is moving the goal post. You cannot quantify how much somebody "hates" you and just be paranoid on that. There are endless videos of Isreali's saying even more hateful things yet somehow this isn't some kind of pre condition for peace. The fact remains that the PA is following to the letter exactly what Israel wants and the rest of the world wants.

It was not requested on paper, but Israel has asked on several occasions to stop the hate mongering and demagoguery. You cannot say Palestinians have followed all Israeli instructions when they fail the easiest one: Stop loving terrorism. And you're right, you cannot quantify how much someone hates you. You can quantify the amount of:

1) Schools named after terrorists

2) Roads named after terrorists

3) Music videos glorifying Jihad on TV

4) Summer camps named after terrorists

5) Children's shows teaching them that all of Israel belong to them

6) Money given to families of terrorists

etc etc.

Any videos of Israelis saying bad things are irrelevant, because there are no government sponsored programs encouraging Israelis to kill innocents.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Office_for_the_Coordination_of_Humanitarian_Affairs Isreali citizens are allowed freedom of movement in all but 18% of the entire West Bank. I'm wondering how that would change under a state deal.

... Where in the Oslo accords or under any kind of deal did you see that it would remain this way?

You still haven't given a rational solution to the problem therefore I can only conclude you like the status quo :manny: And since the status quo entails this violence on both sides... :manny:


Well.... Let's apply simple logic

Status quo = Violence on both sides

Lack of Palestinian deradicalization = Lack of Palestinian citizens implementing peace deal

Lack of implementation of peace deal = status quo

Hence, any peace deal without Palestinian deradicalization = status quo

Why do you want to maintain the status quo through a peace deal, breh?

Obviously, my way would end the status quo. Unfortunately, many others wouldn't be on board with it.
 

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I said you went full retard. Meaning, you are not in fact a retard. You're still calling roads that both Jewish and Arab Israelis can drive on "Jewish only roads."



No, you did not report facts.

1) Sterilization is permanent. Israel is alleged to have coerced Ethiopians to take birth control.

2) You claimed that it was "because they're black" - this is not a fact. .

3) Israel's health ministry suggested there were language barriers which caused this. You're suggesting otherwise. The burden of proof is on you. Obviously, as you know, it is impossible for me to prove that there was NOT a language issue.



I've never heard of this. Do you have a credible source that the final offer made to Palestinians included Israelis being allowed to travel to any area of a new Palestinian state without Palestinian permission?



That is bad logic. I would like to see a long peace process which involved de-radicalization of Palestinian youth to ensure the fidelity of the peace process. Knowing this will never happen does not mean I want hostilities.



All of which are of course incorrect.

It is not their religion that separates them, it is their citizenship. Does Israel or the PA issue their passports? The PA.

If a sign in the South said "Whites only" that is an indicator that the owner did not want Blacks in there. It was not "de-facto" Whites only. Horrible analogy, as that is race-based and not citizenship-based.

Can Israeli Arabs use the highways? Yes, absolutely. Do they? Yes, absolutely.



My bad, you threw me off with the word "camp." Yes, there is a prison in the Negev. I don't see a problem.



It was not requested on paper, but Israel has asked on several occasions to stop the hate mongering and demagoguery. You cannot say Palestinians have followed all Israeli instructions when they fail the easiest one: Stop loving terrorism. And you're right, you cannot quantify how much someone hates you. You can quantify the amount of:

1) Schools named after terrorists

2) Roads named after terrorists

3) Music videos glorifying Jihad on TV

4) Summer camps named after terrorists

5) Children's shows teaching them that all of Israel belong to them

6) Money given to families of terrorists

etc etc.

Any videos of Israelis saying bad things are irrelevant, because there are no government sponsored programs encouraging Israelis to kill innocents.



... Where in the Oslo accords or under any kind of deal did you see that it would remain this way?




Well.... Let's apply simple logic

Status quo = Violence on both sides

Lack of Palestinian deradicalization = Lack of Palestinian citizens implementing peace deal

Lack of implementation of peace deal = status quo

Hence, any peace deal without Palestinian deradicalization = status quo

Why do you want to maintain the status quo through a peace deal, breh?

Obviously, my way would end the status quo. Unfortunately, many others wouldn't be on board with it.

How can you talk about deradicalization (whatever that entails) and stopping violence when even during times of so-called "peace" Palestinians suffer under horrible conditions imposed by Israel?

These are the conditions that Palestinians are forced by Israel to live under.

Gaza ’s population continue to face devastating results of the blockade imposed by the Government of Israel. Gazans are deeply suffering with an unemployment rate of 38.5% as of the last quarter of 2013, which is an increase of over 10 percentage points compared to six months earlier , causing widespread poverty. At least 57 % of Gaza households are food insecure and about 80 % are now aid recipients.
Food insecurity and rising poverty also mean that most residents cannot meet their daily caloric requirements, while over 90% of the water in Gaza has been deemed unfit for human consumption.
Palestinian children in Gaza are suffering immensely. A large proportion are affected by the man-made malnourishment regime caused by the Israeli imposed blockage. Prevalence of anemia in children <2yrs in Gaza is at 72.8%, while prevalence of wasting, stunting, underweight have been documented at 34.3%, 31.4%, 31.45% respectively.

You can't begin to talk about peace if the discussion can't even get around to addressing Israel's brutal occupation of Gaza.
 
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How can you talk about deradicalization (whatever that entails) and stopping violence when even during times of so-called "peace" Palestinians suffer under horrible conditions imposed by Israel?

Imposed by their own selves.

These are the conditions that Palestinians are forced by Israel to live under.





You can't begin to talk about peace if the discussion can't even get around to addressing Israel's brutal occupation of Gaza.

Gaza is going through a blockade of items which can be used for building weapons. Gaza is not even occupied. Israel already ethnically cleansed Jews from Gaza.
 

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Imposed by their own selves.



Gaza is going through a blockade of items which can be used for building weapons. Gaza is not even occupied. Israel already ethnically cleansed Jews from Gaza.

I don't know whether you're completely ignorant of the situation or purposefully misrepresenting its nature to spread an agenda. Either way Israel's human rights violations are unquestionable and the effects of the occupation of Gaza and the blockade are undeniable. It's been reported extensively by every relevant human rights organization, even Israel's major human rights organization B'tselem.
 
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Dirty Mcdrawz

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how do the majority of the threads in the HL devolve into something about Jews?
 
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I don't know whether you're completely ignorant of the situation or purposefully misrepresenting its nature to spread an agenda. Either way Israel's human rights violations are unquestionable and the effects of the occupation of Gaza and the blockade are undeniable. It's been reported extensively by every relevant human rights organization, even Israel's major human rights organization B'tselem.

Claiming Israel has human rights violations is not the same as saying those human rights violations are the core obstacle to peace. Every country in conflict has violated human rights.
 

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Claiming Israel has human rights violations is not the same as saying those human rights violations are the core obstacle to peace.

And I never said that was the case. If the blockade is lifted and Israel quits its brutal siege of Gaza then you have a serious chance for peace. But if you ignore that crucial aspect of the conflict then all talks about peace are worthless.
 
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And I never said that was the case. If the blockade is lifted and Israel quits its brutal siege of Gaza then you have a serious chance for peace. But if you ignore that crucial aspect of the conflict then all talks about peace are worthless.

If the blockade is lifted Hamas gets free access to weapons, making peace less likely. Palestinians may import and export whatever they wish (non-military items) through Egypt.

There is no reason to want Israel to lift the blockade unless you secretly want to see Jewish corpses.
 

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If the blockade is lifted Hamas gets free access to weapons, making peace less likely. Palestinians may import and export whatever they wish (non-military items) through Egypt.

There is no reason to want Israel to lift the blockade unless you secretly want to see Jewish corpses.

If Israel ends its criminal siege and puts a stop to its programs that force Palestinians to live under conditions that barely permit survival, then Israel would be stopping its crimes in Gaza, and that would end the rocketing they're concerned with. When these conditions are lifted then you can talk about peace. Even before this latest conflict Gazans were fighting for survival. The conditions are so bad that many have expressed they would rather die in the fighting than go back to their situation before the war.

Still, Hamas had observed the previous ceasefire before this latest escalation of violence for over a year and a half (as Israel concedes) while still under the crippling conditions.

Hamas leaders have stated a number of times that Hamas would agree to a two-state settlement in accord with the international consensus that has been blocked by Israel and the U.S. for a few decades now.

And no, Palestinians can't import and export whatever non-military items they wish through Egypt. That's false. You may want to familiarize yourself with the situation in Gaza first, because you're ignorant of important details.
 
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You were doing alright up until you started (knowingly) posting nonsense.

If Israel ends its criminal siege

This implies that a blockade is illegal... It isn't

and puts a stop to its programs that force Palestinians to live under conditions that barely permit survival

:laff: Palestinians are healthier than their Arab neighbors by every quantifiable measure. Longer lifespan, lower infant mortality rates, higher life expectancy. This is hysterical hyperbolic bullshyt and you know it.

then Israel would be stopping its crimes in Gaza, and that would end the rocketing they're concerned with.

Except that it wouldn't, and you know that.

When these conditions are lifted then you can talk about peace.

You're the one who brought up peace.

Still, Hamas had observed the previous ceasefire before this latest escalation of violence for over a year and a half (as Israel concedes)

If by "observing the ceasefire" you mean allowing other terrorist organizations to shoot rockets into Israel, and openly encouraging it you are right. :shaq:

Hamas leaders have stated a number of times that Hamas would agree to a two-state settlement in accord with the international consensus that has been blocked by Israel and the U.S. for a few decades now.

Name a single time Hamas has said this to an Arabic speaking audience

And no, Palestinians can't import and export whatever non-military items they wish through Egypt. That's false. You may want to familiarize yourself with the situation in Gaza first, because you're ignorant of important details.

How do you think Hamas obtained material for their weapons? Through Israel?
 
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