Tupac Shakur - "Changes" - Let's Talk About This Timeless Piece

[HendriX]

I Wonder if Heaven Gotta Ghetto >>>> Changes

Just my opinion.

MUCH better

Here on Earth, tell me what's a black life worth
A bottle of juice is no excuse, the truth hurts
And even when you take the shyt
Move counties get a lawyer you can shake the shyt
Ask Rodney, LaTasha, and many more
It's been goin on for years, there's plenty more
When they ask me, when will the violence cease?
When your troops stop shootin nikkas down in the street
nikkas had enough time to make a difference
Bear witness, own our own business
Word to God cause it's hard tryin to make ends meet
First we couldn't afford shyt now everything's free
So we loot, please don't shoot when you see
I'm takin from them, cause for years they would take it from me
Now the tables have turned around
You didn't listen, until the nikkas burned it down
And now Bush can't stop the hit
Predicted the shyt, in 2Pacalypse
And for once I was down with nikkas, felt good
In the hood bein around the nikkas, yeah
And for the first time everybody let go
And the streets is death row, I wonder if heaven got a ghetto

 

[James Carter]

Changes? Dont you mean I Wonder if Heaven got a Ghetto?


2Pac - I Wonder If Heaven Got A Ghetto - YouTube

i came in here to post this. The message on this song was and still is to the black community.

"Now bush cant stop the hits/we predicted this shyt, the 2pacalypse"

 

[Mac Casper]

the censored version breh?

Don't sleep on those censored versions, I don't know about the re-releases and remasters but Tupac usually recorded complete alternate takes for the censored albums. He once even stopped a kid on his movie set to explain to the kid how much extra work he puts in on the censored versions

 

[H.J.Duck]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kdcbaiv2y4[/ame]

 

[KEEPITTRILLA]

I'm a huge Pac stan for real but I think this song is overrated, he got a lot better songs in his catalog

 

[Mac Casper]

I'm a huge Pac stan for real but I think this song is overrated, he got a lot better songs in his catalog

Wait another 10 years

..this was the typical first impression for Tupac's biggest fans

 

[Still Benefited]

Now don't get me wrong, I agree with what you say and this isn't as much as an argument, but I don't think that the bold is mutually exclusive...the way that you put words together does affect the complexity of your lyrics in a sense. How you use literary devices and to what extent you use them does affect just how easy it is to really decipher what you're saying.

But like I said, I agree with you. Classic music has been made regardless of the level of lyricism. It's more or less how they managed to get their point across along with what they were talking about that made them great.

True,sum rappers put they words together to make technically masterful bars....but at the end of the day once you've listened to it enuff and the technical impressiveness of it wears off there's nuthing there.....with the dudes I mentioned as being "wordsmiths" the way they put they words together make people feel it whether it be deep,funny,real or just rawer than the next persons.

Whoever said Prodigy wuz a good example,I still don't get people saying he's great lyrically from a technical aspect....but I can't deny the way he put his words together his bars came out hard and just raw...alotta lyricist can't do that nd that's why alotta "lyricist" sound blah blah blah/borin to a lot of people...Jay and Nas are examples of lyricist who have combined the two well throughout they career.

Its the reason I said u can't compare Ross to Biggie,Ross is just nice technically but its a reason Biggies bars is sum of the most quoted of all time and ross has very few quotables with more material....and I say that believing Biggie is overated lyrically on the technical side....he's not better than a prime Mase or Fabolous but had a great delivery,and had a way of puttin words together to make his shyt just sound more raw...Pac had that too,Cube,ChuckD,Rakim etc imo....I see what u sayin tho


@blackslash props on that bruh

 

[BlackZilla]

True,sum rappers put they words together to make technically masterful bars....but at the end of the day once you've listened to it enuff and the technical impressiveness of it wears off there's nuthing there.....with the dudes I mentioned as being "wordsmiths" the way they put they words together make people feel it whether it be deep,funny,real or just rawer than the next persons.

True, true...especially the bolded...that's how I feel about some of Canibus's stuff.

As opposed to "That buck that bought a bottle could've struck the lotto" off of Life's a bytch being one hell of a quotable because of the point it made ("Instead of buying that alcohol, I could've taken a shot at the lottery and win something")

And of course Biggie and Pac have numerous quotables mainly because of how they were put together and delivered. So this is a good point here, and I agree.

Whoever said Prodigy wuz a good example,I still don't get people saying he's great lyrically from a technical aspect....but I can't deny the way he put his words together his bars came out hard and just raw...alotta lyricist can't do that nd that's why alotta "lyricist" sound blah blah blah/borin to a lot of people...Jay and Nas are examples of lyricist who have combined the two well throughout they career.

Well I mentioned Prodigy, but not because he was great technically (I actually think the opposite), bug because of the bolded. He really came off as a grimy street dude.

"Run for your life, or you can get your heat whatever, we can die together,
As long as I send your maggot ass to the essence...I don't give a fukk about my presence."

That looks simple on paper but the way Prodigy delivered it was great, always sends chills up my spine when I hear it lol.

Its the reason I said u can't compare Ross to Biggie,Ross is just nice technically but its a reason Biggies bars is sum of the most quoted of all time and ross has very few quotables with more material....and I say that believing Biggie is overated lyrically on the technical side....he's not better than a prime Mase or Fabolous but had a great delivery,and had a way of puttin words together to make his shyt just sound more raw...Pac had that too,Cube,ChuckD,Rakim etc imo....I see what u sayin tho

I can agree with this....I guess delivery is indeed a critical aspect of rapping....it can make or break a record.

 

[jadillac]

MUCH better

Here on Earth, tell me what's a black life worth
A bottle of juice is no excuse, the truth hurts
And even when you take the shyt
Move counties get a lawyer you can shake the shyt
Ask Rodney, LaTasha, and many more
It's been goin on for years, there's plenty more
When they ask me, when will the violence cease?
When your troops stop shootin nikkas down in the street
nikkas had enough time to make a difference
Bear witness, own our own business
Word to God cause it's hard tryin to make ends meet
First we couldn't afford shyt now everything's free
So we loot, please don't shoot when you see
I'm takin from them, cause for years they would take it from me
Now the tables have turned around
You didn't listen, until the nikkas burned it down
And now Bush can't stop the hit
Predicted the shyt, in 2Pacalypse
And for once I was down with nikkas, felt good
In the hood bein around the nikkas, yeah
And for the first time everybody let go
And the streets is death row, I wonder if heaven got a ghetto

That's one of my favorite verses

His raps read like story poems. No wasted words or useless slang.

A 50 year old white person with no knowledge of rap can appreciate such.

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

I don't know when the term "lyricism" was mis-converted (in hip-hop) into this one-track mindset of being soley 'x-figurative language'... but its far from reality. shyt is well beyond tired and false when folk say pac wasn't a GREAT lyricist or worse... not a lyricist at all.

 

[Still Benefited]

True, true...especially the bolded...that's how I feel about some of Canibus's stuff.

As opposed to "That buck that bought a bottle could've struck the lotto" off of Life's a bytch being one hell of a quotable because of the point it made ("Instead of buying that alcohol, I could've taken a shot at the lottery and win something")

And of course Biggie and Pac have numerous quotables mainly because of how they were put together and delivered. So this is a good point here, and I agree.




Well I mentioned Prodigy, but not because he was great technically (I actually think the opposite), bug because of the bolded. He really came off as a grimy street dude.

"Run for your life, or you can get your heat whatever, we can die together,
As long as I send your maggot ass to the essence...I don't give a fukk about my presence."

That looks simple on paper but the way Prodigy delivered it was great, always sends chills up my spine when I hear it lol.



I can agree with this....I guess delivery is indeed a critical aspect of rapping....it can make or break a record.

Yeah that's why I thought Prodigy wuz a great example from u,I've seen for years put him up there with prime Nas,Jay and I never understood it when u think lyrical from the technical aspect far as multis and wordplay nikkas usually are talkin about...but it seems they dig him so much for the same reasons I dig Pac so much as a rhymer,they just said raw,hard shyt,and make u go ....I don't know if fans will ever be able to agree on what lyricism truly is...I think every rap fan should appreciate a good lyrical technical display but I don't think that rapper should be held in any higher regard than sumbody who's not as nice technically but can bring a powerful verse to the table.....end of the day I say catalogue says it all,how many classic songs u got,verses u got

 

[Lewis Black]

95-96 Prodigy was only second to tupac in terms of best delivery imo

 

[BlackZilla]

Yeah that's why I thought Prodigy wuz a great example from u,I've seen for years put him up there with prime Nas,Jay and I never understood it when u think lyrical from the technical aspect far as multis and wordplay nikkas usually are talkin about...but it seems they dig him so much for the same reasons I dig Pac so much as a rhymer,they just said raw,hard shyt,and make u go

Yup. Prodigy was actually one of my fav MCs for that reason.

My first exposure to him was actually when he joined G-Unit . I didn't reall know about Mobb Deep then (I got into rap a couple years ago) So at first I thought he was whack. But then I came across The Infamous...and I was blown away.

There was something about him, his overall cadence and presence on the mic that made him stand out to me. From The Infamous, Hell On Earth, Murda Muzik and all of the unreleased stuff I heard made Prodigy grow on me, because he wasn't overly complex or anything, he just had a way of putting words together and coming cold and hardcore. I loved it.

In terms of being nice overall, I would probably put him up there...a few notches below Jay and Nas in their prime. Lyrically he isn't seeing them, but his delivery and cadence makes up for his somewhat simpler rhymes big time, IMO.

....I don't know if fans will ever be able to agree on what lyricism truly is...I think every rap fan should appreciate a good lyrical technical display but I don't think that rapper should be held in any higher regard than sumbody who's not as nice technically but can bring a powerful verse to the table.....end of the day I say catalogue says it all,how many classic songs u got,verses u got

Well it all comes down to the bolded, how good is your catalog and how many classic verses/features do you have, at the end of the day.

It's funny though, early on after getting into rap I would've more gone for the super lyrical rappers, but then soon I learned that the a lot of the MCs that I like aren't that lyrical, but have great delivery/flow/energy, like Ice Cube (Angry Ice Cube), Prodigy, Tupac, Chuck D and so on.

As far as lyricism goes, that has more to do with prose, or the words that you actually use in your rhymes. The thing is that seeing that rap is music, you can make up for simple rhymes with some measure of a unique cadence, flow or delivery and charisma and still be a good rapper.

The issue isn't really what lyricsm is...but it's more about what makes a good rapper (Should he be lyrical? Or could he get away with having simpler rhymes by being charismatic and having a good delivery?) and in my opinion you could be either one, as long as you're able to make good music using the tools that you have....

...because the reality is, there are classic records from lyrical and not so lyrical rappers alike, and there are also trash records from lyrical and not to lyrical rappers too.

 

[Dead End]

I agree with threadstarter.

 

[ArchStanton]

Don't sleep on those censored versions, I don't know about the re-releases and remasters but Tupac usually recorded complete alternate takes for the censored albums. He once even stopped a kid on his movie set to explain to the kid how much extra work he puts in on the censored versions

Wait a second- are you saying his albums weren't all backmasked? I know he was the master at putting a lot of work on singles- How Do U Want It, Live and Die in LA, and I Ain't Mad at Cha come to mind, but did he do this on albums too?