Bron Ball: The worst offense of all time?

[360Waves]

This is a nonsensical way of looking at it because if it wasn't GS coming out of the West, it would be another team - another team that would beat the Cavs. In fact, past the fact of the Warriors' misfortunes (after going up 3-1) with injuries to Iggy and Bogut, Curry's deteriorating state, and Draymond's suspension where they would've won had all things been equal, the Thunder would've beaten the Cavs in the '16 Finals. Pretty much all of those Finals trips would've resulted in losses for LeBron/Cavs if the Warriors didn't exist.

Where are you getting this notion of "respect", LeBron and his teams have run through the East due to the lack of competition, do you think they're going to four straight Finals appearances in the West? Of course, not.

Second of all, it seems to be YOU who's popped too many Ritalin, your initial claim was:

"If you take the Warriors out of the equation, "Bron Ball" would have 5-6 rings"

Now how the fukk is 5-6 rings possible when now you're saying you're talking about his second-stint - "that one that has berthed 4 straight Finals trips", after we're working on the stipulation that the Miami Big Three were out of the equation.

You can't even get your own argument right.



Would he make it "8 straight years" in the West? If your answer is no, then why are you hanging your hat on Finals appearances as if they're the scale of how successful a "system" is? Like I said above, LeBron and his teams have had success in the East, because the lack of competition, the luck they've had, and how dominant of a player he is (in comparison to his peers) - not because of the system.

Because there is no system.

So your argument is essentially “you have no way of proving he would’ve won the titles against anyone other than the Warriors” but “IM positive he would’ve lost them because I’m @Gil Scott-Heroin and whatever I say goes.”

Also LOLing at the blatant dishonesty as you lold earlier at the notion of Kyrie/Love being hurt in 2015–two all stars and their teams LITERAL second and third options—being a factor, but continue to hold onto Andrew “3pts/3rpg didn’t even play 4th quarters” Bogut being hurt, Iggy being slight hobbled, and Draymond being suspended for all of ONE game as the reasons the Dubs lost in 16. nikkas had 3 chances to win and failed nikka shyt the fukk up.

As if the Dubs themselves have not greatly benefited from injuries for all 4 years of their title run, on TOP of the West being overrated and fairly weak itself. But let me guess since you’re @Gil Scott-Heroin you have a crystal ball that makes you positive they would’ve won all those tainted series regardless right?

This is the problem with you. You’re so arrogant that you consistently fail to notice that your entire argument is contradictory. Literally every single reason you’ve used to discredit Brons 8 straight can be flipped on it’s head to discredit the Warriors. Here we are again in 2018 and yet ANOTHER major injury was suffered to the only team to have them on the ropes this post season, but of course you’re going to tell me that’s not a factor. Or even better, try to equate Iggy being out to a vital starter going out against an ex-73 win team with KD. Because you’re @Gil Scott-Heroin and since whatever you say goes injuries and bad luck are only factors when they happen to the Warriors and not the other way around.

You’re so fukking stupid and hypocritical it’s overwhelming and you’re trying to call me corny but you literally last sleep last night quadruple posting in here tryna defend your boyfriend Steph

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

The fact you deviated from your initial argument, completely, and built a wall of ad hominem leads me to believe you know you're full of shyt, but are too stuck in your ways to admit fault.

 

[360Waves]

The fact you deviated from your initial argument, completely, and built a wall of ad hominem leads me to believe you know you're full of shyt, but are too stuck in your ways to admit fault.

I made my original statement then I opted to build my talking points on pointing out your hypocrisy because your entire post was laced with it, thus making it structurally weak. That’s how debate works, you can either prove your point or destroy theirs. Mr. “If I say something it’s an absolute but for anyone else it’s hypothetical.” Mr “Injures and bad luck are only ever factors when they happen to the Warriors.”

We should be discussing why, for the upteempth time you’ve seen a post you couldn’t respond to and decided to deviate away from the discussion entirely and resort back to your childish “I’m right you’re wrong because I say so” bullshyt. You were too p*ssy to even quote me because you ain’t want no more smoke

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

I made my original statement then I opted to build my talking points on pointing out your hypocrisy

I'm going to stop you right there, the only one who's knee-deep in hypocrisy is YOU.

You were the one who made a claim, if we were to take the Warriors out of the equation, "Bron Ball" would have 5-6 rings, now you can't work on that hypothetical for obvious reasons (see: Chaos theory), but the larger issue here is that, when I flipped that around and used your own argument against you, by giving you a scenario with the same parameters - "Take the Heat Big Three out of the equation, and how many rings would "Bron Ball" likely have?"; you replied by saying it's "literally the stupidest argument on Earth because you could say this for just about any championship team."

Not realizing that argument is YOUR argument.

It's painfully obvious you're drowning here because all that other shyt you're leaking is only to deflect from that very point.

 

[Mantis Toboggan M.D.]

To say that Curry is UNEQUIVOCALLY better than harden is hyperbole

Have you watched Har_en in the postseason? Since joining the rockets he shoots 41% from the field, 32.6% from deep, and averaged 4.5 turnovers per game in the playoffs. The only two pressure games I can recall him showing up for in his entire playoff career were game 5 of the 2012 finals and game 5 of the 2015 semifinals.

 

[Lord_Chief_Rocka]

“Bron Ball” has 3 rings, more than any other team since 2010. Literally no one saw the Warriors coming, especially the KD move. You take them out of the equation and “Bron Ball” probably has 5-6 rings. NBA fans are the most hyperbolic fukk wits in all of sports

Those heat teams didn’t play Bron ball though

 

[THE MACHINE]

Those heat teams didn’t play Bron ball though

When did it start? People claim "Bron Ball" hurt Bosh during Miami by forcing him out of the post to the 3 point line.

 

[Lord_Chief_Rocka]

When did it start? People claim "Bron Ball" hurt Bosh during Miami by forcing him out of the post to the 3 point line.

Good point but it seemed he played a lot more off the ball in Mia

 

[CEITEDMOFO]

d antoni offense the worst

NOT THAT BAD THEY ACTUALLY ALMOST BEAT THE WARRIORS IF CP3 AINT GO DOWN THEY WOULD HAVE A GOOD CHANCE

 

[Tookalossfellbackcameback]

When did it start? People claim "Bron Ball" hurt Bosh during Miami by forcing him out of the post to the 3 point line.

Basically, when the Heatles struggled out the gate that first year Wade fell back and the offense became Bron-centric. The Heat still relied on great off-ball movement (Wade is one of the best, most instinctive cutters in league history) and Bron was forced to move without the ball. Bosh also played more in the high post/elbow area.

As Wade got flabby and Bron became more of the facilitator, the offense became less about cutting and movement and more Bron-centric...which in turn had Bosh moving more out to the 3 line for spacing purposes.

The final form of Bron Ball didn't manifest until he returned the Cavs. He became THE focal point. He was the de-facto PG, and though Blatt wanted to implement a movement based offense it never happened. Bron won out.

 

[360Waves]

I'm going to stop you right there, the only one who's knee-deep in hypocrisy is YOU.

You were the one who made a claim, if we were to take the Warriors out of the equation, "Bron Ball" would have 5-6 rings, now you can't work on that hypothetical for obvious reasons (see: Chaos theory), but the larger issue here is that, when I flipped that around and used your own argument against you, by giving you a scenario with the same parameters - "Take the Heat Big Three out of the equation, and how many rings would "Bron Ball" likely have?"; you replied by saying it's "literally the stupidest argument on Earth because you could say this for just about any championship team."

Not realizing that argument is YOUR argument.

It's painfully obvious you're drowning here because all that other shyt you're leaking is only to deflect from that very point.

Again what is your argument here? That talent wins rings? No fukking shyt.

The question is whether or not “Bron Ball” is an effective system and it absolutely is because no other system has yielded as much success in the past decade regardless of changes in roster and team talent level. Whether or not it’s good enough to beat a Golden State is irrelevant because at that point the disparity in talent (2015 w the injuries and every year since KD) is too great to make up for any system no matter how good it is. Which is why every year you dikkride Toronto and Boston praying they’ll beat Bron talking about their system and ball movement and every year they come up short, you insufferable twat

 

[THE MACHINE]

Good point but it seemed he played a lot more off the ball in Mia

I think it was just that the league was changing to a 3 point league but the Heat were on TV all the time. So from the '08-'10 Lakers v Celtics which were mid-range and post teams to the '15-'18 Warriors Rockets style of the last few years . The change occurred during the Bron Heat years. Bosh never took over three 3-pointers a game during the Bron Heat years. He shot 3.8 and 4.2 the following years. He would probably be shooting between 5-7 a game if he were still playing. Boogie's big ass is averaging 5.5 threes a game the last 3 years.

Basically, when the Heatles struggled out the gate that first year Wade fell back and the offense became Bron-centric. The Heat still relied on great off-ball movement (Wade is one of the best, most instinctive cutters in league history) and Bron was forced to move without the ball. Bosh also played more in the high post/elbow area.

As Wade got flabby and Bron became more of the facilitator, the offense became less about cutting and movement and more Bron-centric...which in turn had Bosh moving more out to the 3 line for spacing purposes.

The final form of Bron Ball didn't manifest until he returned the Cavs. He became THE focal point. He was the de-facto PG, and though Blatt wanted to implement a movement based offense it never happened. Bron won out.

Non "Bron ball" doesnt beat the Warriors last year. They had no chance in '15 and I dont think it beats the Spurs in '14. I do think if they played non "Bron Ball" Kyrie would still be there (although hurt) so they still lose this year. I dont understand why they just dont move Bron to the point guard full time. The point forward gives him too much control over the ball because a non spot up point guard is useless on the team. If he is moved to the point, you put a true 3 on the floor and he can hit the small forward slashing.

The bolded had me cracking up man.

 

[Remote]

Edit - I’m tired of this

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

Again what is your argument here? That talent wins rings? No fukking shyt.

My argument is that you're an insufferable, hypocritical LeBron stan, and you only furthered my point by admitting your logic was "literally the stupidest argument on Earth". I ain't trying to hear all that other shyt, because I wasn't arguing against it in the first place, nor do I care about your position on it either; you've proven time and time again you're only going to look at this shyt through a certain lens.

 

[malbaker86]

It's frustration, breh.
The man is unbelievably talented. UNBELIEVABLY. On some shyt. And works his fukkin ass off. I got nothing but respect for that

What's frustrating is, he really could have been the GOAT if he just refused to play Bron Ball. He'd have easily gotten himself 7 or 8 chips by now - maybe even more.
Instead, because of his refusal to play any other way, he's stuck with 3 chips at the moment.
And this is the root cause of all the toxic ass arguments back and forth about MJ vs Lebron. MJ delivered on his promise - some would say overdelivered. 6 chips, 6 FMVPs in 2 threepeats.
Bron has at least the same level of individual talent as MJ. Maybe even more. Probably even more, TBH. But he hasn't delivered. He hasn't turned that talent into 6 or more chips.
Had he made different decisions on and off the court (LeCoach, LeGM, etc.), there would have been zero debate.
He'd have enough chips for all the fingers on both hands by the time he was through playing, and nikkas would be that Jordan got passed, but at Bron's greatness.

During his first tenure in Cleveland, which one of those teams would have been able win a title had he played within a system???