Democratic Party Rebuild

[acri1]

Despite some of our Allstars opinion, it seems like people like Barry care after all even though of course it can get better.

That doesn't matter, if you do a poll on Obamacare instead the approval rate would probably be -5.

Same folks going to vote GOP regardless we all know they'll come up with some new dog whistle by election season

 

[Pull Up the Roots]

Of course it played a role. But for some people there is a mental disconnect where the only reason their candidate of choice can lose is because it was rigged against them (sound familiar?).

Im still waiting for someone to explain the transition point where people stop voting for the obviously beneficial progressive policies from the obviously superior progressive candidate because they saw an AIPAC funded ad for the 8th time.

On a national scale progressive policies sound good to some of our neighbors until it’s time to get in the booth and make sure that black kid down the street gets free lunch at school.

Until someone does a deeper dive as to why the obviously superior candidates in these elections keep losing instead of just hitting the jordan shrug and saying aipac, it’s probably gonna keep happening.

I don't think we should downplay the built-in advantages that benefit an establishment candidate. When elections are run through machine politics and most local institutions are still led by establishment figures, their biases are going to tilt toward the inside candidate almost every time.

Once you add outside money and lobbying networks, it becomes even harder for a challenger to break through. They have relationships with local media, party officials, and big donors who can elevate certain narratives while amplifying every perceived misstep from the outsider.

That matters in congressional races where one progressive voice is just a single vote in a sea of establishment loyalists. Someone like Bowman could still be fighting for policies that directly help his district, but if he's not perceived as "winning" those fights fast enough, or if he commits a gaffe that gets looped endlessly, voters start to turn on them. That kind of disillusionment is not always organic. It's often the result of targeted framing and repetition.

We live in a hyper-media environment. Voters aren't sitting down reading policy briefs, they are being fed narratives pushed by trusted figures and institutions. If every signal they get tells them an outsider is "too divisive" or "not getting results," that becomes their reality.

I'm not saying progressives never make mistakes, because they do. Both Bowman and Bush did -- and those errors definitely played a part. But it's the outsized spending and institutional weight behind establishment-backed candidates that makes those mistakes fatal. Without that, they probably would've survived the same bumps any normal politician does.

My point is that outside influence is a serious problem in this country. And it's not just something progressive candidates have to worry about, especially given how legacy media is being consolidated.

 

[Pull Up the Roots]

If I was saying “Free Palestine”, saying black democrats in leadership had low IQ’s and whatever else liberal white woman pontificate, you’d be on my nuts.

But don't tell no lie about me and I won't tell truths 'bout you...

Edit:

Cuz of the numerous outrageous numbers of black on black killings in Chicago and Philly that ppl like u and BLM pretend don't exist, but instead worry bout a guy who isn't even president (Trump) rallies

Why are you defending Trump using the racist "Black on Black crime" trope?


This is a weird thread to make for a person who supposedly cares about Black people.

https://www.thecoli.com/threads/come-in-this-thread-and-be-a-black-keyboard-militant.406473/#post-18075145

Atheists usually are fat miserable glasses wearing cacs or over the top wannabe militant blacks.

You sure do hate those "militant blacks." We're Black people, not "blacks." Your performative act is tired.

 

[King Kreole]

The issue with this stance is that you’re pointing out why they lost instead of pointing to progressive wins.

I’m progressive and I’m also practical about what’s best for the country and black people.

Ok so is losing to Trump by tacking to the right and running Republican-lite campaigns what's best for the country and black people? You guys would have much more of a case if this lukewarm centrist bullshyt was at least producing wins, but it's objectively losing. Obama and Biden incorporated progressives into their campaigns (to varying degrees) and they won. I consider that a progressive win. The theory that y'all are operating under is false. You still think it's the 20th century where politics is a battle of left and right determined by who can win over the moderate middle. In the 21st century (post-GWOT and Financial Crash) politics is a battle of extremism that speaks to the fundamental collapse of our system and the American dream. The middle has been evacuated, there's no voters in there, just lobbyists and donors.

Most progressives have no bend in their politics which is why a lot of them low key like Trump

Yeah Trump doesn't capitulate to useless centrist Republican fossils, which is how he's been able to capture the energy and ride that wave to victory. Progressives are the antidote. Democrats who refuse to learn from Trump's victories will continue losing to him.

 

[wire28]

I know smooth mind likes to echo racist talking points when he’s denigrating her, but jasmine continues to be a key voice in the rebuild

 

[King Kreole]

You choosing to word it that way is an example of what I’m talking about. If Kamala were to “denounce” genocide, it wouldn’t have been enough.

It would have been “she’s only doing it for votes”, “she’s still a puppet for Israel”, “why isn’t she talking about a weapons embargo for Israel?”

As we have seen, nothing short of a Mamdani figure (who again is one wrong word away from being turned on) has been enough for the Bernie contingent of voters.

This is cope. If Kamala came out and said "I denounce the genocide" the vast majority of the protest opposition would obviously have evaporated. But you will always find criticism of power coming from the left, no matter the politician, Bernie or Mamdani or AOC or whoever. That's how leftist politics works, the world is not perfect so you're always pushing for better, it's not a politics of satisfaction. All politicians should be in fear of being turned on for taking bad positions, they work for us! We don't work for them!

 

[RickyGQ]

The issue with this stance is that you’re pointing out why they lost instead of pointing to progressive wins.

I’m progressive and I’m also practical about what’s best for the country and black people. Most progressives have no bend in their politics which is why a lot of them low key like Trump

You choosing to word it that way is an example of what I’m talking about. If Kamala were to “denounce” genocide, it wouldn’t have been enough.

It would have been “she’s only doing it for votes”, “she’s still a puppet for Israel”, “why isn’t she talking about a weapons embargo for Israel?”

As we have seen, nothing short of a Mamdani figure (who again is one wrong word away from being turned on) has been enough for the Bernie contingent of voters.

I think yall are doing that thing where you let the loudest minority define an entire group, aka “Bernie Bros” in 2016 defining his entire base. Yes, it wouldn’t be enough for some. But for more then enough people, it would have been. Meeting that moment with disdain wins absolutely nobody you need.

 

[King Kreole]

Im still waiting for someone to explain the transition point where people stop voting for the obviously beneficial progressive policies from the obviously superior progressive candidate because they saw an AIPAC funded ad for the 8th time.

On a national scale progressive policies sound good to some of our neighbors until it’s time to get in the booth and make sure that black kid down the street gets free lunch at school.

Until someone does a deeper dive as to why the obviously superior candidates in these elections keep losing instead of just hitting the jordan shrug and saying aipac, it’s probably gonna keep happening.

"Political elections are a meritocracy and we live in a fair and just world, so if progressive politics were really so much gooder then why do they lose? Might as well not fight for progressive politics because racist whites won't let us have it. Oh, also don't ask me why right-wing politics beat my beloved centrist politics in this supposed meritocracy. Also don't ask me about the horseshoe shaped indentation in my skull."

 

[Ozymandeas]

This is cope. If Kamala came out and said "I denounce the genocide" the vast majority of the protest opposition would obviously have evaporated. But you will always find criticism of power coming from the left, no matter the politician, Bernie or Mamdani or AOC or whoever. That's how leftist politics works, the world is not perfect so you're always pushing for better, it's not a politics of satisfaction. All politicians should be in fear of being turned on for taking bad positions, they work for us! We don't work for them!

This is bullshyt. Kamala essentially said the bolded multiple times. I know you saw the videos and the news headlines because I saw them.

Yall nikkas were upset because the war was going on. Not because "she didn't denounce genocide". She expressed support for Palestinians multiple times. Yall were upset because she didn't stop the actual armed conflict. Biden was her boss. Biden didn't GAF about Palestine. Kamala could not break with Biden publicly. You are a full-grown adult with hopefully a career. You should understand why Kamala couldn't go on CNN and say Biden was a dumbass. Kamala was being pulled in three directions: Pro-Palestinian people like you were upset she wouldn't go rogue and split with the White House, Jewish groups implying that anyone supporting Palestine was supporting Hamas and anti-semitism, and Biden's people pulling on her and expecting her to stay in line.

Yall nikkas aren't serious people. Now you've got a dictator.

Kamala - July 27th, 2024 - “I also expressed with the prime minister my serious concern about the scale of human suffering in Gaza, including the death of far too many innocent civilians,” Harris said, calling the war “devastating”. “The images of dead children and desperate, hungry people fleeing for safety — sometimes displaced for the second, third or fourth time — we cannot look away in the face of these tragedies. We cannot allow ourselves to become numb to the suffering, and I will not be silent.”

She also voiced support for Biden’s multi-phased ceasefire proposal to achieve an end to the war and release Israeli captives in Gaza. Israel and Hamas have been negotiating indirectly for months to finalise the agreement, but a solution has remained elusive so far.

At least on the surface, Harris’s tone appeared like a departure from Biden’s pro-Israel statements. “Harris created distance from Biden on Gaza by emphasizing Palestinian suffering,” a Washington Post headline read after the vice president’s comments.

Kamala - August 11th, 2024 -

 

[Ozymandeas]

The issue with this stance is that you’re pointing out why they lost instead of pointing to progressive wins.

I’m progressive and I’m also practical about what’s best for the country and black people. Most progressives have no bend in their politics which is why a lot of them low key like Trump

You choosing to word it that way is an example of what I’m talking about. If Kamala were to “denounce” genocide, it wouldn’t have been enough.

It would have been “she’s only doing it for votes”, “she’s still a puppet for Israel”, “why isn’t she talking about a weapons embargo for Israel?”

As we have seen, nothing short of a Mamdani figure (who again is one wrong word away from being turned on) has been enough for the Bernie contingent of voters.

He's full of shyt.

Kamala expressed support for Palestinians multiple times, but even if she said it in the exact verbiage he wanted, ("I denounce genocide"), the Bernie Bros would have done exactly what you said.

As far as Mamdani, most Progressives hate "the system". So they always turn on their candidates because once they get into office, they become tainted by it from their perspective. Once Mamdani gets in office and things don't change (they won't), the countdown will start until they claim that he sold out.

 

[wire28]

Yall first mistake is wasting keystrokes on a European who is still too ashamed to admit where he is from whose claim to fame on this message board is making pseudo intellectual arguments as to why Donald j Trump is the most pro black anything.

I see he just @‘d me and put another monkey picture so I assume its more drivel from an identity confused troll with a penchant for anti black rhetoric (I stopped reading his shyt a while ago), but I wholeheartedly approve of yall taking turns making him look dumber than usual.

 

[Loose]

He's full of shyt.

Kamala expressed support for Palestinians multiple times,

No she didn't, she wouldnt even allow a Palestinian speaker at the dnc convention. Biden administration in general looked at them as an inconvenience that "better get aboard "

 

[wire28]

He's full of shyt.

Kamala expressed support for Palestinians multiple times, but even if she said it in the exact verbiage he wanted, ("I denounce genocide"), the Bernie Bros would have done exactly what you said.

As far as Mamdani, most Progressives hate "the system". So they always turn on their candidates because once they get into office, they become tainted by it from their perspective. Once Mamdani gets in office and things don't change (they won't), the countdown will start until they claim that he sold out.

I said he’s got about a year of a honeymoon period until they start to turn on him. They already were mad he apologized to the police and then his message on Oct 7th. Once NYC isn’t looking like the jetsons by 2027/2028 it’s over for him in their eyes unfortunately.

 

[King Kreole]

This is bullshyt. Kamala essentially said the bolded multiple times. I know you saw the videos and the news headlines because I saw them.

If you can produce a SINGLE piece of evidence of Kamala Harris ever using the term "genocide" in reference to what the Israelis were doing to the Palestinians I will give you every single cent of my coli cash and dap+rep you for the next year. Because what you're claiming here is bullshyt.

Yall nikkas were upset because the war was going on. Not because "she didn't denounce genocide".

We were upset because there was a genocide being aided and abetted by the Democratic Administration she was Vice-President of, and she refused to break with that policy. Denouncing the Israeli actions against the Palestinians as genocide would have made an absolutely MASSIVE wave and been a huge signal that she would be markedly better on this issue than Biden. Even to this day she still can't do it, so I don't know what you're talking about.



Again, this is just cope because y'all are mad she faced consequences for taking a bad and immoral position that you personally hold as well.

She expressed support for Palestinians multiple times.

I don't know what your definition of support is, but banned anyone with Palestinian blood from stepping foot on stage at her Nomination Convention isn't what I call support. Refusing to have serious meetings with the primary protest group fighting against the genocide of Palestinians isn't what I call support. Refusing to even signal that she would stop sending weapons to the people perpetrating the genocide isn't what I call support.

Yall were upset because she didn't stop the actual armed conflict.

Absolutely no one was blaming her for not unilaterally stopping the genocide as Vice-President, and in fact many of the protestors were optimistic about her candidacy when she first took over for Biden.

https://www.npr.org/2024/08/12/nx-s1-5060109/israel-gaza-uncommitted-michigan-harris

The video and article you quoted was from before the above article was published. It was early in her campaign when she was smartly signalling she would take a different path than Biden, and she wasn't getting protested and her poll numbers were looking great. Then she started reversing course on meeting with the movement leaders and discussing an arms embargo, and then said she wouldn't do anything different than Biden, and then she started getting protested and her numbers starting tanking. She was given grace and completely squandered it by foolish decisions she made.

Biden was her boss. Biden didn't GAF about Palestine. Kamala could not break with Biden publicly. You are a full-grown adult with hopefully a career. You should understand why Kamala couldn't go on CNN and say Biden was a dumbass.

If what you're saying is true, then she was not fit to be the leader of the most powerful country in the world. Biden was no longer her boss, he was a lame duck senile dying President. If she didn't have the ovaries to tell him to fukk off for the good of the election and country, then she deserved to lose. She chose loyalty/fear of Biden over the country.

Kamala was being pulled in three directions: Pro-Palestinian people like you were upset she wouldn't go rogue and split with the White House, Jewish groups implying that anyone supporting Palestine was supporting Hamas and anti-semitism, and Biden's people pulling on her and expecting her to stay in line.

 

[Loose]