Erick Sermon Gives SHOCKING Reason He Didn’t Produce On Nas Illmatic • DoggieDiamonds

[Surreal]

obfcl toed the last line of content and direction midatlantic seaboard COVERT street slang content rich rap could have gone in.

as back then if you were not heavily engrained in the culture and past transistional era from old to new school way of thought slang to and in the crack era. You would not have found any casual. who could have ever told you wtf wu tang was talking about bar to bar past cream.
as i am the online personality that deciphered wu tang lyrics and de la soul lyrics first in print. That was then sharked by the source and later ohhlala. As articles and then an actual site that tried to take credit for this is a lie.

they stole it from me in sept 1997 from Daved.com message board.

so the whole idea of people even knowing in general wtf those type of rhymes even meant were few and far between.

when nas made iww. He completely dumbed down but ratcheted up lifting couplets.

plus used readily accessible gateway drug slang.
that was more akin to that found on early ruthless records to before southern independence from the west. Southern barebone meets rutheless records to midatlantic commercial based gangsta rnb hybrid record.
whereas midatlantic slang were not even generally known in that era. As his skill set started to emulate the same melodic flow.
that rae picked up from live and let die from g rap.
that after roots of evil dropped.
people erroneously said G rap was biting Raekwon.
When both now nas and G rap were lifting g rap.
so G rap lifted his shyt back o. Roots of evil
plus it leaned on rnb hook based recreation of past sellout break records


just this whole shyt has been deflected away from the truth.
to deflect away from the fact nas sold out with stoute and trackmasters. Then further created even more erosion aligning with puff.



art barr

All the while Nas, Jay, AZ, and Rae were on the don shyt, the real nikkas down south in No Limit took they ball and never looked back. Either had them nikkas hating or collabing with em

All because Nas was scared to drop another album not better than Illmatic so he soul'd out and used a false narrative perpetrated by him and Stoute

And I say this as a nas stan

 

[spliz]

Oh shyt another thread slandering IWW with bullshyt propaganda takes from nikkas who obviously didn’t listen to the album since it dropped. I’m damn near drained with arguing about that album. I’ve heard so much different full of shyt comments on why IWW was shytted on and they are all damn near contradictory which is why I know it’s all bullshyt and not rooted in what was really going on within the album. I’m bout to start saying IWW >>>> Illmatic just to make nikkas mad. Lol

 

[MikeStamina]

Cause OB4CL came out the year before. That subject matter shoulda stayed in 95. Mafioso lyrics have no legs for growth(Rick Ross). Specially with that melodic flow. Had the nerve to double down with the Firm trash a year later. It's a reason Rae and AZ never gained a greater audience than their 1st joints. Nas saving grace was Illmatic

Man get all the way the fukk outta here.
Opinions are like a$$holes...

Thank God nas didn't listen to the naysayers n just did him. His real fans came along n the ones that didn't can just keep replaying illmatic. Selfish motherfukkers

The same ones that want nas to keep it pure are the same ones that will use his lack of hit records against him when it's convenient

 

[spliz]

Man get all the way the fukk outta here.
Opinions are like a$$holes...

Thank God nas didn't listen to the naysayers n just did him. His real fans came along n the ones that didn't can just keep replaying illmatic. Selfish motherfukkers

The same ones that want nas to keep it pure are the same ones that will use his lack of hit records against him when it's convenient

Imma take it further. The same ones who wanted another Illmatic didn’t even PURCHASE the first one. nikkas bootlegged the fukk out of it. And then. To add insult to injury. The publication that gave him his critical acclaim. SNUBBED him for the more commercial album that they rated LESS than Illmatic in the magazine. It showed him how full of shyt the whole process is.

 

[KravenMorehead™]

The same ones that want nas to keep it pure are the same ones that will use his lack of hit records against him when it's convenient

Imma take it further. The same ones who wanted another Illmatic didn’t even PURCHASE the first one. nikkas bootlegged the fukk out of it. And then. To add insult to injury. The publication that gave him his critical acclaim. SNUBBED him for the more commercial album that they rated LESS than Illmatic in the magazine. It showed him how full of shyt the whole process is.

 

[Art Barr]

I don’t think Erick’s tracks would’ve vibed with the Illmatic sound.

at that time i do not think the sonic direction of illmatic was solidified in 1991.

Yet like sermon says.


nas was the industry and complete technical upgrade to any and every existing style war era emcee.
during the styles war immediately from one verse on bbq, in this time period being recorded.
plus to cement it on halftime.
then the delayed it is not hard to tell twelve inch.
to another. Later delay to illmatic.
during those delays and the initial response to the release of bbq.

which was unprecedented to that point for any midatlantic culture based emcee. outside of redman and common sense.
as solo debut artist at that time in the styles war era.
to technical revolution nas single handidly ushered in. Along with a complete immediate change in the sonic landscape as well culturally.

additionally, nas's illmatic sealed the door on the age limit of the prodigious rap talent as well.
plus cemented the album delayed star noted door closing of the of age ideal of being nineteen.
as the gate closed age for a prospective recording artist in rap. Where unlike now,...
upon the jiggy era completely and cultural deafening any and every cultural skill set and pillar based norm and nas's futher degradative submissions in hate me now from if i ruled the world. Having the death of rap is an ol school rap oversaturated instrumental and fugazi female rapper but classically trained actor singer on the overly commercialized Kurtis blow hook.
it completely signaled the end of the forward indie and cultural based new school way of thought. That used to keep art house loan labels honest.
after the segueway of ol to new school way of thought from 1983 to the last quarter of 1985. Almost signaled the end of every pillar based gateway business profit with what should be called the near death of rap.
to the almost decade near gap of culture based midatlantic new school way of thought art house based rap. That covers the golden to style war to technical ages.
Before the prison industrial and communications act eroded all of everything beginning with the early mid quarter 1990
including misappropriating rap.
into the gateway and face of the sonic and visual marketing of midatlantic legacy based prison industrial economy based marketing as well.
where nas, solidly is the original midatlantic gateway marketed artist of that time period on iww in second quarter of 1996.
yet seeds were planted for this, as early as the nas twelve inch remix.
to one love in first quarter of 1995.
Plus a gateway marketed rnb directed production and hook, as well.
which were completely looked as taboo culturally to deviant at that time.



art barr

 

[Art Barr]

Imma take it further. The same ones who wanted another Illmatic didn’t even PURCHASE the first one. nikkas bootlegged the fukk out of it. And then. To add insult to injury. The publication that gave him his critical acclaim. SNUBBED him for the more commercial album that they rated LESS than Illmatic in the magazine. It showed him how full of shyt the whole process is.

politically nas lost to big in the emcee rap category in publication to the source.

All because big actually rocked and did not no show key large pr'd publication or under ground showings.
Even as a fringe culture based MCA jiggy gangsta gateway play on heavy d on babboy arista.
so nas lost because,...
yes while being the most skilled technically for that year.
signaling the end of the styles war to the technical revolution.
biggie also ramped skill on the last twelve recorded on unbelieveable. Plus ramped on subsequent twelves leading into the publication setting this precedent.

yet nas did this to himself.
as cultirally as an emcee he did not command every ceremony without fail and also numerously and consistently did not command every ceremony booking. While also the source was being culturally couped.

yet nas culturally if he would have held true to the emcee pillar based norms of all ways without fail responding consistently. Nas would have easily won emcee of the year from that publication. Yet culturally in nyc. The tone was also changing to a more jiggy dj Hollywood ol school way of thought meets crack era regression.
Instead of its new school way of thought ol school legacy progressive more and norm holdovers to white lines.

if nas would have not no showed so many performances.
including not being such a low quality performer for all of his early career till 2000- sumfin maybe.
nas opened the door to lose by not having and being as sound technically in rocking stages. As nas consistently no showing in that year.
created a default style loss in that performance category all emcee'n is based upon. Which allowed the consistently booked and managed and record label lead biggie with puff as a booker/promoter networking. To be more active and have more actual visibility than nas.
simply, because biggie showed up to rock consistently.

nas has given his previous self admitted account of no shows in that era happening consistently on numerous occasions.
trying to say nas met all cultural metrics by default no showing the performance side. Allowed the publication to have the political sway and chance to make him lose.

which as an emcee you are not supposed to do.
nor allow to generally or professionally occur.
in that is how the publication was able to give the duke to big.

it was not because of the direction of the un-pr'd later coup.
that occurred and was in revision later revealed.
That later some can cite in revision.
as to big being awarded over nas.



art barr


bon and nip, voted chicago's best group.
embarrassed nas performance wise to the point.
nas had a luke booty shake dance nude tshirt contest.
instead of being able to finish songs. Word for rhyming word in the pocket bar to bar. Including needing to be severely aided to still fail performing song to song at hob in 1999.

so I know this to be true, as an eye witness.
Including fukk'n a what if jill Scott clone.
that was not at all fat erykah sabu style dressed female in said t shirt contest too.

plus being at the one nas no show. Where aZ even rocked.
Plus common sense to hemmorrage nas no showing had to host, perform.
plus and also debuted the accapella to bytch in you predating the hob nas no show as well.
Including, nas noshowing, the Alcatraz as well.

 

[Art Barr]

All the while Nas, Jay, AZ, and Rae were on the don shyt, the real nikkas down south in No Limit took they ball and never looked back. Either had them nikkas hating or collabing with em

All because Nas was scared to drop another album not better than Illmatic so he soul'd out and used a false narrative perpetrated by him and Stoute

And I say this as a nas stan

Rae had a cultural out because he improved in highest rap gateway fashion. To only be surpassed by his partner in rhyme in the same release in obfcl. Originally, Rae and ghost would be like psk to six in the morning ol school legacy hold over fringe culture based gangsta style rap.
originally rae and ghost could easily have never ramped to be acceptable.
going from the styles war era to technical era.
plus been lost like any vocally loud and offkey midatlantic style war group. How rae and ghost even gained cultural acceptance from 36 chambers to obfcl as solo artists. Is the attention to the content and emcee side bar to bar lyrically. As they paid key attention to this sonic and technical change nas ushered in. As well as Luke booty dancer music based artist mobb deep as well.
az had a cultural out in that time.
i spoke about in the cultural sway for miss jones previously. from the snub of the earlier don't front to the much later released mca way based mjb.

jay came and failed originally in this segieway from style war to technical time line.
numerous times from bdk, to original flavor, to big l and stretch bobbito.
then, and later launched in a jiggy content direction.
as an pop adult contemporary sellout style rap artist.
on the Indie twelve to more technical revolution style remix.
complete with paradise paid for jiggy yacht vid.
to subsequent freeze/priority 500k album print and run for THE further degradative but failed JIGGY SELLOUT RD.



art barr

 

[spliz]

politically nas lost to big in the emcee rap category in publication to the source.

All because big actually rocked and did not no show key large pr'd publication or under ground showings.
Even as a fringe culture based MCA jiggy gangsta gateway play on heavy d on babboy arista.
so nas lost because,...
yes while being the most skilled technically for that year.
signaling the end of the styles war to the technical revolution.
biggie also ramped skill on the last twelve recorded on unbelieveable. Plus ramped on subsequent twelves leading into the publication setting this precedent.

yet nas did this to himself.
as cultirally as an emcee he did not command every ceremony without fail and also numerously and consistently did not command every ceremony booking. While also the source was being culturally couped.

yet nas culturally if he would have held true to the emcee pillar based norms of all ways without fail responding consistently. Nas would have easily won emcee of the year from that publication. Yet culturally in nyc. The tone was also changing to a more jiggy dj Hollywood ol school way of thought meets crack era regression.
Instead of its new school way of thought ol school legacy progressive more and norm holdovers to white lines.

if nas would have not no showed so many performances.
including not being such a low quality performer for all of his early career till 2000- sumfin maybe.
nas opened the door to lose by not having and being as sound technically in rocking stages. As nas consistently no showing in that year.
created a default style loss in that performance category all emcee'n is based upon. Which allowed the consistently booked and managed and record label lead biggie with puff as a booker/promoter networking. To be more active and have more actual visibility than nas.
simply, because biggie showed up to rock consistently.

nas has given his previous self admitted account of no shows in that era happening consistently on numerous occasions.
trying to say nas met all cultural metrics by default no showing the performance side. Allowed the publication to have the political sway and chance to make him lose.

which as an emcee you are not supposed to do.
nor allow to generally or professionally occur.
in that is how the publication was able to give the duke to big.

it was not because of the direction of the un-pr'd later coup.
that occurred and was in revision later revealed.
That later some can cite in revision.
as to big being awarded over nas.



art barr


bon and nip, voted chicago's best group.
embarrassed nas performance wise to the point.
nas had a luke booty shake dance nude tshirt contest.
instead of being able to finish songs. Word for rhyming word in the pocket bar to bar. Including needing to be severely aided to still fail performing song to song at hob in 1999.

so I know this to be true, as an eye witness.
Including fukk'n a what if jill Scott clone.
that was not at all fat erykah sabu style dressed female in said t shirt contest too.

plus being at the one nas no show. Where aZ even rocked.
Plus common sense to hemmorrage nas no showing had to host, perform.
plus and also debuted the accapella to bytch in you predating the hob nas no show as well.
Including, nas noshowing, the Alcatraz as well.

I don’t even wanna hear that no show shyt because nikkas like Ra used to no show and run wit the money ALL the time and never got CLOSE to the hate Nas got. None of these rap nikkas is innocent and they all fukked up here n there with something. Nas was a fukkin introvert at that time and hated the media, camera’s etc etc. regardless. None of that shyt has to do with the damn publication SNUBBING him. And nikkas BOOTLEGGING his shyt. I actually bought Illmatic on cassette. I knew more people with the bootleg of that album than the real copy. That’s crazy. nikkas don’t have a right to say shyt to a nikka if they ain’t even supporting him. Period.

 

[old boy]

I think people are going down the wrong road on what Erick meant..

He has talked about this before. He said he wasnt into how Nas rhymed back then. I know exactly what he meant because I was a Def Squad stan before I got into Nas music. I had a hard time getting with Nas shyt because rap was more about heavy simile use and Nas wasnt that. Erick said that before that Nas rhymes basically wasnt simile style like Red or Keith Murray. Nas was dope, but he wasnt that punchline rapper

you on it. basically yall have to understand the climate of new york emcees & hip hop when erick is telling this story, the animated/character voice rapper was all the rage. cartoon references, commercial jingles, puns, limericks, nursery rhymes, animated flows, etc. etc. etc..... for instance, yall remember nas' feature on mc serch back to the grill again? he stuck out like a sore thumb. you had red lover tone doing his best grand puba impression which was the template for other rappers like shoop salt n pepa, zhigge and others. and then an acculturated mc serch and chubb rock with the flipping mad styles flow. and chubb.... jesus christ chubb why? straight up screaming like ralph kramden lol. YOU ARE A BLABBERRR MOUTH!!!

hell go back and find an acculturated Kool G Rap on Letters off Live And Let Die. nikka said, "Bang! Bang! Bang! like the Ricochet Rabbit!!!" Lol shyt was cringe but G Rap was just purveying the landscape dominated by Das Efx, Redman, ODB. and also a pre-debut Bus, but VERY INFLUENTIAL Dungeon Dragon Busta Rhymes, plus the king of character voices B Real who done turned Scoob Lover into this weird rapping character named Big Scoob who sounded like a Looney Tunes character on Kane's Show n' Prove with Hov, Sauce and ODB..... hell even Kane started being animated, screaming bars every now and then. it was all the rage late '92 to late '94. Da Bush Babeez, Lord of the Underground, Nine, Trendz of Culture, Onyx (of course, should have been named first lol), Hoodratz... lol yall remember animated Fugees on Nappyheads Remix? Wyclef and Lauryn were the epitome of this style and toned it down later for The Score. hell Boof Baf and all that shyt on their first weed plate was that too


funny enough nikkas who rapped like Nas, Sauce Money, Lord Finesse and pre-Purple Tape Rae & Ghost were seen as a big antiquated. Remember Dante Ross was only focused on Meth & ODB and could have given a fukk about the rest of Wu. they fit the trope at that time. "Hey! Hey! Hey! like F-a-a-t A-a-a-albert. It's the Method Man ain't no ifs ands about it!" lmao... aye i went through this as an emcee (i was mid as fukk with a WOAT voice but fukk with me anyway). when i rhymed for producer Bobby Crawford in late '92. (produced YZ Return of the Holy One) his criticism? "You sound like them Queensbridge Nas & Fatal nikkas baby pah. Too old Rakim-ish. You need more energy to get the crowd hype son." which mirrored what Lord Digga said about my rhymes. it sounded too derivative of the '88 old guard way of rhyming and you know how Digga rhymed. gruff grimy voice and hella animated. hell, look at how Masta Ace changed from The Symphony/Take A Look Around to Slaughtahouse. his voice was very B-Realish and animated


so Erick had Redman, Joe Syninstr and Keith Murray. need I say more? and it wasn't just the execution but the content too. '93 was all about pop culture laced, edgy banality and quirkyness. "I like Muhammed Ali so fukk Gerry c00ney! "Even the wicked witch couldn't get with the scripts, the ugly bytch!" and here you have this poised, super mature, introspective, Rakim-ish, no frills, no bells, no whistles, laid back poet nikka named Nas. someone like Erick wanted him to rhyme like fukkin Lord Have Mercy More from Flipmode lol. but once Illmatic hit? he single handedly deaded them type of rappers b. by late '95 they were damn near obsolete. Biggie even changed his hyped up vocal tone from Dead Wrong/Party and Bullshyt to Unbelievable/Warning after the gawd Nas. and by the way i don't think Erick would have fit the jazzy sonic landscape of Illmatic at all. but GOD FORBID he saved & gave Nas that Rockafella Remix beat to use two years later on It Was Written. jesus christ Nas would have torn that to shreds (not that Reggie wasn't good but fukk with me though). anyway i'll go on forever so i'll leave it there..

 

[UserNameless]

You know what, now that I think about it, I could see Nas on Keith’s “Herb is Pumping”.

definitely

 

[kes929]

Oh shyt another thread slandering IWW with bullshyt propaganda takes from nikkas who obviously didn’t listen to the album since it dropped. I’m damn near drained with arguing about that album. I’ve heard so much different full of shyt comments on why IWW was shytted on and they are all damn near contradictory which is why I know it’s all bullshyt and not rooted in what was really going on within the album. I’m bout to start saying IWW >>>> Illmatic just to make nikkas mad. Lol

I personally think it was written on the same level as illmatic. And personally nas first 3 albums top notch in my opinion. I am has Gems!!

 

[Art Barr]

I don’t even wanna hear that no show shyt because nikkas like Ra used to no show and run wit the money ALL the time and never got CLOSE to the hate Nas got. None of these rap nikkas is innocent and they all fukked up here n there with something. Nas was a fukkin introvert at that time and hated the media, camera’s etc etc. regardless. None of that shyt has to do with the damn publication SNUBBING him. And nikkas BOOTLEGGING his shyt. I actually bought Illmatic on cassette. I knew more people with the bootleg of that album than the real copy. That’s crazy. nikkas don’t have a right to say shyt to a nikka if they ain’t even supporting him. Period.

this is all deflection and pass system semantics.
that can also still be defeated with timeline comparative to nas facts.
as far as ra.
or rakim. being a skill dominant emcee to nad in compariaon.
by skillset and any variable metric too.
just in beginning point
ra completed tours with his peers his rook year.
where rakim made significant stage performances.
thay solidifoed snd twrraformed national and eorld wide booking stability of rap going into and beyond the golden age. years beyond nas in comparison in time line made.

you can not even try to make up degradative points for ra against nas and in nas favor.
as nas does not stack up in skillset
nor, variables in time line to ra.


so we can stop that pass system based deflection for nas going jiggy and not having comparable full skill variable to ra right now.




art barr

 

[Piff Perkins]

I don’t even wanna hear that no show shyt because nikkas like Ra used to no show and run wit the money ALL the time and never got CLOSE to the hate Nas got. None of these rap nikkas is innocent and they all fukked up here n there with something. Nas was a fukkin introvert at that time and hated the media, camera’s etc etc. regardless. None of that shyt has to do with the damn publication SNUBBING him. And nikkas BOOTLEGGING his shyt. I actually bought Illmatic on cassette. I knew more people with the bootleg of that album than the real copy. That’s crazy. nikkas don’t have a right to say shyt to a nikka if they ain’t even supporting him. Period.

Eh you're either dedicated or you aren't. Puffy made sure Biggie did every event and show possible, because that's what an entertainer should do. Nas hurt his status with promoters for years by not showing up to gigs, and only just recently repaired some of those bridges. In terms of promo, he didn't have as good of a relationship with DJs as Biggie (or Hov) for similar reasons.

Whenever people talk about Nas there's a brigade that excuses everything. I don't get it. Nas himself said his work ethic wasn't good at the time. He has songs talking about that chaotic period between Illmatic and IWW, before Steve Stoute righted the ship a bit. But even Stoute couldn't fix all that stuff.

Biggie earned that award on every level. Nas didn't. And that led to Nas going in another direction with his next album.

 

[spliz]

Eh you're either dedicated or you aren't. Puffy made sure Biggie did every event and show possible, because that's what an entertainer should do. Nas hurt his status with promoters for years by not showing up to gigs, and only just recently repaired some of those bridges. In terms of promo, he didn't have as good of a relationship with DJs as Biggie (or Hov) for similar reasons.

Whenever people talk about Nas there's a brigade that excuses everything. I don't get it. Nas himself said his work ethic wasn't good at the time. He has songs talking about that chaotic period between Illmatic and IWW, before Steve Stoute righted the ship a bit. But even Stoute couldn't fix all that stuff.

Biggie earned that award on every level. Nas didn't. And that led to Nas going in another direction with his next album.

Man gtfoh. U nikkas buggin even Biggie himself didn’t believe he shoulda got that shyt. Biggie EARNED lyricist of the year over Nas cause of some fukkin shows? Bottom line. Biggie had a Diddy. Nas didn’t. Politics. That’s like we both get passing grades on a test. I get 100 and u get a 90. The teacher awards u for having the best grade.