Future - "Reasonable Doubt was not hot when it dropped"

No1

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these jigga and 2pac stans are mad about the gods debut influence/second coming of rakim facts:lolbron::umad: I always come with those receipts:banderas:







Large Professor On '90s Babies, Nas & Rakim's Relationship And Lupe Fiasco's Rights To "T.R.O.Y."



Large Professor On '90s Babies, Nas & Rakim's Relationship And Lupe Fiasco's Rights To "T.R.O.Y."



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you keep making the mistake of thinking sells is the only way to have an impact when I already said nas had an artistic/lyrical impact with Illmatic and was universally critically acclaimed for it that transcended commercial charting. jayz had nothing like that with RD.




That exact same video talks about Nas didn't put New York on the map and Biggie actually did. They gave dude twice as much time.
 

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You say "nas cleaned up his sound and expanded" but he deliberately set out to make an album that appealed commercially getting Steve stoute as his manager and using the track masters as producers. Big/Puff definitely influenced him. He admitted to doing this because illmatic didn't make any money. Those are facts but you can spin it and "clean it up" however you want.

Illmatic's impact is greatly exaggerated. It was much hyped in ny but outside of the tri-state area nobody really gave a fukk. I'm from the south and only the real hip hop heads even knew about illmatic when it first came out. Every day regular dudes didn't give a fukk about Nas until I ruled the world with Lauryn. The same logic cats are using to question illmatic' impact is the same logic that cats are using to question RD. if you aren't defending RD from cats talking that ignorant shyt like future then don't defend illmatic either. There are plenty of rappers who got more shine than nas in '94. Big, wu, snoop, cube, bone thugs, ect all were bigger than nas with albums out that got more play than illmatic.

Might as well wrap this thread up,thats the whole point here.....its plenty of cats saying the real heads had Reasonable Doubt too....does that not matter because it wasnt deemed classic then?this is about who was checking for who,and sounds like just about the same nikkas was checking for Illmatic and RD....NY/tristate nikkas/east coast fans
 

IllmaticDelta

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That exact same video talks about Nas didn't put New York on the map and Biggie actually did. They gave dude twice as much time.

it didn't say that..they said he and along with wutang and later big put ny back on the map and while Illmatic was the most critically acclaimed of the bunch, Biggie had the most commercial impact.

 

spliz

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You say "nas cleaned up his sound and expanded" but he deliberately set out to make an album that appealed commercially getting Steve stoute as his manager and using the track masters as producers. Big/Puff definitely influenced him. He admitted to doing this because illmatic didn't make any money. Those are facts but you can spin it and "clean it up" however you want.

Illmatic's impact is greatly exaggerated. It was much hyped in ny but outside of the tri-state area nobody really gave a fukk. I'm from the south and only the real hip hop heads even knew about illmatic when it first came out. Every day regular dudes didn't give a fukk about Nas until I ruled the world with Lauryn. The same logic cats are using to question illmatic' impact is the same logic that cats are using to question RD. if you aren't defending RD from cats talking that ignorant shyt like future then don't defend illmatic either. There are plenty of rappers who got more shine than nas in '94. Big, wu, snoop, cube, bone thugs, ect all were bigger than nas with albums out that got more play than illmatic.
nikka did u even read the thread? Only thing he took from Bad Boy was the fact he had to polish his sound more. Album is NOT stylistically like any Bad Boy album at the time. And who cares what nikka's from westbumblefukk south was thinkin. U nikka's don't get it. I been said casuals prolly didn't know Illmatic. But for the heads. Illmatic was VERY important. And that shyt spread like wildfire in the industry. Yall nikkas makin shyt up based on how big a deal the shyt was in yo house. This thread was about Jay Z and u nikkas came in here making it about Nas. Fact is. Go ahead. Call Nas Illmatic a big deal locally. Say what u want. Reasonable Doubt wasn't even THAT. shyt was just another dope album. Regardless of what u feel expectations were fulfilled or not with Illmatic. There was NO expectations for Reasonable Doubt. Not even locally. What u gonna tell me it was now?. nikka from the south who wasn't here? nikka's have ZERO credentials to say the opposite of what every artist, publication, all of that shyt was sayin at the time. nikka's talking that Snoop shyt. But guess what. SNOOP knew who Nas was cause of Illmatic. Nas went to visit LA when Illmatic was out. Snoop immediately knew who it was. U nikka's is ALL exposing yall selves. Thinking that hindsight numbers tell the whole story.
 

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Might as well wrap this thread up,thats the whole point here.....its plenty of cats saying the real heads had Reasonable Doubt too....does that not matter because it wasnt deemed classic then?this is about who was checking for who,and sounds like just about the same nikkas was checking for Illmatic and RD....NY/tristate nikkas/east coast fans


stop it...yall cats being hard headed just to be hard headed. Commercial play influence is not the same as artistic or lyrical/mcing impact. Illmatic is the latter. It's like arguing Duke Ellington (artistic) vs Kenny g (commercial).
 

spliz

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stop it...yall cats being hard headed just to be hard headed. Commercial play influence is not the same as artistic or lyrical/mcing impact. Illmatic is the latter. It's like arguing Duke Ellington (artistic) vs Kenny g (commercial).
The only reason they arguing this shyt so hard is cause they wasn't there. Either that or they was casual at the time so if it wasn't all on the videos or the radio they didn't give a fukk about it. So they on some hindsight numbers shyt not understanding it didn't tell the whole story. Two albums could sell the same amount and one could have not made a dent culturally while the other was extremely critically acclaimed, culturally revered and influential.
 

IllmaticDelta

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.all that second coming talk means nothing when it was nikkas beating him out in his own city for lyricist of the year,imagine that happening to Rakim:mjlol:?

nas got fuked over by the same reason tons of people think eminem is the greatest and that Drake is the best out now...COMMERCIALISM over artistry!




plus a nikka from the west who wasnt as lyrical was still the most anticipated emcee of the time that EVERYBODY wanted to hear RAP...cant take that from Snoop,nikkas loved his style:wow:


I ready spoke on it....snoop was promoting the gangsta rap thing and white kids (who do you think was buying those album?) ate it up


we all know the OG east coast guys looked at west coast gangsta rap as dumbing down the art form lyrically and even thematically speaking

@ 1:11







 

bigbadbossup2012

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1. There was still boom bap on IWW. 2. nikka was still a queens goon on the album. 3. Was funny as fukk. Lol. 4. The very most important thing. Is :umad:.
There was boom bap on the album as well as ready to die as well as strictly 4 my nikkas. Style was East coast rough shyt with obvious cross over single.
So basically nas did what biggie did two yrs prior and pac did even before that. #nothingNEW
 

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The only reason they arguing this shyt so hard is cause they wasn't there. Either that or they was casual at the time so if it wasn't all on the videos or the radio they didn't give a fukk about it. So they on some hindsight numbers shyt not understanding it didn't tell the whole story. Two albums could sell the same amount and one could have not made a dent culturally while the other was extremely critically acclaimed, culturally revered and influential.

it's a waste of time arguing with people who base their entire argument on sells when we all know there is a difference between commercial impact vs artistic impact which is why you have dumb threads like these

Nicki Minaj having a better musical career than Aretha Franklin

Nicki Minaj having a better musical career than Aretha Franklin
 

spliz

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it's a waste of time arguing with people who base their entire argument on sells when we all know there is a difference between commercial impact vs artistic impact which is why you have dumb threads like these

Nicki Minaj having a better musical career than Aretha Franklin

Nicki Minaj having a better musical career than Aretha Franklin
That title is all that needs to be said in a nutshell. NICKI MINAJ HAVING A BETTER MUSICAL CAREER THAN ARETHA FRANKLIN.
 

bigbadbossup2012

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it's a waste of time arguing with people who base their entire argument on sells when we all know there is a difference between commercial impact vs artistic impact which is why you have dumb threads like these

Nicki Minaj having a better musical career than Aretha Franklin

Nicki Minaj having a better musical career than Aretha Franklin
That title is all that needs to be said in a nutshell. NICKI MINAJ HAVING A BETTER MUSICAL CAREER THAN ARETHA FRANKLIN.
clowns always using some way out shyt to try and make bullshyt arguments. Entirely different comparison. Nas is being compared to real time powers not people whom came out 40-50 years before him
 

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nikka did u even read the thread? Only thing he took from Bad Boy was the fact he had to polish his sound more. Album is NOT stylistically like any Bad Boy album at the time.
The track masters were basically bad boy producers at that point so to say that nas took bad boy producers to make an album that was stylistically nothing like the bad boy sound is just silly. You're an irrational nas cocksucker tho so I'm really not going to argue with you.


And who cares what nikka's from westbumblefukk south was thinkin.
Apparently Nas did which is why he switched up his style from Illmatic to IWW. He wasn't making any money only catering to you bytchmade feminine ass ny dudes.

U nikka's don't get it. I been said casuals prolly didn't know Illmatic. But for the heads. Illmatic was VERY important. And that shyt spread like wildfire in the industry. Yall nikkas makin shyt up based on how big a deal the shyt was in yo house. This thread was about Jay Z and u nikkas came in here making it about Nas.
You're unnecessarily emotional and evidently hard of hearing. Nas is mentioned in the clip that this thread is about. The conversation that they're having in the clip isn't just about Jay. Matter of fact I just went back and listened again and my point is further cemented because even future implies that nas's career started with I ruled the world:pachaha: If future says that he was checking for nas and illmatic in '94 he'd be lying. That alone makes his passive aggressive shade at Jay/RD invalid and that's the point here. The same way that you can't say that illmatic wasn't "hot" because it wasn't a commercial smash and other albums were more appreciated, is the same way you can't say that RD wasn't hot. Both albums were initially slept on by the masses but that doesn't take away from the quality of either album.

Fact is. Go ahead. Call Nas Illmatic a big deal locally. Say what u want. Reasonable Doubt wasn't even THAT. shyt was just another dope album. Regardless of what u feel expectations were fulfilled or not with Illmatic. There was NO expectations for Reasonable Doubt. Not even locally. What u gonna tell me it was now?. nikka from the south who wasn't here? nikka's have ZERO credentials to say the opposite of what every artist, publication, all of that shyt was sayin at the time. nikka's talking that Snoop shyt. But guess what. SNOOP knew who Nas was cause of Illmatic. Nas went to visit LA when Illmatic was out. Snoop immediately knew who it was. U nikka's is ALL exposing yall selves. Thinking that hindsight numbers tell the whole story.
I haven't been arguing over which album ny cats liked more between illmatic and rd. I don't give a fukk which album you lames liked better. And who cares shag snoop knew nas? My point was that the same bullshyt that cats are trying to use to shade RD can be used to shade illmatic. You're emotional because you're a nas-fanboy:yeshrug:
 
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