I think imma enlist in the. Good idea?

[Ezekiel 25:17]

You showed why on this very thread…exhibit A:



Here’s the mistake people like you make and I’m not gonna keep going back and forth with you cuz I already was in Air Force, already make six figures, I’m already where you wanna be and you arguing. But the mistake people like you make, is you go in “open” and then when you get to boot camp and talk to a job counselor they give you a list of jobs to choose from and guess what….NONE OF THE shyt YOU WANT IS THERE. So now they asking you to pick a job and your dream bases but you have no internet connection to research those jobs, nobody to ask about quality of life on the job because everyone around you is a trainee, and you got one week to decide your top 8 but it’s a highly stressful week with minimal downtime. Now there could be positive outcomes in the situation but I personally don’t like leaving things to chance in a system like military where you can’t technically quit

I remember a guy hated his job so much, he took off and went home. When his plane landed, it was held at the gate…no one could exit…suddenly two Air Force personnel came onboard to arrest him. I watched him get punished for 8 months with him getting stripes taken and given and taken back…and he had to pay for it on all ABUs. Finally they kicked him out.

Breh you're assuming I would take any job. You're assuming I'd go open, when I know open means they put you in any job with an opening. There is no reason for me to choose any job because that's not my career field in the civilian world.

You said go in with a plan, if you read the op you would've seen my plan.

The plan is going into the Construction field, that way after 4 year I'll have that experience under my belt to transfer to the civilian world and a Bachelor's degree.

 

[xiceman191]

Yup man, it happens all the time. Not only do you get out with “Cop” and “Security Guard” as the closet analogue in the civilian world but your quality of life as an Airman probably sucked balls. Don’t y’all do 10 hour shifts but then require on hour to arm and disarm so you end up working 12 hour shifts? That’s what I remember when I was in. In addition when ILO-JET was huge in I think 2008 (I forgot) they were pulling hard from SF. I remember multiple people going in open general and being pissed off when they got assigned SF. I had to watch over some people who tried to commit suicide before cuz Beast was juat part of boot camp but when they got SF it became what they felt to be their life for the next 4 - 6 years.

We were doing 8 hour shifts at first around 2009 and then we switched to 12 hour shifts but usually it was about an hour before shift we had to show up for daily briefings and arming up.

 

[Son Goku]

@Ezekiel 25:17 This doesn't seem like a good idea. @Marc Spector and @Deuterion already told you some of the pitfalls that brehs can fall in. Most of them are situational.


The reason I say this isn't a good idea is because of the time. For you to get a specific AFSC you're gonna have to have divine help or wait hella long. Some recruiters won't let you wait for specific jobs, and the AF is not hurting for bodies rn, especially after the depression caused by covid.


What you majored in and even your ASVAB will have little if anything to do with what job you get: recruiting flight chiefs pick the jobs and unless you're doing one with very specific requirements (either academically like Cardiopulmonary Lab or physically like Pararescue), what you want prolly won't matter. Some jobs are so rare that recruiters don't even see them. Remember, the ASVAB is only a requirement to get a job, not a consideration to be matched with one.


Your mindset is also off IMO. If your only goal is to to school, aim to get an AFSC that has a short tech school and doesn't deploy or TDY that much. The shorter your tech school, the sooner you finish it and BMT and be on to your first duty station. Your leadership won't let you take any classes until your upgrade training is finished, so the sooner that gets knocked out the sooner you can go to school. Any jobs that deploy a lot (like a lot of those CE jobs) might end up messing up your schedule, though you can still go to class downrange.


Those CE jobs can get you certs and experience, but a cake personnel or medical job with no nights/weekends/shifts can give you more flexibility to knock out your schooling.


Honestly, a vast majority of cats ITT prolly ain't never served in the AF so take their advice with a grain of salt. Except for a very few career fields the Air Force is exactly like any other corporate/office job. Imagine an episode of The Office: you're gonna have corny ass mangers (officers and SNCOs) like Michael Scott; cutthroat muhfukkas that will do you dirty like Dwight; broads that are nothing but drama like Kelly, etc.


There are pros and cons, and a lot of it is situational. Who cares if somebody younger than you is telling you what to do? If that person has the experience/rank to call the shots, let em. If shyt goes sideways, they're gonna go to the one making the calls first anyways. Dudes always bring up that weak ass argument for some reason. If you're not mature enough to take directions from a boss that's younger than you are and KIM, the military is not for you anyways.

 

[Son Goku]

Hey breh, have you considered switching the order of events? I think I’m following your logic and I don’t think it matters which way you do it.

Please correct me if I’m wrong here but effectively you are doing this equation: a + b = c.

• A = school (2yr commit)
• B= military(4yr commit) to pay off school
• C = successful career. After 6 years paying dues.
• a+b=c is similar to 2+4 =6.

Do you remember the commutative property from school? It states that a+b is equivalent to b+a in a addition equation because the end result doesn’t change. And I think we can abstract and apply this to your position. Why not just take the loans out( who gives a damn what it costs) and then commission as an officer? Have the gov pay for your loans while you are in the military getting experience, as an officer in construction field, from within the military. You should be able to add this clause to your contract. I’m familiar with the navy model, so @Deuterion and @Marc Spector can corrrect me here, but the USAF should have a construction community that’s equivalent to the Seabees( navy construction workers) . These officer gigs should also alleviate the lack of job mobility, getting bossed by children, and should pull you away from frontline work.


Any thoughts?

Mostly right but the bolded is wrong.

If he commissions at 32/33, they'll still be 20-something-year-olds "bossing" him around. Again, if this is for some reason an issue the AF is not for him.

It is much easier for enlisted folks to switch jobs than it is for officers to change AFSCs. Between FTA retraining, NCORP, force shaping, DSDs, there are way more options enlisted wise, and thus actually more mobility (at least laterally).

Also, the officers deploy in CE just like the enlisted folks. If the thought of having to go downrange is a scary to the OP, the AF is not for him. The AF doesn't operate outside of the wire except for specific AFSCs (usually) when deployed, but their is still some inherent danger being in the military, whether officer or enlisted.

 

[Son Goku]

You showed why on this very thread…exhibit A:



Here’s the mistake people like you make and I’m not gonna keep going back and forth with you cuz I already was in Air Force, already make six figures, I’m already where you wanna be and you arguing. But the mistake people like you make, is you go in “open” and then when you get to boot camp and talk to a job counselor they give you a list of jobs to choose from and guess what….NONE OF THE shyt YOU WANT IS THERE. So now they asking you to pick a job and your dream bases but you have no internet connection to research those jobs, nobody to ask about quality of life on the job because everyone around you is a trainee, and you got one week to decide your top 8 but it’s a highly stressful week with minimal downtime. Now there could be positive outcomes in the situation but I personally don’t like leaving things to chance in a system like military where you can’t technically quit

I remember a guy hated his job so much, he took off and went home. When his plane landed, it was held at the gate…no one could exit…suddenly two Air Force personnel came onboard to arrest him. I watched him get punished for 8 months with him getting stripes taken and given and taken back…and he had to pay for it on all ABUs. Finally they kicked him out.

Military ain’t a game…your employer owns you…they tell you where to be and when and you have to do it. If they say you can’t have a motorcycle then you can’t have one. They give you your food, your clothing, your shelter, and for all that you’re their bytch. If you gonna be there bytch, it’s better to be their bytch doing something that enriches you…be their computer bytch or construction bytch.

Bolded is facts. Dumb nikkas I went to boot with that did no research beforehand were food. I went open (general) but had researched all general jobs and knew what every AFSC on the list was so I listed mine right then and there, no issues. (They didn't give us a week when I went, we all ranked our jobs right there on the spot.)

Still got a job I didn't want even though jobs I did want were on the list.

 

[Ezekiel 25:17]

@Ezekiel 25:17 This doesn't seem like a good idea. @Marc Spector and @Deuterion already told you some of the pitfalls that brehs can fall in. Most of them are situational.


The reason I say this isn't a good idea is because of the time. For you to get a specific AFSC you're gonna have to have divine help or wait hella long. Some recruiters won't let you wait for specific jobs, and the AF is not hurting for bodies rn, especially after the depression caused by covid.


What you majored in and even your ASVAB will have little if anything to do with what job you get: recruiting flight chiefs pick the jobs and unless you're doing one with very specific requirements (either academically like Cardiopulmonary Lab or physically like Pararescue), what you want prolly won't matter. Some jobs are so rare that recruiters don't even see them. Remember, the ASVAB is only a requirement to get a job, not a consideration to be matched with one.


Your mindset is also off IMO. If your only goal is to to school, aim to get an AFSC that has a short tech school and doesn't deploy or TDY that much. The shorter your tech school, the sooner you finish it and BMT and be on to your first duty station. Your leadership won't let you take any classes until your upgrade training is finished, so the sooner that gets knocked out the sooner you can go to school. Any jobs that deploy a lot (like a lot of those CE jobs) might end up messing up your schedule, though you can still go to class downrange.


Those CE jobs can get you certs and experience, but a cake personnel or medical job with no nights/weekends/shifts can give you more flexibility to knock out your schooling.


Honestly, a vast majority of cats ITT prolly ain't never served in the AF so take their advice with a grain of salt. Except for a very few career fields the Air Force is exactly like any other corporate/office job. Imagine an episode of The Office: you're gonna have corny ass mangers (officers and SNCOs) like Michael Scott; cutthroat muhfukkas that will do you dirty like Dwight; broads that are nothing but drama like Kelly, etc.


There are pros and cons, and a lot of it is situational. Who cares if somebody younger than you is telling you what to do? If that person has the experience/rank to call the shots, let em. If shyt goes sideways, they're gonna go to the one making the calls first anyways. Dudes always bring up that weak ass argument for some reason. If you're not mature enough to take directions from a boss that's younger than you are and KIM, the military is not for you anyways.

Looks like I'll be going to University then, it'll only be 2 years. Will be in debt with no savings, that's the major downside. Tuition is $15000 per semester

 

[Son Goku]

lemme know if you get station in SoCal or Ft Walton

He not getting Hurby/Eglin.

 

[Marc Spector]

@Ezekiel 25:17 This doesn't seem like a good idea. @Marc Spector and @Deuterion already told you some of the pitfalls that brehs can fall in. Most of them are situational.


The reason I say this isn't a good idea is because of the time. For you to get a specific AFSC you're gonna have to have divine help or wait hella long. Some recruiters won't let you wait for specific jobs, and the AF is not hurting for bodies rn, especially after the depression caused by covid.


What you majored in and even your ASVAB will have little if anything to do with what job you get: recruiting flight chiefs pick the jobs and unless you're doing one with very specific requirements (either academically like Cardiopulmonary Lab or physically like Pararescue), what you want prolly won't matter. Some jobs are so rare that recruiters don't even see them. Remember, the ASVAB is only a requirement to get a job, not a consideration to be matched with one.


Your mindset is also off IMO. If your only goal is to to school, aim to get an AFSC that has a short tech school and doesn't deploy or TDY that much. The shorter your tech school, the sooner you finish it and BMT and be on to your first duty station. Your leadership won't let you take any classes until your upgrade training is finished, so the sooner that gets knocked out the sooner you can go to school. Any jobs that deploy a lot (like a lot of those CE jobs) might end up messing up your schedule, though you can still go to class downrange.


Those CE jobs can get you certs and experience, but a cake personnel or medical job with no nights/weekends/shifts can give you more flexibility to knock out your schooling.

THIS.

Only time youre academics play a part is when yourre coming in as a Specialty Profession Officer (dr., scientists, engineer, chaplain, nurse, lawyer,) or ir applies to a job thats undermanned. Otherwise the Air Force places you wherever they need you. shyt i saw many officers who didnt want to be Cyber Officers, get slotted as Cyber Officers .

@Ezekiel 25:17 honestly dude, with your plan being heavily contingent on choosing your job AND still being able to complete school on your terms, you really should look at the Reserves or ANG. Did I mention that ALOT of ANG units have Full Tuition Programs for state schools? You could enlist, finish up school (debt free) then turn around and commission in either active duty or your ANG unit.....

 

[Son Goku]

The Air force has the 3E AFSC series that Civil Engineering/Construction jobs fall under:

• 3E0XX Electrical Systems
• 3E1XX Heating, Ventilation, AC, Refrigeration
• 3E2XX Pavement and Construction Equipment
• 3E3XX Structural
• 3E4XX Water and Fuel Systems Maintenance
• 3E5XX Engineering
• 3E6XX Operations Management
• 3E7XX Fire Protection
• 3E8XX Explosive Ordnance Disposal
• 3E9XX Emergency Management

As for a Expeditionary CE Unit, we have Red Horse and Prime Beef. But unless youre a Reserve/ANG unit, its not a permanent assignment.

OP old as ain't tryna do EOD, so scratch that off. You also forgot Pest Management, which is chill af, but I don't want to be an Air Force exterminator.


EM can be kinda boring but is not really construction related. Same thing with Fire. That leaves only the 3E0-3E6 jobs.


EA (3E5) and Ops (3E6) would be the best bet based on his goals IMO. Dirt Boyz might not be bad.

 

[...and some waffle fries]

Breh you're assuming I would take any job. You're assuming I'd go open, when I know open means they put you in any job with an opening. There is no reason for me to choose any job because that's not my career field in the civilian world.

You said go in with a plan, if you read the op you would've seen my plan.

The plan is going into the Construction field, that way after 4 year I'll have that experience under my belt to transfer to the civilian world and a Bachelor's degree.

I get that you have your ultimate goal formatted but you kinda dismissing valuable information that guys are trying to give you.

Plus it appears like you have the attitude that you have it all figured out. When in fact you are not accounting for ALOT things within those 4 yrs that youll encounter because you DONT know.

For instance you have a associates degree which means you have minimum of 60 hours. What is your exact plan and where are going to find the time to complete the other 60?

Military Obligations come first! When you complete BMT and Tech School you have things called CDCs. These are mandatory and have to be completed before school.

You are going to be working 8 hrs a day not including if your squadron does morning PT. You really only gon have time to take 3 credit hours and thats after work. And thats assuming your job doesnt have swing or mid shifts.

Anybody thats been Active Duty knows that your base and leadership determines ALOT of how you experience the military. 1 base you want to get out ASAP another base you wanna stay in til they kick you out.

Point is your day to day as a 1st term airman is not going to be a fluid as you think. Its alot of stuff I havent touched like EPRs which can make or break you even if you plan to get out in 4 because thats how you are judged as a airman.

Just saying

 

[Deuterion]

We were doing 8 hour shifts at first around 2009 and then we switched to 12 hour shifts but usually it was about an hour before shift we had to show up for daily briefings and arming up.

Damn sorry to hear that you went through that.

@Ezekiel 25:17


There are pros and cons, and a lot of it is situational. Who cares if somebody younger than you is telling you what to do?If that person has the experience/rank to call the shots, let em. If shyt goes sideways, they're gonna go to the one making the calls first anyways. Dudes always bring up that weak ass argument for some reason. If you're not mature enough to take directions from a boss that's younger than you are and KIM, the military is not for you anyways.

It’s not something that’s exclusive to the military, I see it a lot in Corporate America too which is why when you have older direct reports you have to be super cautious about how you handle them in order to earn their respect. The difference though is that in Corporate America…if a new hot shot 25 year old boss steps on the scene making more than the older workers and they are upset, they can leave. If that happens in the military, you can’t do shyt about it. Ontop of that, your social network and your home are all connected to your work so you can’t just freely talk shyt like you do when you leave the office because there’s a huge chance it can get back.

I just like to make sure people can fully envision what they are signing up for because it’s super easy to sign…you can go to the Naval Recruiters office and sign paper work today and in one year from now be on the biggest ship you’ve ever been on pulling up to a country you ain’t ever seen before. The military makes it super easy to sign up for something that has huuuge ramifications and so once again I like to make it as real as possible for people considering.

For instance, the Air Force marketing had jets all over the documentation….pilots and cool shyt but when you got to boot camp they were like “this aint your grandpa’s Air Force, we’re warriors…the more you sweat in training the less you bleed in war”. A collective gasp was let out:






“Yo, that’s not what the recruiting pamphlet said”.

When I was at MEPs signing my contract I read that bytch and that the bottom it said “All AFSCs will be required to bare arms” and I knew what the real was…nikka this about killing, it aint about college.

 

[Son Goku]

Damn sorry to hear that you went through that.



It’s not something that’s exclusive to the military, I see it a lot in Corporate America too which is why when you have older direct reports you have to be super cautious about how you handle them in order to earn their respect. The difference though is that in Corporate America…if a new hot shot 25 year old boss steps on the scene making more than the older workers and they are upset, they can leave. If that happens in the military, you can’t do shyt about it. Ontop of that, your social network and your home are all connected to your work so you can’t just freely talk shyt like you do when you leave the office because there’s a huge chance it can get back.

I just like to make sure people can fully envision what they are signing up for because it’s super easy to sign…you can go to the Naval Recruiters office and sign paper work today and in one year from now be on the biggest ship you’ve ever been on pulling up to a country you ain’t ever seen before. The military makes it super easy to sign up for something that has huuuge ramifications and so once again I like to make it as real as possible for people considering.

For instance, the Air Force marketing had jets all over the documentation….pilots and cool shyt but when you got to boot camp they were like “this aint your grandpa’s Air Force, we’re warriors…the more you sweat in training the less you bleed in war”. A collective gasp was let out:






“Yo, that’s not what the recruiting pamphlet said”.

When I was at MEPs signing my contract I read that bytch and that the bottom it said “All AFSCs will be required to bare arms” and I knew what the real was…nikka this about killing, it aint about college.

You're right, we're not even arguing. Another difference is corporate America you might catch a fade over a disagreement; in the AF you might catch an LOC or maybe an LOR.
I just think it's funny when cats say that like a civilian job will only have supervisors older than you in it.

Only way to avoid that possible situation is to start your own shyt.

 

[Deuterion]

I get that you have your ultimate goal formatted but you kinda dismissing valuable information that guys are trying to give you.

Plus it appears like you have the attitude that you have it all figured out. When in fact you are not accounting for ALOT things within those 4 yrs that youll encounter because you DONT know.

For instance you have a associates degree which means you have minimum of 60 hours. What is your exact plan and where are going to find the time to complete the other 60?

Military Obligations come first! When you complete BMT and Tech School you have things called CDCs. These are mandatory and have to be completed before school.

You are going to be working 8 hrs a day not including if your squadron does morning PT. You really only gon have time to take 3 credit hours and thats after work. And thats assuming your job doesnt have swing or mid shifts.

Anybody thats been Active Duty knows that your base and leadership determines ALOT of how you experience the military. 1 base you want to get out ASAP another base you wanna stay in til they kick you out.

Point is your day to day as a 1st term airman is not going to be a fluid as you think. Its alot of stuff I havent touched like EPRs which can make or break you even if you plan to get out in 4 because thats how you are judged as a airman.

Just saying

…yup and don’t don’t forget to mention the Community College of the Air Force scam shyt they got going on. The Recruiter is like “oh you can go to the CCAF to finish your degree” and then you get there and they only got classes that help with Air Force jobs and some of the units don’t even transfer out to traditional colleges. Most of the time I had 18 hour days…I had no shot at getting a degree, because the needs of the Air Force came before any shyt I had going one.

 

[Ezekiel 25:17]

I get that you have your ultimate goal formatted but you kinda dismissing valuable information that guys are trying to give you.

Plus it appears like you have the attitude that you have it all figured out. When in fact you are not accounting for ALOT things within those 4 yrs that youll encounter because you DONT know.

For instance you have a associates degree which means you have minimum of 60 hours. What is your exact plan and where are going to find the time to complete the other 60?

Military Obligations come first! When you complete BMT and Tech School you have things called CDCs. These are mandatory and have to be completed before school.

You are going to be working 8 hrs a day not including if your squadron does morning PT. You really only gon have time to take 3 credit hours and thats after work. And thats assuming your job doesnt have swing or mid shifts.

Anybody thats been Active Duty knows that your base and leadership determines ALOT of how you experience the military. 1 base you want to get out ASAP another base you wanna stay in til they kick you out.

Point is your day to day as a 1st term airman is not going to be a fluid as you think. Its alot of stuff I havent touched like EPRs which can make or break you even if you plan to get out in 4 because thats how you are judged as a airman.

Just saying

Yeah I know they work 8 hour shifts. Some work 12 hour shifts. I figure I take 3 to 6 credit hours a semester, that will total about 9 credits per year.

 

[Deuterion]

You're right, we're not even arguing. Another difference is corporate America you might catch a fade over a disagreement; in the AF you might catch an LOC or maybe an LOR.
I just think it's funny when cats say that like a civilian job will only have supervisors older than you in it.

Only way to avoid that possible situation is to start your own shyt.

Yeah I feel you on that. I like how you referenced the office because it’s so true…in the end, you’re working around the same people you’d work around in Corporate America just in a system that owns you rather than in Corporate America where it effectively rents you. So since it owns you, it’s a little more stomp down in how it handles shyt and what it expects from you. I’ve personally met some of the stupidest people I’ve met in my whole life serving in the USAF.