If he completely retired tomorrow, Would Eminem be Top5 dead or alive?

Kenyan West

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Top five dead or alive? Personally, of course. :smugbiden: However, I can understand why others may not feel the same way. So there will never be an argument from me there. For others, you have two deceased emcees who are guaranteed spots in the top five, no matter what. Add the pinnacle of the game, Jay Z in there. Nas. Throw another rapper in there and there you have it. 96% of every hip hop fan’s top five. Arguing top five is ridiculous when everyone’s top five looks damn near the same. :aicmon:

But if Eminem perished tomorrow… there’s no way in hell you can tell me that the white boy is NOT top ten. Granted, Eminem’s discography is all over the place, but so are the majority of rappers. In fact, I think his discog is pretty standard. Biggie and Tupac met their demise early and went out with great but small discographies, but they definitely would have seen themselves become the villian if they survived. No way in hell they would have been to adapt the game like Jay Z. Speaking of which, even Jay da GAWD had subpar albums like Kingdom Come and Vol 3. Nas had Nastradamus and Streets Disciple. We all know how Rakim went out. Same with Cube. Same with whoever.

A lot of people try to say that the only reason Eminem is mentioned in top rapper discussions by the media is because of his race, and that’s completely ridiculous. Granted, it plays a part, but a lot of his recognition is because of his skill, which is incredible. Give the white boy props, he’s still a beast on the mic and overall, there’s very few rappers out in the game who can go head to head with him. Maybe his next album will be the one that’ll get brehs to realize. Hopefully.

Admittedly, Eminem IS corny and he HAS made garb songs like Just Lose it, Fack etc. But I attribute that to his warped sense of humor and the fact that dude IS WHITE. I think I saw some nicca say Em is forgettable because his songs have no soul. :russ:

But, real shyt, those goofy songs like those are like 1% of his shyt, so I will never understand the focus on them. Everyone knows the great amount of songs from his first three albums, but even his recent shyt – I’m a huge fan of Relapse for example – is wonderfully crafted. Even Recovery had gems like Seduction, Going Through Changes, No Love, etc. I think he’s still got it. The talent is extremely evident when he’s around Royce, for damn sure.

Ultimately, I feel you have to dig deeper to understand Em sometimes. For example, with Relapse, A lot of niccas focused on the accents, but underneath it all, he was spitting some insane shyt on top of top notch production. It was a concept album -- What would a serial killer sound like if he made a rap album? What if I had no limits on what I could say? Recovery was about him overcoming his drug addiction, so all of the pop sounds and the skyler grey esque hooks made sense. :yeshrug:

Niccas will forever be alienated by shyt like this, so unfortunately, I feel Eminem will never get true respect from hip hop fans. Overall, though, his discog are not bad albums. I’ll give yall Encore, however. But for me, he's one of the greats easily -- even if he died tomorrow.
 

NOSaintsFan02

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He's always gonna get mentioned with the hip hop mount rushmore of Jay, Biggie, Pac, and him whether people wanna admit it or not. Just from an impact and "safe bet" choosing, people are gonna list Em with top rappers, whether he's socially accepted in the streets or not.
 

AMcV'88

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Still Benefited

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The bias against Em on here is ridiculous. Em is unquestionably in my top 5 all time.:salute:

Heres my top 10 artists in order for reference, oh and I am black. Skills, longevity, and impact goes into my list.

Jay
Nas
Eminem
Pac
Big
Kanye
Common
Rakim
Ice Cube
KRS-One
(Honorable mentions: LL Cool J, Ghostface, Black Thought, Big Daddy Kane, G rap, Scarface, Andre 3000)

People need to get off the fact that Em is the biggest selling artist in hip hop history and wouldn't get the same credit if he was black, he himself has said if he was black he would have sold half, but that his skill shouldn't be overlooked, go back and listen to Til I Collapse.

Bottom line, Em has ALWAYS had diverse subject matter, and is probably the most open mc in history regarding his personal life, people get too caught up in the zany Slim Shady persona, but that's just a part of who he is and shows his versatlity, he couldnt have the hustler persona like Jay or street poet persona like Nas, it wouldnt fit him.

Also, Em imo next to Kanye is one of the most creative songwriters in rap history, Lose Yourself, 8 Mile, Stay Wide Awake, Toy Soldiers, Rock Bottom, Hailies Song, Stan etc etc, Em has loads of diverse and awesome material. Em's 1st 3 albums are all at least near classics in my view, Encore and Recovery were weak and Relapse was solid, add on Infinite and 8 Mile soundtrack and countless classic collabs, Em has put in work. Fuk the sales, just considering skill in music Em should be in everyone's top 10. :smugdraper:

Pac behind Em:childplease:...id tend to agree with you if a black rapper wuz as diverse and had the concept songs and wuz as skilled as Eminem he would be ranked higher....but u do understand Eminem is white don't you?his "pain" is just not relateable,his subject matter became corny after the first album and can be off putting to black people:manny:..if a white persoon has him as there goat I can understand bcuz maybe they relate to what he's sayin...I don't know how a white person could have Cube in they top 5 but sum manage....sum people just have a different way of listening to music,I gotta FEEL the music....Eminem shoulda been born black or at least Paul Wall if he wanted his music to be enjoyable for black folks like that:mjpls:...tough break,I'm sure hell get over it by having the most sales of all time on the back of sum of the worst singles and songs I've ever heard recorded in the history of rap by anybody who supposedly wants to be taken serious....and nikkas got the nerve to bring up Ghetto Techno around here:childplease:...ever heard "the real slim shady"...and race ain't the only thing just the main thing,Brutha Lynch if he didn't do horrorcore and rap about eating baby nuts I think would be a lot higher on my list....even if its a few lines in a song it can fuk the whole thing up...go from :obama: to :whoa: in a millasecond.
 

DameDawgy

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Pac behind Em:childplease:...id tend to agree with you if a black rapper wuz as diverse and had the concept songs and wuz as skilled as Eminem he would be ranked higher....but u do understand Eminem is white don't you?his "pain" is just not relateable,his subject matter became corny after the first album and can be off putting to black people:manny:..if a white persoon has him as there goat I can understand bcuz maybe they relate to what he's sayin...I don't know how a white person could have Cube in they top 5 but sum manage....sum people just have a different way of listening to music,I gotta FEEL the music....Eminem shoulda been born black or at least Paul Wall if he wanted his music to be enjoyable for black folks like that:mjpls:...tough break,I'm sure hell get over it by having the most sales of all time on the back of sum of the worst singles and songs I've ever heard recorded in the history of rap by anybody who supposedly wants to be taken serious....and nikkas got the nerve to bring up Ghetto Techno around here:childplease:...ever heard "the real slim shady"...and race ain't the only thing just the main thing,Brutha Lynch if he didn't do horrorcore and rap about eating baby nuts I think would be a lot higher on my list....even if its a few lines in a song it can fuk the whole thing up...go from :obama: to :whoa: in a millasecond.

What's up with y'all niccas and this "you can't relate to em" cuz he's white shyt. If I was to go off just that than Phonte would be my g.o.a.t. Pink Floyd is my fav. band of all time even if I can't "relate" to them, good music is good music. Plus in reality, Em's upbringing was similiar to any other poor person growing up in the midwest regardless of race, not like he grew up privileged just cuz the color of his skin. :rudy:
 

The Ruler 09

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You gotta be kidding. Em spits pain, anger, and frustration on the track. Jay-Z comes no where close to making Kim, Stan, Rock Bottom or If I had.

Drop the World verse :wow: and he killed No Love. To spit pain like that you have to be on the level of Pac, Scarface or B.I.G. I don't see how Em is overrated. He does so many things well. This is why I rate him so high, every rapper peaks and only produce 3 or 4 great albums, Em posseses those same stats. And he was ridiculous from 1997 to 2002 before the new era kicked off. All you guys favorites like Rakim, Ice Cube and Nas had similiar 3 or 4 album runs.

Em seems and feels like a gimmick to me, probably because he is one. I have heard him spit pain, frustration and anger yes. But there's more to life than that, plus his vein of pain, frustration and anger I don't find diverse. I don't need to hear songs from Jay about killing his baby's mother which he never would do anyway. I find doing that disrespectful to the child, Nas handled the situation in a more grown man manner in my opinion. I wasn't feeling his Drop The World verses at all, think Wayne was better personally. I don't feel the pain Pac had in Em's music, and I don't feel Scarface or even Big's. Maybe Em's music don't represent the street enough for me, I don't relate and I don't feel it and I don't think it's that dope either. Not saying he's completely talentless, but musically i don't feel it. I ain't got no hate towards anyone who disagrees but that's just my opinion and feelings on the matter. I think Rakim far supersedes Em, and so does Nas, Nas has a much higher more diverse and better quality body of work in my opinion. Certain people I listen to like KRS-One and K-Rino comparatively make Eminem seem like an immature baby to me so I can't fukk with his music. But differences of opinions make things interesting and incite debates.
 

Rem

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He somehow spectacularly managed to not translate his amazing talent into his catalogue( the only thing that will matter 50 years from now) and that'll hurt his legacy (in hip hop) big time.

His peak was very high, but his catalog lacks severely relative to the elite rappers. Nas for example has like 3 albums that's better than any album Eminem ever released, Big 2, Jay at least 2, pac at least 2, Ghost likewise.

The commercial relevance he has over these rappers(most of whom have been pretty damn big themselves in their careers) is not enough to mask the deficiencies in his catalogue relative to them.
 

The Ruler 09

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It's nothing to do with the fact he's white I can't fukk with Eminem, it's Eminem individually, I like Brother Ali, Vinnie Paz, Slug, Lowkey (not sure of some of these backgrounds) Skinnyman and others so being white or any colour doesn't matter to me. But I feel Brother ALi spits real music I can relate to, but a lot of Eminem's content like raping his mother, and weird psychopathic shyt I don't relate to at all.
 
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He somehow spectacularly managed to not translate his amazing talent into his catalogue( the only thing that will matter 50 years from now) and that'll hurt his legacy (in hip hop) big time.

His peak was very high, but his catalog lacks severely relative to the elite rappers. Nas for example has like 3 albums that's better than any album Eminem ever released, Big 2, Jay at least 2, pac at least 2, Ghost likewise.

The commercial relevance he has over these rappers(most of whom have been pretty damn big themselves in their careers) is not enough to mask the deficiencies in his catalogue relative to them.

thread should end on that fact alone..
 

Billy Ocean

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...id tend to agree with you if a black rapper wuz as diverse and had the concept songs and wuz as skilled as Eminem he would be ranked higher....

You're gonna tell me that if a black artist, with the same skill and diversity and concept songs as Eminem were to come along he would be ranked higher? First...there has been a number of emcees as skilled and diverse as Em. Did they ever have even a modicum of Eminem's acclaim? Eminem gets rated over dudes with otherworldly skills and have been much more consistent. Common, Blackthought, Redman, etc..should be ranked above Eminem in GOAT lists. Second...Eminem HIMSELF on several occasions ADMITTED that his success is greatly attributed to his skin color.
 

Mike Otherz

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i honestly dont think em even deserves a top 20 spot. the only criteria em gets in on is technical ability. no one can deny him that. but his music is not enjoyable. it has no groove. no replayebilty. its amoral and doesnt hold up. i understand his has 2 types of fans, poor white people who get a cathartic experience for em relaying their poor white people struggles. and rich white people who want a white rapper to be the best rapper ever on some white supremace isht. but on artistry, he falls a long way short. i loved em as a kid, then i grew up, and boy, its definitely music for kids and emotionally crippled adults. technical ability is great though.
 

Still Benefited

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What's up with y'all niccas and this "you can't relate to em" cuz he's white shyt. If I was to go off just that than Phonte would be my g.o.a.t. Pink Floyd is my fav. band of all time even if I can't "relate" to them, good music is good music. Plus in reality, Em's upbringing was similiar to any other poor person growing up in the midwest regardless of race, not like he grew up privileged just cuz the color of his skin. :rudy:

Sumbody who grew up poor in a trailer park don't neccesarily talk like me,or think how I think....Em mighta grew up poor but don't seem like he grew up around black folks...a black person that doesn't think like me or discuss shyt I can relate to won't go over well with me....people hate Drake for the same reasons,sum hate concious rap for the same reason...I don't see why hating Em of all people is so damn outrageous:what:....maybe u right good music is good music....maybe I wuz just giving an excuse as to why MAYBE I didn't think it wuz good so maybe my opinion might be bias as I can't relate to too much about him....but maybe his music is just wack period and not good and that's why I don't like it:manny:
 
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