IS GOD REAL?????
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the cac mamba
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why?
if god was just "always there" as everyone who believes in him says (and cannot explain any better than that), why couldnt the universe just always have been here?
if people are content to say that "god was just always here and created the earth", then im equally content saying that the universe was always here as well, and that my purpose is not to serve some cosmic being who feels
about me beating my dikk every once in a while
why?
if god was just "always there" as everyone who believes in him says (and cannot explain any better than that), why couldnt the universe just always have been here?
if people are content to say that "god was just always here and created the earth", then im equally content saying that the universe was always here as well, and that my purpose is not to serve some cosmic being who feels
Because as much as we have been able to explain with science. In the grand scheme of things we know NOTHING and we will NEVER be able to answer the real questions about our existence.
The way the earth, the universe, and life intertwine perfectly, i don't think it was just chance. I'm not sayin god is siting in the heavens directing things or being
when you fap. I'm not even saying god is a being that we can comprehend. But there is intelligence to the way the universe works. And we would be naive to believe all of this is by chance. Something happend other than just a random big bang.
WhiteDawg3000
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dayum
will add to this thread later... dope shyt so far
will add to this thread later... dope shyt so far
How is it arrogant when that's what the evidence points to? I think it's pretty arrogant to say a god must be responsible. You say there must be a god when there is no objective evidence of such an entity. The only "evidence" is your incredulity. I'm sorry, but just because you don't believe "all of this happened by chance" doesn't validate the God hypothesis.
The fact that you think you know there are things we cannot know is very arrogant, IMO. How do you know what can and can't ever be known?
The way the earth, the universe, and life intertwine perfectly, i don't think it was just chance. I'm not sayin god is siting in the heavens directing things or being
Again, you claim to have knowledge but you have no justification for it ... other than some sort of feeling, or your incredulity. Unless there is actual tangible evidence for something happening other than the Big Bang, then you're just talking out of your azz and making shyt up.
The evidence doesn't point to anything. Just as you say I'm making stuff up about god. Scientists MADE up the big bang. If you pay attention to modern science everyday a past truth is discredited. Before it's all said and done a new THEORY will overtake the big bang. Scientist are now trying to identify black matter by recreating the big bang. If they succeed in proving dark matter, the entire theory of gravity will have to be thrown out of the window because black matter wouldn't fit.
What about quantum mechanics? These particles follow none of the rules that science has set about the world. How do we explain that? It's been proven that the universe is expanding faster and faster as time goes on. This is in direct contradiction of the laws of physics that say the expansion should be slowing down. How do we explain this?
I didnt try to validate anything other than MY opinion. I think we as humans are very small and inconsequential when it comes to the real story of the universe. We THINK we understand things but we really don't.
I never claimed to have any more knowledge than anybody else. I said from my experiences and everything that I have learned over the years I believe there is some type of intelligent design to the universe. I don't know for sure and nobody does. Nobody ever will unless "god" comes down and spells it out otherwise all we have is theories and conjecture. I gave my theory you can agree with it or not. But to say science can explain everything is incorrect and has already been proven wrong. And there is no actual tangible evidence of the big bang, it is a THEORY. some scientist got together, made some observations and came up with what they though COULD have happened to get us where we are today. That's not very different from what I did to come up with my opinion on god and our existence.
smh @ this entire post.
What do you mean "made it up"? Scientists looked at the evidence, and it suggested that at some the universe rapidly expanded. Funny enough, it was actually some religious apologist that coined the term "Big Bang", not an actual scientist. But yes, the evidence suggests, or points to, some big bang. This is fact.
Name a scientific theory that has been discredited in the past 24 hours. Or the past week, I'll give you some more time. The fact that you say the Big Bang is a theory implies you don't even know the difference between how layman refer to theories, and how scientists refer to theories in the scientific world. A scientific theory isn't just some guess that someone has about a certain event. To achieve that title, a hypothesis must go through a strenuous amount of critical review, and testing. Ideas don't just BECOME theories.
Even if we find something that contradicts with one facet of gravity, we don't just throw-out the entire theory of gravity, we add to it. You seem to be of the mind-state that tomorrow we may find something which will completely mean physics as we know it is completely wrong. Quantum mechanics, for example, describes a phenomena of which we do not YET have an explanation. It may even seem counter-intuitive to us as laymen, but that doesn't mean it completely contradicts physics as we know it. Once we discover, and understand more about physics, we will add on to it, and try to further explain these events.
You are correct in that we don't know everything. But you fall victim to the same fallacious reasoning that theists do when you appeal to a God. Just because we don't know everything doesn't give more weight to your God claims. It might one day be proven that there is a God responsible for this all. But the time to believe that idea is true is when there is actual evidence for a God. Not "ohh, we don't know everything, and it seems unlikely that all of this wasn't intelligently designed, so I'm going to believe it was". No. That's an argument from ignorance, and a logical fallacy.
A scientific theory is just that a THEORY. it has been reviewed and agreed upon by the scientific community. But is has not been PROVEN. you can say all the evidence points to it. But there are other theories of the origin of the universe that are being more widely accepted as we speak. In the past we thought the earth was flat and we were the center of the universe. Scientists had irrefutable evedence to prove this theory and it was the widely accepted THEORY of the universe. We have since proved this to be incorrect. And I bet future generations will look back at us like
"they thought the big bang was correct". And yes if we prove the existence of dark matter, the theories of gravity and physics will have to be altered dramatically. And we can't just alter LAWS of physics. These LAWS are definite, no exceptions. If we find exceptions they were never laws in the first place.
Neutrinos Travel Faster Than Light, According to One Experiment - ScienceNOW
^^^^^^if this theory is proven and accepted by the scientific comunity than we have to throw out the theory of special relativity that dictates NOTHING can move faster than the speed of light.
You claim all this knowledge about the science of what you think you know. But you are just as much a sheep as a religious person except your god is a scientist.
Do you know why scientists came up with the idea of dark matter? It's because as of right now the theories of physics and gravity are clashing. In order for the theories of physics and gravity to hold true in the universe there has to be something that we can't see exerting energy on all particles. They don't know what it is or what it does but they feel it "has" to be there cause they can't explain the physics of the unreverse any other way. Either they have to throw out the laws of physics and gravity, or they have to add some unknown "thing" to make our old theories work.
Now tell me is this ^^^^^ very different from my reasoning for believing in a higher being?
And again im not saying for sure that there is or isn't a god. But the evidence that we have points to some type of intelligent design. Now this design doesn't have to contradict science. In fact science could go hand in hand with this design. The big bang could be true, but that doesnt mean it wasn't set in motion by some type of intelligence. And by intelligence I dont mean a person or a being that we can equate to or call "god" I mean something, some kind of intelligent spark that at least layed the rules for our universe.
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God is as real as anything else is; that is, the concept of god is about perception and subjectivity than rather than objectivity. By ascribing characteristics, emotions, names, feelings, creations to something that is beyond our scope, actually amounts to humans "creating god", therefore, one can argue that we might be "gods".
A scientific theory is just that a THEORY. it has been reviewed and agreed upon by the scientific community. But is has not been PROVEN. you can say all the evidence points to it. But there are other theories of the origin of the universe that are being more widely accepted as we speak. In the past we thought the earth was flat and we were the center of the universe. Scientists had irrefutable evedence to prove this theory and it was the widely accepted THEORY of the universe. We have since proved this to be incorrect. And I bet future generations will look back at us like
No sir, you are again wrong. Since about 300 BC, educated people did not believe in the concept of a flat Earth. It was in fact, the church and religious people who wanted to cling to scripture that supported what they thought was obvious. It wasn't that there was all this scientific evidence for a flat Earth -- that was the default. That was because we all experience what seems to be a flat Earth. It seems as though the Earth is stationary because we don't feel it moving. We walk on flat land. A round Earth seemed counter-intuitive, so a lot of people held the opposing belief, and threatened those who argued for a round Earth. But once we had the technology to actually explore our universe, we were able to discover the truth.
You're saying that there must be a intelligent designer causing all of this. You're no different than the religious skeptics of a round earth. I predict people centuries from now are going to think
"They thought a supernatural man created this"No dude, laws only apply to the conditions of which they were established. For example, there are certain things Newton's law of gravity doesn't explain. Why? Because it only applies for weak gravitational fields. Laws only apply to circumstances of which we've already observed. So if something completely different happens that seems to contradict what we know about gravity, that doesn't change the validity of the law.
It's not being a sheep. Each of us specialize in our various fields of work, so I have to rely on the process. But I understand it's limitations. You don't seem to understand.
Yes! Because there's a tangible and measurable effect that we've observed that this dark matter is causing to other celestial bodies. We realize we just don't yet have the understanding of what that matter is yet.
You on the other hand start with the assumption that the only way the universe could have happened the way it did is if some intelligence beyond the physical universe guided it. Then you use life, and natural laws to justify said assumption. This is NOT what the aforementioned scientists are doing.
Well, 95% of scientists who actaully study this stuff, DISAGREES WITH YOU. So.... are the hundreds of thousands of scientists wrong, or are you, the several hundred scientists and the masses wrong? I guess we'll have to wait and see.
who the fukk do u think you are
A Christian
Doesn't matter when they figured it out. Fact is it was studied and proven scientifically before it was disproven. At the time when the theory was accepted all of the evidence we had proved the earth was flat and stationary. As we gained more technology and knowledge we were able to see the bigger picture which contradicted initial observations. Our knowledge and technology are still improving, meaning we will continue to see the bigger picture over and over again and past theories will be discredited. Why should the big bang, gravity, or any other scientific theory be any different. They will all change when we discover the "truth" and then they will all change again when someone else finds out the "truth" yes scientist like to flaunt "physical" evidence but at the end of the day their just making educated guesses like the rest of us.
You're saying that there must be a intelligent designer causing all of this. You're no different than the religious skeptics of a round earth. I predict people centuries from now are going to think
You are right I am no different than others that tried to make sense of the world around them and you aren't either. Difference is I have no arbitrary rulebook that I have to follow in order to come up with my opinion. I am a very open minded person and as you can see I take this question very seriously and I have strived to learn the most I can about it. I have studied both scientific theories and religion and I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle. Your so stuck on trying to disprove the religious idea of "god" that you are not understanding what I am trying to say. I never said ANYTHING about a supernatural man. IF there is a "god" he damn sure isn't a man, and IT probably isn't even fathomable or observable by humans.
No, laws are definate here is a description for you:
Several general properties of physical laws have been identified (see Davies (1992) and Feynman (1965) as noted, although each of the characterizations are not necessarily original to them). Physical laws are:
True, at least within their regime of validity. By definition, there have never been repeatable contradicting observations.
Universal. They appear to apply everywhere in the universe. (Davies, 1992:82)
Simple. They are typically expressed in terms of a single mathematical equation. (Davies)
Absolute. Nothing in the universe appears to affect them. (Davies, 1992:82)
Stable. Unchanged since first discovered (although they may have been shown to be approximations of more accurate lawssee "Laws as approximations" below),
Omnipotent. Everything in the universe apparently must comply with them (according to observations). (Davies, 1992:83)
Generally conservative of quantity. (Feynman, 1965:59)
Often expressions of existing homogeneities (symmetries) of space and time. (Feynman)
Typically theoretically reversible in time (if non-quantum), although time itself is irreversible. (Feynman)
By this decription if something comes up that changes the law of gravity it was never a law in the first place
There is no tangeble evidence of dark matter. There is just evidence that the universe isn't exactly following our laws of physics and gravity. We can't see or detect it so there is NO evidence of its existence, but according to our prior theories there "must" be something there cause things just don't add up. Just like you said about god, the time to beleve it's true is when we have actual tangible evidence until then it's an argument from ignorance, and a logical fallacy. (I disagree but according to your criteria this is true)
I didn't START with any assumption. I started with all of the evidence of intelligence in the design in the universe. The fact that gravity can be explained with a definate law is evidence of purposeful intelligence. If not gravity wouldn't follow any law. In nature certain numbers and patterns are found more than others. Gravity, time, and space are set to a perfect balance. If any of those forces where any stronger/weaker the universe would implode. This is evidence of some type of intelligence in the creation of the universe. Not just a random series of events. From that evidence or lack thereof I have formed my opinion. This is in fact the same exact thing scientists did when coming up with the theory of dark matter.
Well, 95% of scientists who actaully study this stuff, DISAGREES WITH YOU. So.... are the hundreds of thousands of scientists wrong, or are you, the several hundred scientists and the masses wrong? I guess we'll have to wait and see.[/QUOTE]
Don't know where you get your #s from but plenty of scientists believe in both scientific theory and god, or a higher intelligence. Agreeing with scientific theories does not mean you don't believe in god or religion. In fact the majority of scientists identify as agnostic, which is pretty close to my beliefs. Just like religious people you are stuck at trying to explain things as either or, right or wrong when in all actuality the truth lies in the gray area.
I think it is more likely that there is a God than that there isn't. There is a lot a of order, systems, and patterns which occur naturally and seem to be of intricate design. Sure, it could be happenstance, some sort of combination of the random and our subjective consciousness, but I think that even if the bountiful amounts of natural order, systems and patterns that exist are due to the random, the conditions which exist that allow for the random to occur must come down to an original source, and the product of that original source's creation is miraculous enough to claim that that source is of the supernatural variety. Whether or not the source is still active as a deity is a different question.
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I never understood this logic. Order? Chaos?
I always countered this argument with the opinion that there is no such thing as order and chaos. It's a matter of illusion. Order is an illusion of scale and time.
For example, if you turn on your sprinklers to water your grass, this might seem to you like an even that can be classified under "order", but what about the ants that you are drowning or their colony you are destroying. What is that to them but chaotic?
What about us? Our galaxy is set to collide in a few billion years with another.
Our sun will soon grow and encompass this planet? Is that order?
What about important numbers found in nature being irrational and transcendental? Pi, e, Square root of 2. Is that order?
Come on bro. Order is about as subjective as it gets.