NYT: Boeing Was Certifying Its Own Safety For the 737 Max

el_oh_el

Bulls On Parade...
Supporter
Joined
Aug 23, 2012
Messages
10,394
Reputation
1,925
Daps
26,231
Reppin
H-Town
Hold private sector actors more accountable than the agencies and officials you elect and pay to represent you Brehs:deadrose:
They both fukked up. The govt should not have allowed this lack of proper oversight to happen, but these agencies are sometimes beholden to other interests in a complicated web of influence. I'm sure Boeing chiseled away at certain rules over time, and that combined with funding reductions produces the result you see today.
You have not explained how a private system would work here.
 

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
How do you make profit as an aviation regulator?
Reputation.
The better your reputation the more you can charge. The certification is required so there is no avoiding it.
Competition does the rest.


Lots of money to be made by assuming risk :wow:
Even more to be made if your reputation is impeccable.
 

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
They both fukked up. The govt should not have allowed this lack of proper oversight to happen, but these agencies are sometimes beholden to other interests in a complicated web of influence.
They are tax payer funded... how can they let people die without repercussions.
Do you really believe a private company(Walmart, amazon, Apple, Chick-fil-A) could get hundreds killed today due to negligence and not be in every news channel and facing charges?
:what:
Is the government infallibility really invisible to liberals/leftist.
 

el_oh_el

Bulls On Parade...
Supporter
Joined
Aug 23, 2012
Messages
10,394
Reputation
1,925
Daps
26,231
Reppin
H-Town
They are tax payer funded... how can they let people die without repercussions.
Do you really believe a private company(Walmart, amazon, Apple, Chick-fil-A) could get hundreds killed today due to negligence and not be in every news channel and facing charges?
:what:
Is the government infallibility really invisible to liberals/leftist.
There is no direct decision that can be placed to blame a govt official. Boeing has built up trust thru the years. Through that trust, they were enabled to have more control over the certification process. Unless you have an article stating that XXX official signed off on the specific issue that caused these accidents, the majority of the blame lies with Boeing.
Keep in mind that "government infallibility" is only being parroted by yourself; noone else in here have stated as such..
 

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
There is no direct decision that can be placed to blame a govt official. Boeing has built up trust thru the years. Through that trust, they were enabled to have more control over the certification process. Unless you have an article stating that XXX official signed off on the specific issue that caused these accidents, the majority of the blame lies with Boeing.
Keep in mind that "government infallibility" is only being parroted by yourself; noone else in here have stated as such..
You must have missed the forum when the story broke:ehh:
Fair enough.


Boeing is already self regulating under govt... seems like the fears associated with private regulators are already a reality under government.


:unimpressed:You also just gave government a pass because they trusted Boeing...
The message is clear.
:hubie:I’m done. fukk accountability.
 
Last edited:

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
You'll wait for consumers to decide on whether they want to fall out of the sky? :picard:
No, reputation is determined by consumers.
A track record of safety will produce this.

Currently the FAA can’t be trusted but their monopoly means we gotta risk it.
This isn’t ideal to me.
:yeshrug:


Competition would ruin any company allowing consumers to die.

Imagine how many people would switch to let’s say iOS if people were dying using android.
Only liberals think killing people is good for business in a competitive market.
 

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
J.D. Powers is an example of a reputation based company. Car companies pay them to put their stamp of approval on their products.
Not sure what’s so confusing about the market for this...

In fact the critiques in this thread are exactly what we have under government regulation :deadmanny:
Only in the govt. scenario tax payers are footing the bill.
 

Secure Da Bag

Veteran
Joined
Dec 20, 2017
Messages
43,334
Reputation
22,189
Daps
134,426
No, reputation is determined by consumers.
A track record of safety will produce this.

Currently the FAA can’t be trusted but their monopoly means we gotta risk it.
This isn’t ideal to me.
:yeshrug:


Competition would ruin any company allowing consumers to die.

Imagine how many people would switch to let’s say iOS if people were dying using android.
Only liberals think killing people is good for business in a competitive market.

This is one of those things that shouldn't be left to the consumers. Or the free market. The government should just do their job and regulate Boeing.
 

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
This is one of those things that shouldn't be left to the consumers. Or the free market. The government should just do their job and regulate Boeing.
:francis:If you say so.
The difficulty in holding government accountable makes them a poor choice in my opinion... but I’ma agree to disagree with y’all.

We need a system where heads roll when lives are lost due to negligence.

 

Reality

Make your own luck.
Joined
Jun 16, 2012
Messages
7,189
Reputation
4,235
Daps
38,381
Reppin
NULL
You must have missed the forum when the story broke:ehh:
Fair enough.


Boeing is already self regulating under govt... seems like the fears associated with private regulators are already a reality under government.


:unimpressed:You also just gave government a pass because they trusted Boeing...
The message is clear.
:hubie:I’m done. fukk accountability.

This is hilariously simple minded. For years it's been in the Republican playbook to underfund and hamstring government and regulatory bodies on the one hand and then scream to the public that government doesn't work on the other. Literally what happened here. You deregulate (i.e., let the private company regulate themselves), there's a failure, and then the case is made that the answer is further deregulation. So sinister :wow:, but it works because people like you are gullible as fukk and crucial lack critical thinking skills.

As much as you like to talk about the private market, the way you speak and the ideas you put forth demonstrates you have almost no practical experience in it. I've worked at companies whose sole job was to help other companies come up with new revenue engines. The idea of becoming a "certifier" or standard maker / regulator for a fee in an industry is actually quite common, but is almost always shied away from when it comes to issues of public safety.

No companies want that liability. I've literally explored the issue for numerous companies, those operating from healthcare to corporate security to financial services. No one wants to play this role because the risk return profile is fukking terrible...no capital would flow there. It's because people intrinsically underestimate danger and are overconfident when it comes to risk, which suppresses their willingness to pay to be told whether or not they'd be OK - which is exactly why government regulation is needed (and not in the nominal way that republicans make it, in a robust way). It's a similar principal as to why certain types of insurance needs to be mandated.

Please get your head out of your ass on this issue.
 

DEAD7

Veteran
Supporter
Joined
Oct 5, 2012
Messages
51,321
Reputation
4,570
Daps
89,520
Reppin
Fresno, CA.
This is hilariously simple minded. For years it's been in the Republican playbook to underfund and hamstring government and regulatory bodies on the one hand and then scream to the public that government doesn't work on the other. Literally what happened here. You deregulate (i.e., let the private company regulate themselves), there's a failure, and then the case is made that the answer is further deregulation. So sinister :wow:, but it works because people like you are gullible as fukk and crucial lack critical thinking skills.

As much as you like to talk about the private market, the way you speak and the ideas you put forth demonstrates you have almost no practical experience in it. I've worked at companies whose sole job was to help other companies come up with new revenue engines. The idea of becoming a "certifier" or standard maker / regulator for a fee in an industry is actually quite common, but is almost always shied away from when it comes to issues of public safety.

No companies want that liability. I've literally explored the issue for numerous companies, those operating from healthcare to corporate security to financial services. No one wants to play this role because the risk return profile is fukking terrible...no capital would flow there. It's because people intrinsically underestimate danger and are overconfident when it comes to risk, which suppresses their willingness to pay to be told whether or not they'd be OK - which is exactly why government regulation is needed (and not in the nominal way that republicans make it, in a robust way). It's a similar principal as to why certain types of insurance needs to be mandated.

Please get your head out of your ass on this issue.
This has been a long standing, congressionally approved policy.
It predates Trump.
I appreciate you :cape:for government though.
:hubie:I think we’d better served with an accountable regulator not funded by tax payers and protected by the state.
 

Reality

Make your own luck.
Joined
Jun 16, 2012
Messages
7,189
Reputation
4,235
Daps
38,381
Reppin
NULL
This has been a long standing, congressionally approved policy.
It predates Trump.
I appreciate you :cape:for government though.
:hubie:I think we’d better served with an accountable regulator not funded by tax payers and protected by the state.

I never mentioned Trump.

You didn't address a single issue I raised in my post - probably because your mind is already made up.
 
Top