So are you a fan of the "new" WWE style?

[DANJ!]

I like it...I'd like it more if that nearfall shyt didn't happen ALL THE TIME. Doin' it all the time is just gonna make the crowd expect it more, which takes the suspense away. Crowds used to pop for the set-up move cause it indicated what was coming... now the finisher is like the set-up move for another finisher later on.

That said, a lot of the in-ring work itself is fine by me. A lot of dudes have been forced to step it up lately, and it shows when you see the ones who haven't.

 

[GoddamnyamanProf]

Of course, its an objectively better in-ring product.

Anyone complaining doesnt actually like wrestling or just needs something to complain about all the time.

 

[Art Barr]

It sucks in the WWE because the actual wrasslin sequences that used to open up these matches and create the psychology.
Was interrupted by WWE in favor of the smashmouth main event style.
Then had to succumb to an inferior mix.
So that the son-in-law would not be made to look obsolete when he regains a me slot whenever he wants.
Plus, so he can curtail being exposed as an inferior worker workrate and moveset wise by the higher quality talent in roster.


Art Barr

 

[Art Barr]

00000000000000000000000000000022

I don't hate it, but I wished they reeled it back a bit. Finishers should be protected more (Sami Zayn kicking out of the AA on his first night? Really?) and if there's a big impact move that looks like it should be a finisher, just let that be the finish. I remember Seth and Dean had a good lumberjack match at SummerSlam, but there was one point where one of them got powerbombed on a pile of chairs and they still kicked out! It was like "C'mon man!"

Sami zayn has been through more technical abusive wars than cena if you knew his character.
So, him kicking out is predicated on appeasing his Indy draw.
Even dean and Seth is predicated on dean coming up in czw.
Coupled with Seth being in numerous blood feuds and hof tables matches in other promotions.
Or, that were on roh on DirecTV.
Which the WWE never did, previously.
Evident by when it came time for ultimo to be productive.
Ultimo was jobbing out and although he came to the ring draped in gold jn the WWE. They did not hesitate to have him Job with no resistance..thus ruining and burying the character.
So, the WWE has gotten better at actually giving talent.
that does not fit their aesthetic a larger opp and platform to draw coming from another promotion.
Since the rival large promotion was bought out and the indy's were moved back into the forefront.
Similar to the territory days and eventually lead to the Indy heroes who saved wrasslin. actually being allowed to work with higher quality psychology. than the WWE for more than a decade. outside of Benoit and the later add of cm punk/Morrison style matches and finishes in that era to now.

Art Barr

 

[Art Barr]

I appreciate where you're coming from but the complete lack of selling undermines all of it I feel.

Not necessarily,...
As the former reign of Michael Elgin being roh champion kinda elongated these types of finishes.
So, I appreciate it when it is done to make light of the WWE may recognize their performers past pedigree and workrate.

It also is a component of WWE psychology related to the reviving elbow to hogun as well.
So, WWE has also kept that in their continuity and when it does not include that as a evolving point in workrate.
It also hurts the WWE matches as it makes the talent look inferior to hogun.
So, you kinda have to be a prisoner to this jn the WWE.
As the WWE or wwf shyt the bed a long time ago psychology wise by even having the reviving elbow elongated based psychology.
Which is where the evolution of the psychologh of the urgent finish comes extends from in basic evolution in all of wrasslin domestically.
As domestically wrasslin had to account for the once highest drawing over character.
being brought back to life by a finisher as well.

So WWE had to account for making its largest draw so unbeatable that eventually to keep the product relevent with the domestic audience..it had to be an evolution of the reviving elbow incorporated into the finish.
Which is why, the Bret/hbk mania finish was rated as high as it was as well.
Plus acts as another placeholder to the urgent spam finish as well.


Art Barr

 

[patscorpio]

God no....these new and newer cats don't know how to fukking work...miz is the weird exception to this....the vets could do more but they are stuck on routine mode 80 percent of the time

 

[Osmosis]

All matches feel the same

 

[Slic Ric]

I hate it, and have tuned out 100% because of it

 

[THEREALBRAND]

I don't think its the style as much as its the people that are working it. It feels like guys are just running through a list of spots. When you look at matches like HBK/Taker at Mania or Punk/Cena at MITB yes they had high spots, but they told a story. HBK kicking out of a Tombstone meant something because you were already invested in the match. You don't get that feeling these days.

 

[Buzzed Lightyear]

you forgot the "cue 'this is awesome!' chant."

Yeah that chant lost it's credibility a few years ago. They'll damn near chant that in a Braun Strowman match.

 

[Rayzah]

I can't believe people don't like the improved. Work rate. WWE still has to fine tune it like some have said. Like the 6877 near falls a match and the spam finishers, and they also need to sell the big moves more. I will say I hate the suicide dive, it's done way too much by people that don't need to do it. But overall it's about time wwe stepped it up. Now if they can only move the cruiserweights to smackdown

 

[Lo-Co]

i like it. still needs work like more selling of big moves.

 

[Jmare007]

I don't think its the style as much as its the people that are working it. It feels like guys are just running through a list of spots. When you look at matches like HBK/Taker at Mania or Punk/Cena at MITB yes they had high spots, but they told a story. HBK kicking out of a Tombstone meant something because you were already invested in the match. You don't get that feeling these days.

Actually I think HBK vs Taker at Mania 26 was the beginning of the shift, specially for guys that didn't come with the indy mentality. That match had the big spot-rest and sell death-big spot-nearfall structure that became the staple of every "WWE epic match", and story started to take a back seat. To me, the WM 25 match shyts all over the Mania 26 one.

Punk vs Cena had the story that justified the style though (just like Owens vs Zayn at Battleground, for example), and they delivered in spades. But the problem was that Cena started to mimic that structure from then on and his matches suffered from it imo, the ones were he didn't try to go full PWG (like against Bryan at Summerslam) are way better and stand out more. He had to go next level PWG like against Owens for the first time to reach that level again, and that got old quick as fukk as the rematches showed.

Another important thing is that when HBK and Taker did it, almost nobody else were doing it, and they saved it for the biggest show, so it gave it a special feel. Nowadays it's really hard to get that feeling when we see it so often. shyt, Bailey's matches get that feeling in NXT because she goes away from this style, focuses on the story and then picks and chooses when to do the couple of big spot she'll do.

 

[R=G]

Alot of mediocre no sellers are getting praised every week..lol

 

[stro]

Actually I think HBK vs Taker at Mania 26 was the beginning of the shift, specially for guys that didn't come with the indy mentality. That match had the big spot-rest and sell death-big spot-nearfall structure that became the staple of every "WWE epic match", and story started to take a back seat. To me, the WM 25 match shyts all over the Mania 26 one.
.

The formula was pretty much invented by Austin vs Rock. They did a mild version of it at WM 15, then took it to the next level at 17 and that's been the blue print for WWE epic ever since. Now it's just the WWE style period and people will do it even if they aren't capable of doing it. WWE shows basically have become giant PWG shows, where everyone is going full blast every match on the card and the crowd gets burned out after an hour. Hard to give a shyt about the 8th dive of the night.