Steph Curry has completely WARPED the way we rate players

[Poitier]

The problem with you is (and folks alike), is that not only do you not know how to gauge a player's ISO ability properly, but you fail to realize that NBA basketball isn't a 1v1 sport. You're talking about ISO, ISO, ISO all the time as if that's the ONLY thing matters, which is funny because rarely ever do teams give Curry an opportunity to score in ISO, because they're too afraid of his range/handle. It's the whole reason defenders swarm the vicinity he's in, the moment he crosses halfcourt.

Curry used to score in ISO predominately in Jackson's offense, but the problem with that was, the only player it would benefit was Curry, because that style of play wasn't using his gravity and off-ball ability to get his teammates open looks, and general offensive flow. Now that they do, ever since Kerr took over, players like Barnes, Iggy and Draymond etc get easier shots because of how Curry's used.

Curry could go back to just scoring in ISO, but ultimately what purpose what that serve other than to appease the sensibilities of someone who only cares about 1v1 basketball and not actually winning the game?

I actually value Curry's ability to play off ball but I just value it less than truly elite ISO superstars if talking offensive anchors

If Barnes stays in GS, I don't think Curry sees another title

ISO heavy offensive anchors have done a whole lot of winning in the last 25 years but let yall tell it pace and space is the end all be all and not just another brand of ball

 

[360Waves]

Except I didn't "prove" your point. I drowned it.

What does that have to do with the Warriors having the greatest producing offense of all-time in 2015/16 (when they won 73 games, nonetheless), with players like Draymond, Bogut, Barnes, Ezeli, Iggy, Barbosa etc as Steph's support cast - players who range from below-average shooters to flat-out bad? How can you not see that Steph's "gravity" was the cause behind all of that?

They’re a well coached team who move the ball exceptionally well. Quite literally the only team in the league with guys who can shoot, dribble and pass at 1-5.

I’ve seen Curry against physical defenses and double teams. It’s not pretty. His handle gets shaky and his decision making leads to numerous turnovers. He knows his limitations which is why he rarely attacks doubles and opts to play off the ball while waiting to get open or get a favorable switch. He benefits from having offense all over the floor which prevents teams from being able to double him full time, the biggest risk they’ll ever take is hedging/quickly blitzing off the PnR. He’s a tremendous player but if you threw him on a shooter-less, poorly coached team like Milwaukee tomorrow in place of Giannis they’d be worse.

All you have to do is watch how Kyrie had to work to score against GS versus how Curry did against Boston. shyt is night and day.

Truth be told for as great as Curry is he probably has more “shyt the bed” games against elite competition than any other superstar in the league currently. I mean he gets taken out of games against good comp fairly regularly, Houston being the most recent.

 

[SuaveyBoi115]

Put 05-06 wade in curry shoes in that game 7 against CLE and the warriors win in 2016. I fukk with curry but justat the blatant disrespect for bean and wade. Both were better defenders than curry and Wade put up one of the most historical finals ever in 06, albeit he spent a lot of time at the free throw line

Curry also has the benefit of having a top 10 ATG three point shooter and great defender in Klay hanging in the back court with him.

So Kobe and wade playing with Shaq is not a benefit

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

I actually value Curry's ability to play off ball but I just value it less than truly elite ISO superstars if talking offensive anchors

Except, Curry is great at scoring on and off-ball. I don't see the sense in valuing an ISO player over one who uses all his abilities to generate offense for himself and for his team - maximizing offensive opportunities. ISO superstars can NEVER generate offense for their teammates the way a player who's equally abled on/off-ball. It just simply isn't possible.

I regularly hear folks talking about x-player makes his teammates better, when it doesn't make any sense, because they don't. Curry's practically the only player who that applies to: he generates easier looks for his teammates than any past player in history, he doesn't dominate the ball which allows his teammates to develop their skillsets and build rhythm, his off-ball activity allows his teammates to work in more space, he fits next to any type of offensive player seamlessly without crippling their skillsets.

If Barnes stays in GS, I don't think Curry sees another title

Based on what, exactly? And what relevance does this have in the argument?

ISO heavy offensive anchors have done a whole lot of winning in the last 25 years but let yall tell it pace and space is the end all be all and not just another brand of ball

The problem with this is, we've never seen a player like Curry before. He's broken all conventional wisdom around basketball. You can't go on what's been happened in the past, if a player comes along and ends up being a more effective offensive anchor.

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

They’re a well coached team who move the ball exceptionally well. Quite literally the only team in the league with guys who can shoot, dribble and pass at 1-5.

I’ve seen Curry against physical defenses and double teams. It’s not pretty. His handle gets shaky and his decision making leads to numerous turnovers. He knows his limitations which is why he rarely attacks doubles and opts to play off the ball while waiting to get open or get a favorable switch. He benefits from having offense all over the floor which prevents teams from being able to double him full time, the biggest risk they’ll ever take is hedging/quickly blitzing off the PnR. He’s a tremendous player but if you threw him on a shooter-less, poorly coached team like Milwaukee tomorrow in place of Giannis they’d be worse.

All you have to do is watch how Kyrie had to work to score against GS versus how Curry did against Boston. shyt is night and day.

Truth be told for as great as Curry is he probably has more “shyt the bed” games against elite competition than any other superstar in the league currently. I mean he gets taken out of games against good comp fairly regularly, Houston being the most recent.

I'm not even going to post a proper response to this. Lord have mercy.

 

[360Waves]

I'm not even going to post a proper response to this. Lord have mercy.

 

[High quality poster]

So Kobe and wade playing with Shaq is not a benefit

Kobes numbers and overall accomplishments are far greater post Shaq tho.

 

[Poitier]

Except, Curry is great at scoring on and off-ball.

Great off ball, only good on ball.

I don't see the sense in valuing an ISO player over one who uses all his abilities to generate offense for himself and for his team

Truly elite ISO guys will get a solid scoring opportunity against pretty much any defense where as a guy like Curry has warts that are more exploitable.

I regularly hear folks talking about x-player makes his teammates better, when it doesn't make any sense, because they don't. Curry's practically the only player who that applies to: he generates easier looks for his teammates than any past player in history, he doesn't dominate the ball which his teammates to develop their skillsets and build rhythm, his off-ball activity allows his teammates to work in more space, he fits next to any type of offensive player seamlessly without crippling their skillsets.

This is all cool and reasons why Curry is Curry but........I just like game buster ISO ability which also result in many of the things you've listed as benefits of Curry's abilities over the flexibility that comes with elite off ball play.

At the end of the day, you win titles because of your best guys....not the role players you generate looks for.

The problem with this is, we've never seen a player like Curry before. He's broken all conventional wisdom around basketball. You can't go on what's been happened in the past, if a player comes along and ends up being a more effective offensive anchor.

Curry has only anchored one title and Kyrie was hurt.

 

[TheNig]

Face guard Steph and he goes from a good not elite ISO player to a below average one unlike Harden, Kyrie or even Westbrook/Lebron.

Doesn't have incredible versatility outside of scoring and his off ball scoring is heavily reliant on screening and other playmakers.

Porous defender even when engaged.

Makes tons of careless passes despite the "creativity."

Comparing his gravity to Shaq is laughable when only one of them is a legit offensive anchor and has FMVPs.

You got box score nerds then you got people who actually understand and watch the game so they can contextualize stats.

Steph Curry is a front runner who pads stats after his teammates build leads during the later rounds of the playoffs.

That hater shyt again...

 

[steph_harden]

At what point did you realize that what you just posted was just a bunch of nonsense?

I suggest you don't even bother posting in this thread breh. Your Curry stanism is too great to have an objective conversation on this topic

Just keep quiet and continue negging the posts that hurt your feelings ole hoe ass

 

[Gil Scott-Heroin]

I suggest you don't even bother posting in this thread breh.

Gladly.

I don't wanna get my shoes covered in filth.

 

[steph_harden]

Gladly.

I don't wanna get my shoes covered in filth.

nikka most of your posts are covered in filth...you're a troll and the biggest Curry Stan at the same damn time. You can't have an objective conversation here

Ole Klye lowry loving ass nikka

 

[steph_harden]

I am talking about on defense...

Kobe's and Wade's defense isn't that valuable...

No smart and forward thinking coach is looking at Curry vs. Wade and being like..."Well Wade plays better defense, so I'll take Wade..."

Depends on roster tho. If you're drafting in a vacuum and your team lacks talent are you really gonna draft Curry over Wade? Wade impacts both sides...and not just regular "impact" I mean you're gonna get elite offense and defense. Wade can literally anchor your defense. But you would still rather draft Curry?

Curry is on the perfect rooster that accentuates his talents and blends his weaknesses. Not saying he's not great, but I'm saying he's being overrated

 

[steph_harden]

Reputation is all that seems to matter. All of the hard evidence says that Kobe was only a plus defender very early in his career (when he earned that reputation).

For most of his career, his primary contribution to the defensive end was that his presence in the lineup usually meant more minutes for a defensive specialist who was offensively challenged.

Kobe stopped playing D around 09 would u agree? That's still a decade of elite defense. Can't say the same for Steph

 

[Cynical Thoughts]

You really are a special type of smart dumb.

The term "gravity" in basketball has been used before that gravity score stat was in the rotation. When folks talk about Curry's gravity, they're talking about the pull he has on defenses as a whole, i.e. when he's dribbling into the halfcourt and three defenders come off their assignment and come in proximity to Curry's shooting or lane space, because of his handle and range on his shot. It's not just saying "defenders stay close to good shooters".

Oh, that was you?