Test Pilot Admits the F-35 Can’t Dogfight

[Vandelay]

Tactics of combat changed significantly since the A-10 was created and the armed forces are trying to streamline their arsenal.

Making a bunch of planes for specific missions costs more than one or two fighters that can perform well for multiple mission objectives.

All boils down to economics from what I remember while stationed in CA.​

I would just think, why spend the additional money...in this case a trillion, for the r&d for a new fighter when you have planes already, that while not as capable can do the same thing. All you are doing is spending money on the maintenance, training, and storage; which has to be a thousand times cheaper. Especially when we aren't really dogfighting other countries anymore.

 

[Vandelay]

I thought the F35 wasn't even supposed to dogfight

I'm sure it's a multi-role fighter; fighting, bombing, attacking, reconnaissance, etc...but it's just bloated unnecessary spending at this point.

You can invest in unmanned drones and use our existing aircraft in the interim.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

I would just think, why spend the additional money...in this case a trillion, for the r&d for a new fighter when you have planes already, that while not as capable can do the same thing. All you are doing is spending money on the maintenance, training, and storage; which has to be a thousand times cheaper. Especially when we aren't really dogfighting other countries anymore.

You must understand Cold War thinking.

Its the same reason why Russia keeps flying sorties over the arctic and testing response times.

If they EVER catch you slipping, they'll pull your card.

You MUST continue to be bigger or better or else you'll lose that advantage.

Look at Ukraine. The moment the USA decided not to fully intervene, neighboring nations felt like NATO was full of shyt and would never truly have their backs. Poland and Lithuania were talking super reckless until the US sent reserves out there for "training"

 

[ORDER_66]

What a waste of time and money... millions to make some superplane shyt turns out to be garbage..

 

[Vandelay]

You must understand Cold War thinking.

Its the same reason why Russia keeps flying sorties over the arctic and testing response times.

If they EVER catch you slipping, they'll pull your card.

You MUST continue to be bigger or better or else you'll lose that advantage.

Look at Ukraine. The moment the USA decided not to fully intervene, neighboring nations felt like NATO was full of shyt and would never truly have their backs. Poland and Lithuania were talking super reckless until the US sent reserves out there for "training"

i reedited my post. No definitely, I understand military spending is the equivalent of bragging on our dikk to opposing countries, I'm just saying it's not a dogfighting world anymore, with the exception of a few scenarios.

I'd rather they said a trillion got spent on unmanned aircraft or something else in the realm of necessity, rather than something as antiquated as fighter jets.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

i reedited my post. No definitely, I understand military spending is the equivalent of bragging on our dikk to opposing countries, I'm just saying it's not a dogfighting word...I'd rather a trillion get spent on unmanned aircraft or something else in the realm of necessity, rather than something as antiquated as fighter jets.

I think this is why this will take a while to truly happen:

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

What a waste of time and money... millions to make some superplane shyt turns out to be garbage..

At least the rest of the world knows the USA will use 'em

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

I would just think, why spend the additional money...in this case a trillion, for the r&d for a new fighter when you have planes already, that while not as capable can do the same thing. All you are doing is spending money on the maintenance, training, and storage; which has to be a thousand times cheaper. Especially when we aren't really dogfighting other countries anymore.

The answer is actually easy: The Department of Defense's main purpose during peace-time is buying and testing new technology. Don't know how old you are, but back when Reagan was the Pres, I recall some type of scandal involving $1,000 toilet seats bought by the DoD amongst other.......odd......purchases.
​

 

[Vandelay]

The answer is actually easy: The Department of Defense's main purpose during peace-time is buying and testing new technology. Don't know how old you are, but back when Reagan was the Pres, I recall some type of scandal involving $1,000 toilet seats bought by the DoD amongst other.......odd......purchases.
​

31...I'm aware but I was a kid.

There's a joke on Independence Day that Jeff Goldblums father makes, you don't think they're (the government) is paying 25,000 dollars for a hammer, or 60,000 for a toilet, in reference to Area 51 spending and executive plausible deniability.

Every entity with an open wallet gets charged out the ass for expenses...my company, gets these outrageous consulting fees for work that the standard corporate team does on a daily basis...

Do I think the F-35 actually cost a trillion dollars, no...but when they see it's taking 15+ years and the costs are overrunning the value, it's time to pull the plug.

 

[Tony D'Amato]

This is not on the department of defense. Its on congress. Its amazing how little blame congress ever gets.

 

[theworldismine13]

Pentagon Defends F-35 After Report Says it Can't Dogfight | Military.com http://mil-com.me/1HDp2f6

 

[Dafunkdoc_Unlimited]

This is not on the department of defense. Its on congress. Its amazing how little blame congress ever gets.

I think that's because Congress doesn't buy the stuff, just approves the DoD's budget.

I do agree that Congress should shoulder the majority of the blame, however, since they just give the DoD a blank check without stipulating (enough) that the money should be spent responsibly.

The DoD is like a single-parent on welfare using an EBT card to buy PS4 games and Electronic Cigarettes instead of diapers and food for their kids.​

 

[Originalman]

Skunkworks

Not skunk works that is Lockheed Martin. It was made by Grumman which was bought out by Northrop in the 90s.

The Mig-25 fox bat scared the shyt out of the US when they saw it. They knew they needed something go compete with it. Plus they knew the F-1111 their best fighter could not fukk with the mig-25 foxbat.

 

[Originalman]

I'm sure it's a multi-role fighter; fighting, bombing, attacking, reconnaissance, etc...but it's just bloated unnecessary spending at this point.

You can invest in unmanned drones and use our existing aircraft in the interim.

The drone technology isn't up to speed yet where they can have them as fighters. We are a way from that point. They have tried to hold off on the 5th generation fighters but this stuff is a kat and mouse game. With China and Russia working on building their 5th generation fighter the US would be behind in technology if they did not try to build 5th generation fighters as well.

Constantly building new generation fighters is how you keep you air superiority.

Now I am not gonna say I don't agree with the over spending. But history shows these planes (especially stealth) always go over budget. Even our non allies like China and Russia go over budget with their planes.

 

[Originalman]

I thought the F35 wasn't even supposed to dogfight

Yeah but pilots will tell you they always want maneuverability because this is the most important thing in combat. These pilots are saying they get 4 times as many kills with a F-22 as they can an F-14 or F-16.

If the F-35 is not dog fighting ready they can make modifications and update the fly by wire software.