what would a top 5 list in 1994 look like?

[BmoreGorilla]

Breh, being mid 20's in the 90's was not considered old age for rappers. Not everybody in the game was dropping debuts at age 18-20 like Nas, Kast, or Bone. A lot of them were in their mid-20's or bordering on it.

Yes most of them were mostly 18-20. Some like Mobb Deep were still in hs. The highest age you might see was 22 which was how old Big and Redman were when their debuts dropped. But they'd been around the game for a while

 

[Wacky D]

if I can rewind this thread a bit; the whole point of this age argument was because of 2pac retro-stanning.

I think it was @BmoreGorilla who said that pac's acting & controversies extended pac's rap career past his 3rd release, and @JustCKing wasn't trying to hear it.

its true tho. 3 albums in 4 years. none of the albums were classics or moved the needle. one single-driven album crept to platinum. these are the characteristics of a standard successful rapper that's off the label after 3 joints.

shoot, 2pac himself was ready to quit rapping until "I get around" blew up.

 

[BmoreGorilla]

if I can rewind this thread a bit; the whole point of this age argument was because of 2pac retro-stanning.

I think it was @BmoreGorilla who said that pac's acting & controversies extended pac's rap career past his 3rd release, and @JustCKing wasn't trying to hear it.

its true tho. 3 albums in 4 years. none of the albums were classics or moved the needle. one single-driven album crept to platinum. these are the characteristics of a standard successful rapper that's off the label after 3 joints.

shoot, 2pac himself was ready to quit rapping until "I get around" blew up.

I remember Pac's career like it was yesterday. He was never mentioned with the top MCs in real time. Some of his music was dope but when he was talked about his music came second.
Which is why it was hilarious when he died and some of my own friends acted like they were life long fans. Yet they didn't own any Pac albums

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

Nobody said Nas did anything new btw. But there's a reason documentaries have been made on this album. If you didn't like it that's cool. But clearly the album left a mark on the culture
I guess it was bias when Ice Cube and Outkast got 5 mics as well

Lmao so nas did nothing,new and flopped but it left it's mark.
Sounds like fabrication to me. East coast bias media definitely did it's job.
You dont wanna play the 5 mic challenge with me. Too easy. If you persists i'll shut you down though. Just let me know if you really want that.

 

[Wacky D]

I remember Pac's career like it was yesterday. He was never mentioned with the top MCs in real time. Some of his music was dope but when he was talked about his music came second.
Which is why it was hilarious when he died and some of my own friends acted like they were life long fans. Yet they didn't own any Pac albums

exactly.

I mean, I give him credit for 95-96, and what would've been the layover in '97.

but 91-94, he was a controversial mid-carder. like the ron artest of the rap game.

 

[BmoreGorilla]

Lmao so nas did nothing,new and flopped but it left it's mark.
Sounds like fabrication to me. East coast bias media definitely did it's job.
You dont wanna play the 5 mic challenge with me. Too easy. If you persists i'll shut you down though. Just let me know if you really want that.

How didn't it leave a mark when its had documentaries made?

 

[BmoreGorilla]

exactly.

I mean, I give him credit for 95-96, and what would've been the layover in '97.

but 91-94, he was a controversial mid-carder. like the ron artest of the rap game.

Lmao Ron Artest is the perfect comparison

 

[daze23]

it's hard to separate 2pac's music from the drama. a lot of the hype around Me Against The World was because he was locked up

 

[BmoreGorilla]

it's hard to separate 2pac's music from the drama. a lot of the hype around Me Against The World was because he was locked up

This

 

[JustCKing]

Yes most of them were mostly 18-20. Some like Mobb Deep were still in hs. The highest age you might see was 22 which was how old Big and Redman were when their debuts dropped. But they'd been around the game for a while

That really wasn't most. Craig Mack, Warren G, Jeru The Damaja, and O.C. were out of the 18-20 range when they dropped and that's just '94.

 

[JustCKing]

I remember Pac's career like it was yesterday. He was never mentioned with the top MCs in real time. Some of his music was dope but when he was talked about his music came second.
Which is why it was hilarious when he died and some of my own friends acted like they were life long fans. Yet they didn't own any Pac albums

That is not true. Much of the controversy surrounding Pac came from his music.

 

[BmoreGorilla]

That is not true. Much of the controversy surrounding Pac came from his music.

The man caught a rape charge, licked shots at cops, and got locked up. How could his music be more controversial than that?

 

[Wacky D]

That really wasn't most. Craig Mack, Warren G, Jeru The Damaja, and O.C. were out of the 18-20 range when they dropped and that's just '94.

not sure about Jeru, but the rest of them were around for years before their 1st album.

and warren g was more of a DJ/producer on top of that.

I said that because nobody bothered to respond to your mention of scarface, and you kept bringing him up. I'm just saving you time.​

@JustCKing

i'll say this much about scarface.

face looking like he was 40, is one of the reasons why he wasn't such a hot-topic.

 

[bigbadbossup2012]

1.Wrong it's actually a great comparison. It was immediately following two back to back albums just like predator followed two back to back classics. You wasnt even alive when "black Michael jackson" was dropping albums lil nikka. You dont even know that experience. Like I said,despite Bad not being thriller and Predator not being death certificate,both were classics. NOTHING in your response negates that. You lose

2.You said Predator was NOT a top tier album of 1992.
("1.the predator was a few steps down from his previous albums.

2.and also not on par with the top-tier albums of the time."
http://www.thecoli.com/goto/post?id=28855478#post-28855478 )
You seemed pretty sure of yourself. I asked you what albums were above it and why/how so AND YOU COULDN'T ANSWER. You just continue to spin instead of BACKING UP WHAT YOU SAID. You lose again

3.I didnt miss anything,you were on your hating on THE PREDATOR album bullshyt,
(3.the predator being his most successful elbum is the reason why ice cube's legacy is so underrated actually.
http://www.thecoli.com/goto/post?id=28855478#post-28855478 )

Blaming The predator being a better success at retail for people underrating Cube.Citing that people would be more prone to go back to predator vs DC when they checked out cube.. It was a back handed compliment to Ice cube and also a bullshyt excuse for why Cube being underrated. When in reality,cube is underrated for the same reason EVERY west coast artist is underrated. I challenged your bullshyt theory BY ASKING WOULD PEOPLE WHOM DONT KNOW NASIR'S MUSIC,GO BACK TO THE ALBUMS THAT SOLD MORE THAN ILLMATIC? You lose



5.Why lie,when you know i'm going to son you with proof?
. You claim,IN THIS THREAD HE WAS TALKING ABOUT BONE'S INFLUENCE ON URBAN CULTURE (not hiphop culture like YOU CLAIM he was doing in the other thread,),when clear as day,he's right here talking about skills etc IN THIS VERY THREAD "Bizzy and crazy was regarded as way more skilled than Pac or snoop, breh." http://www.thecoli.com/goto/post?id=28748911#post-28748911
You lose again

6.And here you go ducking again. nikka if you really meant what you said: "krayzie & bizzy were clearly better lyricists than pac & snoop from day one breh. it doesn't take a full LP release to realize that." http://www.thecoli.com/goto/post?id=28855478#post-28855478
Why is it so hard for you to back it up? It's simple. Them dudes got 5/6 verses tops,on CREEPIN ON AH COME UP. Drop some of the ones that TOTALLY eclipse what pac and snoop did from 91'/92' through 94' on the microphone. GO!
You got Ohhla,you got rap genius etc. It;s not hard, if you really stand behind what you said.

So they need to outshine
The Chronic
Doggystyle
Murder was the case (not every song obviously)
Above the Rim (not every song obviously)
2pacalypse now
S4MN
Thuglife







8/9. This where you got it twisted. Those that oppose me on this subject are "comparing 6 months to 16 months" etc. I'm just holding the mirror a lil closer to them and putting a lil windex on it,so they can see clearly that they're wrong.
I didnt make the rules nor did i create this topic. Which is who were looking like top 5 through 1994. The argument is NOT which album was bigger from the beginning to the end of their sales run. The argument is whom did what through 1994. The winner of that argument is Snoop D.O. double G. over Bone. Bringing up what they did after 1994 is a whole different argument. Bringing up which album had a better run in it's totality is also a different argument. You and your daddy art lose again.

10.You jumped in and should of stayed in your lane.

11.a Anybody knows Creepin on ah come up was bigger than any 2pac album up to that point. However Krayzie and Bizzy were not clearly not big as 2pac in 1994 at all. (which was his argument) And personally i dont believe the group as a whole was bigger than 2pac in his totality.

11.B Nonsense. That thuglife tattoo,which made it's debut in 1993 is probably the most famous tattoo on any rapper and has been since it's inception. Also 2pac is responsible for popularizing tattoos amongst (non gang member) black people. I personally saw groups of dudes walking around with shaved heads,pac styled scarfs and tee shirts saying thug 4 life in 1995. Also there's a reason Mobb and Nas were adlibing "thuglife we still living it" in 1995.


11.C Illmatic was pumped up in the media. It flopped. And it wasnt running shyt outside the east

In closing,stay in a lil lame nikkas place and study this shyt before you step to someone as knowledgeable as me. #levels
#youWERENTthere
#whoRAISEDyou

this is too much. and half of it is stuff that I wasn't even arguing about.

1.) I was a fanatic of Michael Jackson in the '80s actually. I was CLEARLY referencing THE REAL O.G. mike jack fans that grew up on the Jackson five in real-time. they generally didn't care for their albums like that.
you exposed your hand by trying to bring up my age, seeing that you weren't even alive to be mentioned with the market that I'm referring to(and I can tell that you weren't raised up under the thurl types, so don't bother exposing yourself with a response). we already know that you use the age thing as a crutch. thanks for providing concrete evidence.

2.) I said predator wasn't on par with the top albums when it was out in terms of quality, and you wanted me to list every albums that was better, along with a reason for each. I could've listed the albums, but once you added all that extra chit, I passed.

3.) how does me saying that ice cube's legacy is underrated, translate into me hating?

5.) what do I have to lie about?? that's yall argument not mines. I was just tryna translate for you. leave me alone with this bullchit.

6.) what part of my last two responses to this did you not understand??

8/9.) more chit that was never my argument. the f*ck is wrong wit you?

11.) in other words, he had a nice tattoo, and got sneak-dissed by mob deep.

at some point, you have to come to grips with the fact that youre a suburban backwoods bama who calls himself "bigbadbossup".
go hashtag that.

1. So basically you werent alive when Black Michael Jackson was dropping albums,like i said. Meanwhile i was,like i said.
Also BAD was a classic in real time despite that whitened skin backlash or the increased talks of him being a "faq".

2.Basically you were shook and knew you were in over your head debating with BigBad. Cool,just stay in a lil nikkas place,and you good. You dont know you cant back up what you said. But you rather front,than blatantly wave that white flag. It's cool,whisper to your corner to STOP THE FIGHT,so you can save face.
Saying THE PREDATOR is not a top tier album in 1992 is easy till bigbad challenges you to name the ones that are and why. Then you act like it's too much work,despite all the other work you're doing typing the other shyt you're typing in here. Lol,weak ass lil nikkas dont know my culture.

3.Blaming THE PREDATOR's success (another classic) for people underrating Ice Cube is THE HATE,stop acting like a bytch.

5.So instead of admitting you're wrong,"it's not your argument". You basically dont want to look anymore stupid than you already do,by cosigning untrue nonsense as if it's real. Stay in your lane next time,if you gon go out like that.


6.
And here you go ducking YET again. nikka if you really meant what you said: "krayzie & bizzy were clearly better lyricists than pac & snoop from day one breh. it doesn't take a full LP release to realize that." http://www.thecoli.com/goto/post?id=28855478#post-28855478
Why is it so hard for you to back it up? It's simple. Them dudes got 5/6 verses tops,on CREEPIN ON AH COME UP. Drop some of the ones that TOTALLY eclipse what pac and snoop did from 91'/92' through 94' on the microphone. GO!
You got Ohhla,you got rap genius etc. It;s not hard, if you really stand behind what you said.

So they need to outshine
The Chronic
Doggystyle
Murder was the case (not every song obviously)
Above the Rim (not every song obviously)
2pacalypse now
S4MN
Thuglife



nikkaS STAY DUCKING AND HIDING LKE MICE.

8/9. It wasn't your argument? nikka you jumped in and cosigned,you made it YOUR ARGUMENT as much as the nikka you was riding for,dont back down now p*ssy boy.

Your first response to me on this exact subject was:

he said bar-for-bar, they were better than pac & snoop, and that they were bigger draws.

krayzie & bizzy were clearly better lyricists than pac & snoop from day one breh. it doesn't take a full LP release to realize that.

and yea, they were WAY BIGGER draws than 2pac.
snoop is arguable. it depends on how you look at it. they had similar success to snoop, based on just two songs without a huge machine push and with barely any public appearances, as opposed to snoop who had over 2 years of endless hype, coupled with endless amounts of controversty - including a murder trial. http://www.thecoli.com/posts/28855478/


I debunked that bullshyt:
5.That's his opinion,one that he's entitled to,that i dont agree with. My problem,is that he acts as if this was a consensus opinion in 1994,which is just a lie. This was not the talk AT ALL. Your'e 5/6 years younger than me and i think me and dude about the same age. I'll charge your viewpoint to ignorance,but @Art Barr aint getting off so easy. Do your research @Wacky D before you start taking all that E-cock in the mizzzouth. This dude previously said that bone wasnt recognized as dope till 1995.Now he's acting like they were getting major props in 1994 and known as great. I took those quotes and placed them in this thread (go look nikka). He never addressed his inconsistent bullshyt and you in here backing him up lmao.

6.Please post some of those lyrics that back up this statement you made. Lyrics that totally eclipse everything Snoop and Pac did from their inception through 1994.

So they need to outshine
The Chronic
Doggystyle
Murder was the case (not every song obviously)
Above the Rim (not every song obviously)
2pacalypse now
S4MN
Thuglife

Good luck nikka.

7.Bizzy nor Krayzie were bigger than pac in 1994.
In case you skimmed through,dude said bizzy and Krayzie were bigger than pac and snoop,(with heavy emphasis on bizzy) Claiming people wanted to be bizzy,devante etc in 1994.

Through 1994 Pac had 3 albums out including thuglife.
Plus starred in Juice,Poetic Justice with Janet Jackson,Above the Rim.
Plus all his features and controversy.
(Remember this is them as individuals,not the group as a whole vs Pac)

8.Snoop had Deep Cover, the Chronic appearances,Doggystyle
Murder was the case which was the movie and SDTK headed by him. Plus above the rim appearances
plus his own controversy.
In no form shape or fashion were they bigger than or big as Snoop in 1994. Not even the group as a whole was on snoop's level.

9.No they did not. They sold 2 mil through 1994. Snoop sold 4 mil of his own album by the end of 1994. .

We kept going back and forth till we got here,where you're now trying to distance yourself from this topic,cause you look stupid. Cant be a "Culture King" when you really dont know the culture,history etc.

11. You're wrong about that thuglife shyt,you know it,but it hurts to show it. I get it.I forgive your weak ass for not knowing this shyt for real

 

[JustCKing]

The man caught a rape charge, licked shots at cops, and got locked up. How could his music be more controversial than that?

Quayle called on the Time Warner Inc. subsidiary, Interscope Records, to withdraw the album "2pacalypse Now" by rap artist Tupac Amaru Shakur from stores. Quayle charged that the record was responsible for the death of a Texas state trooper, who was shot to death in April by a suspect who allegedly was listening to the album on the tape deck of a stolen truck when he was stopped by the officer.

Ronald Ray Howard, 19, is being held on murder charges in Edna, Tex., in the death of Bill Davidson, 43, who was shot after pulling Howard over to issue a traffic ticket.

The trooper's family has filed a civil suit against Shakur and Interscope, claiming the record's violence-laden lyrics incite "imminent lawless action."

Quayle Calls for Pulling Rap Album Tied to Murder Case