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he's better than kd
Would ROOKIE Michael Jordan be the best player today?
- Thread starter stepbackj34spud
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stepbackj34spud
Top 75 All-Time
:umadduncan: Not if I neg you first.
Somebody neg this fool.
I still consider MJ to be one of the top 3 players ever.
But Lebron James has a very strong case to push his way into that conversation.
All I'm saying is, the discussion is worth having.
High quality poster
Veteran
Rookie Mike is Averaging 30 on 50%. Tahm bout his shot as if Lebron can shoot?
As if Westbrook can shoot?
Imagine MJ coming off screens in todays NBA where they can't lay a finger on you.Washed up Bean just left with a 60 point performance, A young MJ would probably get that every night
Art Barr
INVADING SOHH CHAMPION
28ppg/7rpg/6apg/5apg/2spg 52FG%
Forget the stats for a minute.. I was watching some rookie MJ highlights..
Has anybody ever displayed this kind of skill as a rookie? Jesus! The move he put on Bernard king at 8:22 was
I cant believe MJ was this good coming out of college.
Would you put rookie MJ over Steph and Bron? Where would he rank?
When he was drafted he was the best player in the league and in college everyone was on notice.
That you knew as soon as he hit the NBA and was away from dean shackling mj to a team concept.
Mj, was going to go hog wild and dominate on the pro level.
The rings argument imo was crafted to limit the reach of mj's draw as the best player in the league.
So, mike purposefully set out to demolish the ring argument.
To beat the pr critics at their own parallel of thinking in the journalism game.
Early Jordan every night demonstrated the highest IQ and skill of any skilled basketball player in history.
Jordan also had every layuo under duress down to an actual textbook demonstrated moveset.
That he made circuss shots with routine technical skill and application.
under complete duress and gain separation and demonstrated the technical execution and know how.
to hit any shot under duress.
No player in history had exact technical know how on how to hit every shyt under duress after Contact like mike.
Mike would have averaged, more than thirty nine to forty two points a game in this weak ass center deficient and no Hand check climate.
Art Barr
Art Barr
The combination of the post game, the driving ability finishing with either hand, the jump shot, and the defense make Mike the most TECHNICALLY gifted basketball player that ever lived. He would've been great in any era, especially this one we're in right now.
Alot of players are more physically gifted than Mike (Bron, Shaq etc) but none of them played the game as well. It ain't just the rings, jordan was just better than everybody else
Alot of players are more physically gifted than Mike (Bron, Shaq etc) but none of them played the game as well. It ain't just the rings, jordan was just better than everybody else
Somebody neg this fool.
I think Jordan is still clearly better (If Jordan is a hundred, Lebron is like a 90) but Lebron probably does have GOAT-tier impact on the court. His durability, talent, and all around ability sets him apart. To me, Lebron's ability to fill any hole and do it at an elite level is just otherworldly.
He can be the best playmaker, rebounder, scorer, defensive anchor, or whatever a team needs to be a winner. Miami Heat needed an inside presence to make up for their lack of size and rebounding so Lebron became the quasi-big and had Shaq-lite impact. Cleveland needed playmaking and consistency so Lebron became Magic-lite.
I just rarely see dudes who can affect the game in so many ways. Lebron can be the best scorer, playmaker, or defender depending on what your team needs which is just amazing to me.
You're a Pierce fan so I know you can respect that. Pierce had the same ability to be whatever a team needed to be a winning team.
I agree with most of this but I think Lebron's true "technical" ability is his ability to spot or predict breakdowns in team defenses, his situational awareness, and his basketball mind.
Its like Lebron sees plays develop before everyone else and he's been like that since he was young. This comparison sounds stupid but if Jordan was the greatest basketball warrior ever and Magic was the greatest basketball general ever, I think Lebron is like a diet version of both of them (Not quite the tactician or not quite the warrior) but given supreme and GOAT-tier athletic ability.
onelastdeath
Banned
I feel the same. Lebron's impact is undeniable. Jordan never took bad teams as far as Lebron did. Ever.
Jordan has more first round losses than Bron as well.
I'm not trying to throw shade on Jordan.
It's possible a prime Jordan in this era might even be more impressive. How much more is up for debate.
But I've read some things in recent weeks about Lebron James that has made me reconsider just how great he really is.
Is Prime Lebron better than Prime Jordan? I don't know. And probably not.
But I do think it's now a legitimate question.
It's unpopular for a reason. It's not a discussion that anyone who actually saw prime Mike would take seriously. I'm a Lebron fan but he's a clear notch below Mike. It's not really close. A prime Mike would be even better in this league than he was in his.
Another stat boy.
at a rookie Mike having a "limited" jumper. If rookie Mike's midrange J was "limited" then current Lebron's midrange is completely broken because rookie Mike's midrange jumper was better than Lebron's is right now. Lebron just averaged 25 for the year on 52% with an inconsistent jumper and only 73% from the line. There's no reason to think that a rookie Mike wouldn't score just as well(even better I say) in this league than he did in '84. The advantages that Lebron have over rookie Mike as a player are the all around aspects. Scoring isn't one of them tho.This was an early regular season game tho. We see laughably bad defense and offense on the biggest stages nowadays. That's why the league shattered the record for blowouts in this year's playoffs. Go back and look at the last 4 minutes of game 7 and pay attention to how shytty the offenses of the two best teams in the league was. shyt was joke, just like most of the play during the playoffs. Low quality shyt.
High quality poster
Veteran
And where exactly did Lebron ever lead a bad team to?
You understand Mike had to get through Legendary teams every year. Not just decent teams. 07 the Cavs faced a weary Pistons team that had been in the conference finals 4 straight years, they were bound to lose eventually.
Other than that year Bron was getting bounced out the playoffs until he went to Miami.
Bron over thinks at times tho where as Magic and Jordan were more confident in their ability to take over a game.
If I had to compare Lebron to a Marvel character it'd be Gladiator
Gladiator (Kallark) - Marvel Universe Wiki: The definitive online source for Marvel super hero bios.
Lebron is a great floor general at times but he also has moments where he's trying too hard to get the ball to someone else when the right play would've been to score the ball himself. That's where his bb IQ is lacking imo, he doesn't have confidence in himself at times which leads to him doing stupid shyt on the floor.
He made great strides in this year's finals of overcoming that, but he still showed flashes of being unsure of himself in games 1-4.
onelastdeath
Banned
How many of Jordans 6 rings came against as good as last years 73 win warriors?And where exactly did Lebron ever lead a bad team to?
You understand Mike had to get through Legendary teams every year. Not just decent teams. 07 the Cavs faced a weary Pistons team that had been in the conference finals 4 straight years, they were bound to lose eventually.
Other than that year Bron was getting bounced out the playoffs until he went to Miami.
@Gravity
I saw Michael Jordan play. He was amazing.
But I think 3 things make the comparison to Lebron James difficult:
1. They're 2 different types of players playing different positions.
2. The aesthetics of Jordan's game is more pleasing for a lot of people. That people fell in love with Jordan's acrobatics sometimes makes people forget that points are points. Assists are assists, etc..
3. Lebron's mistakes are more seriously ridiculed than Jordan's, which can lead to a sort of bias. What did Jordan really do that people did not like? Probably nothing on the court. But his "Republicans buy sneakers too" was one of them. I think for Lebron, there's "The Decision" and his apparent flopping. There are a lot of people who don't like Lebron for a number of indescribable reasons...which makes them put LBJ down a notch.
You don't want to reduce a player's career to numbers on a page, because greatness involves more than that.
That said, those numbers are closer than people may realize.
I'm not here to argue that Lebron is better than MJ.
But if someone did that...I would understand.
I saw Michael Jordan play. He was amazing.
But I think 3 things make the comparison to Lebron James difficult:
1. They're 2 different types of players playing different positions.
2. The aesthetics of Jordan's game is more pleasing for a lot of people. That people fell in love with Jordan's acrobatics sometimes makes people forget that points are points. Assists are assists, etc..
3. Lebron's mistakes are more seriously ridiculed than Jordan's, which can lead to a sort of bias. What did Jordan really do that people did not like? Probably nothing on the court. But his "Republicans buy sneakers too" was one of them. I think for Lebron, there's "The Decision" and his apparent flopping. There are a lot of people who don't like Lebron for a number of indescribable reasons...which makes them put LBJ down a notch.
You don't want to reduce a player's career to numbers on a page, because greatness involves more than that.
That said, those numbers are closer than people may realize.
I'm not here to argue that Lebron is better than MJ.
But if someone did that...I would understand.