WSJ article:Science Increasingly Makes the Case for God

[rapbeats]

Eh, it's really pretty far from perfect, depending on your definition. If you mean "habitable", then I'd say it's just a function of the fact that there's countless planets in the universe. Odds are some of them are going to be able to support life.Tardigrades!!

they just told you based on science thats the odds of a planet supporting life, let alone life like ours. Is becoming slimmer and slimmer and slimmer and slimmer as we go along in science. So how long will you still hold on to the idea of randomness when the numbers are showing you that the probability of randomness is getting slimmer and slimmer by nth degree? and dont jump to far and say "which God" thats not the point of this thread. dont jump to "well who created god" thats not the point of the this thread. Its a simple point the title to the thread could've been " The probability of intelligent design behind the universe and earth sustaining life is much much higher then randomness. What part of that can anyone fight with actual facts?

 

[BaldingSoHard]

they just told you based on science thats the odds of a planet supporting life, let alone life like ours. Is becoming slimmer and slimmer and slimmer and slimmer as we go along in science. So how long will you still hold on to the idea of randomness when the numbers are showing you that the probability of randomness is getting slimmer and slimmer by nth degree? and dont jump to far and say "which God" thats not the point of this thread. dont jump to "well who created god" thats not the point of the this thread. Its a simple point the title to the thread could've been " The probability of intelligent design behind the universe and earth sustaining life is much much higher then randomness. What part of that can anyone fight with actual facts?

Sure, the odds are very very very very VERY slim.

But that, times infinity... becomes a certainty.

 

[rapbeats]

This is the entire point.

You can't know whats "random" until you know everything, and the methods they use to assert their "probabilities" aren't determined based on empirical and TOTAL understanding of all the components involved.

You an't just take how many things you know, slap a few fractions around and come up with answers.

Its a perversion of statistics. Take any class on modeling or statistical research.

The flaw is obvious here.

but thats exactly what the "random" of the gaps guys are doing.

Look. We say there's On and Off
White and Black
Light and darkness
1s and 0's

Why did we choose 0's to = Darkness=nothingness?
But then we found out in that darkness, that supposed nothingness in space its actually anti matter. that is something.
Who's to say its not 1's and F's ? We put that 0 there as a place holder.

You put the word "random" there as a place holder. Some put God there. There is no difference.

There has to be something placed in the GAPS. Thats how humans compute things. when we dont know the entire equation we throw something in there so we can complete the equation for the time being until we know more. Some say God will always be in the gaps because he is the equation. Thats something that cant be computed so trying to fight that is silly if you believe it or not. There's nothing to disprove there.

again this article is keeping it simple. They are using probability. and saying based on the probabilities we know today, ODDS ARE its some form of intelligent design going on here. is that GOD from the the bible? Allah? or some 50 foot alien. thats not the point. the point is. some intelligence of some sort PROBABLY, help this thing along. vs Randomness. So just for the sake of this argument and the discussion of probability. we're not talking bible vs ..... we're talking probability. IF in the next 100 years we find 100 planets with life on it, 30 of them with people on them just like us or similar. Then the probability for randomness goes up and the probability for intelligent design goes down BASED on what this article is using. Now if you want to argue with a believer. The truth is , even if you found those planets it wouldnt change the possibility of a designer(s). some being(s) could've just worked on our solar system for all we know. and some other being was tasked with the others, or some being just messed with earth and the rest was nature taking its course. some being could've made the entire thing and decided to include life on other planets. and send a bible down there to little ole earth. perhaps the other planets would have their own bible. these things cant be determined via science. So stick to the article. probability of randomness vs intelligent design.

 

[rapbeats]

Sure, the odds are very very very very VERY slim.

But that, times infinity... becomes a certainty.

lol says who? you just made that one up.

The probability of something occuring twice that you have never seen twice is inaccurate until you see it again(twice).

if i only saw the #1. but never saw the 2. Sure i could run all sorts of probabilities that the #2 is next. but i would never be sure until one day i see the actual #2. We have not seen another earth YET. So any probability that we would is still based on a prayer so to speak. so a hope that there is another planet like ours out there Times infinity does not = its another planet like ours out there. its still wishful thinking until its actually seen OUT THERE.

 

[BaldingSoHard]

lol says who? you just made that one up.

Says who? Says math. And you say that like "making stuff up" is somehow a problem for theists.

The probability of something occuring twice that you have never seen twice is inaccurate until you see it again(twice).

if i only saw the #1. but never saw the 2. Sure i could run all sorts of probabilities that the #2 is next. but i would never be sure until one day i see the actual #2. We have not seen another earth YET. So any probability that we would is still based on a prayer so to speak. so a hope that there is another planet like ours out there Times infinity does not = its another planet like ours out there. its still wishful thinking until its actually seen OUT THERE.

Couldn't be more wrong. The existence of another Earth-like planet has zero to do with our observations of said planet or the fact that we're standing on one; it's Markovian. Either it exists or it doesn't, us knowing about it or not doesn't change a thing.

Unless I misunderstood what you're saying.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

but thats exactly what the "random" of the gaps guys are doing.

Look. We say there's On and Off
White and Black
Light and darkness
1s and 0's

Why did we choose 0's to = Darkness=nothingness?
But then we found out in that darkness, that supposed nothingness in space its actually anti matter. that is something.
Who's to say its not 1's and F's ? We put that 0 there as a place holder.

You put the word "random" there as a place holder. Some put God there. There is no difference.

There has to be something placed in the GAPS. Thats how humans compute things. when we dont know the entire equation we throw something in there so we can complete the equation for the time being until we know more. Some say God will always be in the gaps because he is the equation. Thats something that cant be computed so trying to fight that is silly if you believe it or not. There's nothing to disprove there.

again this article is keeping it simple. They are using probability. and saying based on the probabilities we know today, ODDS ARE its some form of intelligent design going on here. is that GOD from the the bible? Allah? or some 50 foot alien. thats not the point. the point is. some intelligence of some sort PROBABLY, help this thing along. vs Randomness. So just for the sake of this argument and the discussion of probability. we're not talking bible vs ..... we're talking probability. IF in the next 100 years we find 100 planets with life on it, 30 of them with people on them just like us or similar. Then the probability for randomness goes up and the probability for intelligent design goes down BASED on what this article is using. Now if you want to argue with a believer. The truth is , even if you found those planets it wouldnt change the possibility of a designer(s). some being(s) could've just worked on our solar system for all we know. and some other being was tasked with the others, or some being just messed with earth and the rest was nature taking its course. some being could've made the entire thing and decided to include life on other planets. and send a bible down there to little ole earth. perhaps the other planets would have their own bible. these things cant be determined via science. So stick to the article. probability of randomness vs intelligent design.

Its not using probability. Its inferring ambiguity.

Just because we know more, they put their god further beyond the veil where we have yet to reach.

 

[Regular_P]

Eh, it's really pretty far from perfect, depending on your definition. If you mean "habitable", then I'd say it's just a function of the fact that there's countless planets in the universe. Odds are some of them are going to be able to support life.





Tardigrades!!

It isn't Heaven, but it's as good as it's gonna get and provides us everything we need.

 

[BaldingSoHard]

It isn't Heaven, but it's as good as it's gonna get and provides us everything we need.

That's true, but it wasn't always so.

The conditions of life on Earth have changed drastically over the millennia. Shoot, in about 80,000 years, we'll be ice age status again and we'll be very fukked (if we're still stuck here).

So really, what's "perfect" is kind of a matter of perspective, and not really indicative of a design, imo.

 

[rapbeats]

Its not using probability. Its inferring ambiguity.

Just because we know more, they put their god further beyond the veil where we have yet to reach.

no, they are basing it on probability. thats why they are throwing out a few numbers here and there and basing their entire idea on old probabilities that made people think "god is dead" based on the probability that other earths exist.

its not that hard.
before it was .. .Random design wins = More chances of their being an earth out there since what makes a habital earth is X, Y, and Z. That doesnt SEEM like its all that difficult to locate those few elements in space.

now intelligent design wins = more chances of their not being an earth out there since what makes a habital earth is ABC, EFG, H.....so forth and so on.This makes it far far far more less probable that we will ever locate another earth like ours with life, let alone life like ours.

if in 100 years science starts to find earth like planets with life like ours. watch the this entire thing shift back to Randomness wins.

Probability
the quality or fact of being probable.
2.
a strong likelihood or chance of something:
The probability of the book's success makes us optimistic.
3.
a probable event, circumstance, etc.:
Our going to China is a probability.
4.
Statistics.

1. the relative possibility that an event will occur, as expressed by the ratio of the number of actual occurrences to the total number of possible occurrences.
2. the relative frequency with which an event occurs or is likely to occur.

 

[rapbeats]

That's true, but it wasn't always so.

The conditions of life on Earth have changed drastically over the millennia. Shoot, in about 80,000 years, we'll be ice age status again and we'll be very fukked (if we're still stuck here).

So really, what's "perfect" is kind of a matter of perspective, and not really indicative of a design, imo.

how would you know? when was the last time you've seen perfection?

 

[BaldingSoHard]

how would you know? when was the last time you've seen perfection?

Couple weeks ago. Girl from my job. Imo she is 'perfect' (physically) but to a guy who doesn't like black women, she probably isn't. That's why, again, what's "perfect" is a matter of perspective.

 

[☑︎#VoteDemocrat]

no, they are basing it on probability. thats why they are throwing out a few numbers here and there and basing their entire idea on old probabilities that made people think "god is dead" based on the probability that other earths exist.

its not that hard.
before it was .. .Random design wins = More chances of their being an earth out there since what makes a habital earth is X, Y, and Z. That doesnt SEEM like its all that difficult to locate those few elements in space.

now intelligent design wins = more chances of their not being an earth out there since what makes a habital earth is ABC, EFG, H.....so forth and so on.This makes it far far far more less probable that we will ever locate another earth like ours with life, let alone life like ours.

if in 100 years science starts to find earth like planets with life like ours. watch the this entire thing shift back to Randomness wins.

Probability
the quality or fact of being probable.
2.
a strong likelihood or chance of something:
The probability of the book's success makes us optimistic.
3.
a probable event, circumstance, etc.:
Our going to China is a probability.
4.
Statistics.

1. the relative possibility that an event will occur, as expressed by the ratio of the number of actual occurrences to the total number of possible occurrences.
2. the relative frequency with which an event occurs or is likely to occur.

listen to the 12/4/15 Atheist Experience Podcast @ 16 minutes on. http://www.atheist-experience.com/archive/AtheistExp-2015-01-04.mp3

They break down the flaws in your statistical latch onto epistemology with trying to defend theological claims.

This is what we are trying to get you to understand.

 

[killacal]

Sure, the odds are very very very very VERY slim.

But that, times infinity... becomes a certainty.

You got the brightest minds in science giving into ID because the math doesn't work but its a certainty huh

You should hit up nasa with your post and tell them to keep at it because you say so breh

 

[BaldingSoHard]

You got the brightest minds in science giving into ID because the math doesn't work but its a certainty huh

No, they aren't.

You should hit up nasa with your post and tell them to keep at it because you say so breh

They're already on it, breh.

 

[rapbeats]

listen to the 12/4/15 Atheist Experience Podcast @ 16 minutes on. http://www.atheist-experience.com/archive/AtheistExp-2015-01-04.mp3

They break down the flaws in your statistical latch onto epistemology with trying to defend theological claims.

This is what we are trying to get you to understand.

ay dont try to fill me up with that atheist nonsense talking about start at 16. stop it. what we're talking about started a bit after 16. but anyway, the guy was saying exactly what i've been saying. there's gaps to be filled but with what? some say God some say randomness.

if we're going to hold onto filling said gaps with "randomness did it" then the God gappers are saying based on the same probability that the randomness folks are using the numbers are leaning a lot less towards randomness and since we're talking randomness vs God(intelligent design). then it of course leans more toward God..based on probability of today's science.

now like i said earlier, truth is neither side will know the truth until another earth is produced...or Not. as far as using probability. someone in here said probability of something happening x infinite= it will happen at some point. and i said no it wont if it has never happened before. what are you basing your probability on in reality? a guess, a hope, and a prayer.

that has not changed. so right now we're arguing over semantics. so i kept the argument within the semantics pararmeters. and said fine, its random vs God based on the same type of science probability that help write that article in the 60's that said no more god. thats what this is article is about. nothing more and nothing less. i think you guys are so use to arguing atheist vs believers. you dont realize thats not really the argument of the article. i said it before its not that hard to get. you guys think its a loss for you to concede this one. but in reality you should concede on this one.